|
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 20 2009, 1:13pm
Post #1 of 18
(2155 views)
Shortcut
|
|
FOTR~EE~Appendices Discussion: Book to Script ~ Words Into Images
|
Can't Post
|
|
Making Words Into Images
Part One Visualizing the Story - Storyboards
Where is this Chapter on the Lord of the Rings Special Extended Edition?
Choose Movie Box: Fellowship of The Ring.
Choose Disc: Fellowship of the Ring - The Appendices: Part One: From Book To Script.
(It’s the 3rd disc in the box set)
Go put the DVD on J
The Menu will appear: From Book To Script (and the page will turn)
Choose: Visualizing the Story – press that.
Choose: Storyboards & Pre-Viz Making Words Into Images – press that.
Youre in! This entire chapter plays for approx 15 minutes.
 Hi tORNsibs
Welcome to the next Chapter of the Appendices!
This chapter is another carriage on the train to the process of the Making of the Fellowship of the Ring.
This Chapter is called: Making Words into Images
And we will be discussing this chapter Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday & Thursday this week.
Last week hobbitlove and ordinaryhobbit guided us through the Chapter of Book to Script – so let’s have a look at the what happens once there was a treatment of the book in place, and the continuous ongoing development of script was in progress .... then there comes some visual references which are a translation of the script.
____________________________________________________
Part One: Visualizing the Story - Storyboards
The first thing Peter mentions on the opening of this chapter was:
“When you’re doing 3 films back to back the danger of the train derailing is huge.
We knew we had to plan these movies as detailed as we possibly could because there’d be very little room for error”.
“We knew we had to run a very tight ship as it were so that when we started shooting we knew we’d get tired, we knew we’d get exhausted, that all sorts of pressures would descend on us and we just had to have a great focus plan to be able to get us through each day”.
Peter explains the process.
To keep the film from derailing, Peter committed his entire vision of what he wanted to see on film to storyboards first.
What are storyboards you ask – we’ll let Christian Rivers, Peters storyboard artist, explain what storyboards are:
“The story boarding process was the most basic form of pre-visualizating the film, its 2D pencil drawings – single panels – nothings moving – there’s no real evidence of what the camera moves are going to be. You get an idea, OK we’re gonna pan from this character to this character – we tilt down from this object to that object – but we don’t get any feel for how fast those camera moves are – or actually even the logistics” ...
Pic of single storyboard frame completed by Christian.
“Its to give everyone, including Peter, a good feel, as to, OK, this (this) is what the flavour of the film is – he can then evaluate where scenes are running to long (um) things – even scenes that he may want to cut out entirely – all before he’s wasting film shooting actors in sets and having the crew costing tens of thousands standing around”.
About Christian Rivers – WETA Visual FX Art Director - Storyboard Artist
Christian Rivers has been storyboarding for Peter Jackson since he was 17, and he has storyboarded most of Peter’s film. Peter and Christian started storyboarding the film as the scripts were being written – so they were basically working on the storyboards at the same time as the script was being developed.
Christian Rivers.
Storyboarding is also used as a visual reference in other departments
Alex Funke – Miniatures Director of Photography
“When Peter set out to start designing the film basically pre-visualised every shot. Sometimes with a high level of detail, sometimes just as a sketch”.
Alex Funke - MDOP
Grant Major – Production Designer:
“He ended up storyboarding all the films – you know (basically) every frame we see in these films had already been storyboarded by Peter, and they were able to work from visual reference”.
Grant Major - Production Designer
Pictures below:
Peter & Christian: The Process of Sketching a Storyboard for Fellowship of the Ring.
Here is Peter and Christian working together on 3 storyboards for a scene. Peter does a bit of explaining and a slight pencil outline of what he wants to see, and then Christian goes to work on developing the sketch from Peter’s explanation. Peter also shows him the type of movement/action/ that each particular storyboard has so that visual directions, such as arrows, can be placed in the storyboard to indicate the storyboards actions, and also helps one sketch flows into the next. He hands it back to Christian for the additions.
Christian Rivers:
“I sit down with him and he describes the shot to me – usually I get it in the first drawing – sometimes I have to push it to 2 – if its a really difficult shot, I might have to just quickly do a 3rd sketch ...”
Peter explains to Christian what he wants to see on the storyboard.
He gives it to Christian to draw the storyboard outline.
Peter explains the changes he needs to the sketch.
Peter hands back the storyboard to Christian to make the changes.
Christian makes the changes as discussed.
Add one storyboard to another and you get a sequence of storyboards which begin to create a scene:
You will notice that in this sequence from The Green Dragon, that in the storyboard the Ring has been sketched to land over Frodo's pinkine finger and not his index finger - and considering the amount of times we see this sequence (and single picture) in spoilers and posters - its a big change that was made during filming.
Below: A sequence of storyboards which make a scene.
Frodo falling down (Green Dragon Inn)
Frodo lets go of the Ring
The Ring flies up in the air.
Strider is alarmed at what is happening.
Frodo grasps upward for the descending ring.
The ring slips onto Frodo's pinkie finger.
Put them all together and you have a huge number of storyboards which are the basic outline in visual form of the script.
By placing the storyboards in line or in sequence of how they will be edited, Peter was able to get an idea of how the movie would flow visually – he could easier detect things which were missing to tell the story – or things which weren’t necessary ...
Peter flicks through the book of storyboards.
Why does Peter work with Storyboards? What is their value in the process?
Peter explained:
“... I mean ... that is the single thing that I think storyboards are most valuable for – or for me is that – they’re a cheap pass at the movie. I get to make the movie at a really low low cost – at the price of a few pencils and paper.
But it effectively has put me through the process of making the film. As a director I’ve had a go – I’ve done version number 1 – and I can get to look at the movie complete ....”
Peter used the storyboards he and Christian developed as a tool of reference and not as a final shot list made up of sketches. This allowed for creative spontaneity, change, and freedom to springboard other ideas into the process and development of the film.
Barrie Osbourne explains about the storyboards:
“– it was never intended, and never was the final version of the movie. I’ve worked with some directors who will story board their film and you’ll really see those storyboards on screen. Peters not that director – that kind of a director – Peter uses it for inspiration and for communication with the departments, but you know that those storyboards are gonna change – they’re a starting point – not an end point for Peter.
Barry Osbourne - Producer
And the last line to end part One comes from Christian Rivers:
“When I’m storyboarding with Peter, I think I’ve got the luckiest job on the planet”.
Christian drawing storyboards for Peter for FOTR
... and I think he has too!
_____________________________
And so this was the beginning of the script coming alive with Peter’s vision being interpreted and then transferred by way of sketches onto paper, one vision at a time.
Hope you enjoyed the first instalment.
If you’d like to join in on the discussion please feel free.
Tomorrow we will look at how those sketches then developed into Animatics and how the storyboards were taken to another level of development.
Oh, and just a pic from this chapter in the Appendices: A look at one scene shot that didn’t make the movie (Arwens dress!)
Cheers
Elven x
___________________________________________________________
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
(This post was edited by Xoanon on Apr 21 2009, 2:26am)
|
|
|
hobbitlove
Mithlond
Apr 20 2009, 3:06pm
Post #2 of 18
(1800 views)
Shortcut
|
A perfect beginning to your discussions. I am in awe!!!
Well, the one thing I want to say is that it was a most fortuitous day when Christian and Peter Jackson met! Those two work so well together!
Love learning about this process. And, Barrie telling us that some directors use their storyboards as an exact blueprint sort of thing - well, we can learn something about the kind of courage it might take to be spontaneous, just in that remark.
Peter's instincts are the best (IMhO), so, he puts in the work first and then just keeps creating. It's a constant moving forward, using everything he has at his disposal, to improve, improve, improve. The storyboards are just the beginning. Yet, these are genius - the whole movie imagined by the director! Wow, what an imagination! And, Christian can 'read' Peter's mind and sketch his thoughts!
 Am in awe of the creative person!
One could talk about all this all day long.
Wonderful, wonderful post, Elven.
hob
|
|
|
OhioHobbit
Mithlond
Apr 20 2009, 6:26pm
Post #3 of 18
(1802 views)
Shortcut
|
I find it amazing how Christian Rivers can draw so well so quickly. I also find it amazing that Peter could describe to him the scene he imagined and Christian could capture what Peter imagined, usually on the first try.
One more thing that I find amazing is how directors can imagine the scenes. It is one thing to imagine an event in a story and quite another to imagine the placement of everything, the camera angles, pans, zooms, cuts, and so on. I suppose that is why they are movie directors and I am not. 
I have a question about storyboards. Does anyone know if all movies are made using storyboards?
Great post, Elven. I am really looking forward to the rest!
Movie Technical Discussion -- Index
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 20 2009, 7:04pm
Post #5 of 18
(1802 views)
Shortcut
|
One more thing that I find amazing is how directors can imagine the scenes. It is one thing to imagine an event in a story and quite another to imagine the placement of everything, the camera angles, pans, zooms, cuts, and so on.
Yes, Peter has a very visual mind for story telling - I think its a bit like Tolkien - Tolkien was so descriptive with words, but I also think he wrote from a visual reference, and I think in a similar way Peter makes movies through his imagination and transcription of what he reads. I think he connected very well with Tolkiens vision. With the amount of transference that went on - like visual chinese whispers - its amazing how accurate Tolkiens (and Peters) vision was kept (I know it was accurate to me anyhows ) and captured on film.
Thanks so much for joing in Ohiohobbit
Cheers
Elven
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
hobbitlove
Mithlond
Apr 20 2009, 10:14pm
Post #6 of 18
(1793 views)
Shortcut
|
Need a permanent museum for us geeks! New Line? Time Warner? You listening?
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Every bit of memorabilia and all the work of these people would be interesting to see.
I won't give up hope.
We were just wandering around Daniel Reeve's website yesterday (lookin' for important stuff for parties, LOL) and that site alone, just overwhelms me!
Lovely discussion, Elven. You're the best.
hob
|
|
|
simplyaven
Hithlum
Apr 21 2009, 2:15am
Post #7 of 18
(1787 views)
Shortcut
|
|
This young man is unbeliavable!
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
I remember very well the first time I watched this part and he said he was 17 when he started. I replayed this at least two times to make sure I heard it correctly! I thought these drawings were made by an artist with probably 15 years experience in sketching. Great talent and luckily, Peter found him!
Thanks for the fantastic post, Elven!
I also love the shot which didn't make it into the movie! I'm still eager for more and more unseen shots... And the dress look wonderful. Maybe Arwen's daughter knows more about it. 
Culinary journey through Middle Earth continues! Join us on the Main board!
I believe
|
|
|
simplyaven
Hithlum
Apr 21 2009, 2:19am
Post #8 of 18
(1782 views)
Shortcut
|
I have a question about storyboards. Does anyone know if all movies are made using storyboards?
Not really. And even not every advertising is made using a storyboard although it's much shorter and it would be easier to have it drawn. It depends on the director and his/her preferences. Or sometimes it depends on the complexity of the project - in this particular case the storyboards allowed planning and visualisation at a very low cost. For a short clip it's not always necessary. I prefer working with storyboards (advertising) as they give a very good idea about the order and length, focus and details.
Culinary journey through Middle Earth continues! Join us on the Main board!
I believe
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 21 2009, 2:31am
Post #9 of 18
(1776 views)
Shortcut
|
I hope one day it happens - maybe after the Hobbit.
And you mention another great artist Daniel Reeve - my favourite calligrapher
Maybe we could start a vitual museum here 
Hugggs Hob
Elven x
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
tiamy
Ossiriand
Apr 21 2009, 4:49am
Post #10 of 18
(1750 views)
Shortcut
|
I would love to get that book of storyboards that PJ is flipping.
Hope they sell copies of it. I will definitely buy them!
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 21 2009, 12:32pm
Post #11 of 18
(1772 views)
Shortcut
|
Hi simplyaven
Yep, so talented! ... and I guess it helps to have worked with Peter on most of his films, which also means it gives Peter a great starting point for getting any visual material down quickly as well.
and yes, I hope Arwen's Daughter pops in and has a look at the dress too.
Cheers, and thanks for joining in simplyaven
Elven x
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 21 2009, 12:35pm
Post #12 of 18
(1778 views)
Shortcut
|
there must be quite a few of them - they would take a year to look through
Aiye, I could do that! (too)
Thanks for joing in tiamy
Cheers
Elven x
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
OhioHobbit
Mithlond
Apr 21 2009, 2:59pm
Post #13 of 18
(1748 views)
Shortcut
|
I am learning a little more all the time. There is so much expertise around here and I love it when someone shares how their experience relates to the subject at hand. It’s all so very interesting!
Thank you.
Movie Technical Discussion -- Index
|
|
|
simplyaven
Hithlum
Apr 21 2009, 7:45pm
Post #14 of 18
(1761 views)
Shortcut
|
Culinary journey through Middle Earth continues! Join us on the Main board!
I believe
|
|
|
Ainu Laire
Dor-Lomin
Apr 22 2009, 6:06am
Post #15 of 18
(1808 views)
Shortcut
|
|
This is absolutely wonderful for me to see
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Rivers has the job I want to start with in the industry- story board artist- and Grant Majors has the job I think I want to end up as- Production Designer. I can only imagine how wonderful it was working on stuff like this on these films... *dreams* Maybe one day I'll be the production designer for the Silmarillion when Tolkien's great-great grandson sells the rights... :P
Thank you for posting this up!
My LJ
My art site
NARF since age 8, when I refused to read the Hobbit because the cover looked boring and icky.
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 22 2009, 8:01am
Post #16 of 18
(1751 views)
Shortcut
|
Ainu Laire
All the very best wishes for your dreams
May each and all come true!
Thanks for joining in!
Cheers
Elven x
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
Peredhil lover
Doriath
Apr 22 2009, 9:59am
Post #17 of 18
(1781 views)
Shortcut
|
Storyboards are a great way to visualize a film beforehand, to get an idea how things should look like and what works and what not. And Christian and Peter seem to be a good team, when he gets it right so fast. Though now I am wondering how many of these sketches he had to draw to cover three long movies, even without changes ... 
I find it a bit strange that some directors don't stray from these storyboards. I *know* I'd have lots of new ideas after the storyboards are finished - so why not use them, if they are fitting into the already existing stuff?
I do not suffer from LotR obsession - I enjoy every minute of it.
|
|
|
Elven
Doriath
Apr 22 2009, 11:33am
Post #18 of 18
(1791 views)
Shortcut
|
Nice to see you here
I find it a bit strange that some directors don't stray from these storyboards. I *know* I'd have lots of new ideas after the storyboards are finished - so why not use them, if they are fitting into the already existing stuff?
As Barry Osbourne said, that the storyboards are just a strting point, and once Peter was on his way with filming, things changed - but I think he was so hands on a present in the process that the film was literally running in his imagination - and was able to change things spontaneously if needed, but those sequences of storyboards which were 'gold' he kept.
Then again, other directors ... I think that might be sometimes a bit of risk, though it's possibly depends on the capabilities and experience of the director, cast and crew - especially if it involves money - because the budget may suddenly go AWOL if there are drastic scene changes and the movie (for whatever reason) doesn't get back on track - it can go on some other tangent and then there's a problem for the editing dept trying to piece the puzzle back together again - or there are pickups which have to be done to bring the movie back to some form of flow.
Though, if the storyboarder is on set - its pretty handy - and some storyboards are no more than a dash and a line and an arrow - or storyboards can be just a frame of words like - Gandalf sits on chair - close-up of mug - close-up of Gandalfs face - close up of liquid in mug - ... that sort of thing.
I guess everyone works differently - but I think Peter was tring to avoid a full on disaster by being as prepared as he possibly could - once the ground work was laid out - and that 'train was on the tracks' there was no stopping it!  
Thanks for joing in PL
Cheers
Elven x
Swishtail.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn!!
Avatar: Liberace - The other Lord of the Rings.
Quote of The Week: The thing is I always write in the morning, and I know that if I go to the Net I won’t write ... you can start in the most scholarly website and end up at Paris Hilton dot com .. GdT
|
|
|
|
|
