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CuriousG
Gondolin

Jun 1 2019, 1:30pm
Post #1 of 41
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"Help us, Obi-Wan, you're our only hope" vs LOTR/TH
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I was thinking how LOTR/TH brought Tolkien into popular culture to stay, and how there are memorable lines from the movies that get repurposed in other shows, such as "One does not simply walk into..." Even though that line gets reused a lot, I think it's with respect, not mockery. So I couldn't think of any cheesy or bad lines from LOTR/TH that have entered popular culture such as the one from Star Wars I listed. I personally have no problem with that line, but it is lampooned mercilessly in comedy, with "It's a trap" running a strong second. Can you think of any bad lines from the Tolkien movies that are parodied in shows/blogs/comedy routines/etc, or do the movies escape unscathed?
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome

Jun 1 2019, 2:21pm
Post #2 of 41
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"Fly, you fools!" I'm sure that we can find a few more, especially if we look more the films than to the books.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own." - Adam Savage
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Solicitr
Mithlond
Jun 1 2019, 3:31pm
Post #3 of 41
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The LR, yes. TH, not so much. I can't think of a single catchphrase from those that made it into the pop-culture lexicon.
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2ndBreffest
Menegroth

Jun 1 2019, 4:12pm
Post #4 of 41
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what about TH's classic line, "There could be anything down my trousers."? I'm fairly certain I've seen several porno movies pay homage to that little beauty.
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome

Jun 1 2019, 4:52pm
Post #5 of 41
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... "I've got a bad feeling about this." or "These aren't the droids you're looking for." It comes up in every film. I watch for it like I do Stan Lee or the Wilhelm Scream ;) LotR/TH (to name a few): No one tosses a dwarf You Shall Not Pass! What about second breakfast? references to Elevensies references to Moots My Captain, My King There and Back Again My Precioussssssssss
We have been there and back again. TIME Google Calendar
(This post was edited by grammaboodawg on Jun 1 2019, 4:54pm)
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome

Jun 1 2019, 5:51pm
Post #6 of 41
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TAURIEL: Why does it hurt so much? THRANDUIL: Because it was real. Pure cheese!
"I reject your reality and substitute my own." - Adam Savage
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2ndBreffest
Menegroth

Jun 1 2019, 6:17pm
Post #7 of 41
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That line falls into the "so bad, its good" category. As much as I dislike these movies, that line, combined with the expression on his face when he delivers it, always gives me a good laugh.
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Cirashala
Doriath

Jun 2 2019, 1:12am
Post #8 of 41
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Now THAT is definitely one we can agree on!
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I loathed that entire subplot. Once the Feast of Starlight scene was over, everything after that regarding Tauriel was horrible. That line just about made me want to shoot Tauriel myself and knock Thranduil over the head with a two by four so he'd come back to his senses. I think Tauriel had the potential to become an amazing original character, but the whole love story just ruined her character, IMHO, and turned her into a complete idiot on the battlefield (screaming your wuv bug's name in a dangerous combat situation with poor to non-existent visibility due to the structure you're in is hands down the most STUPID thing any soldier could do. Gives both yours and his position away to the enemy, and due to that idiocy Kili died and she almost did too. After 600 years of military training, she should have known better than to be so stupid ).
My writing and novels: My Hobbit Fanfiction My historical novel print and kindle version My historical novels ebook version compatible with all ereaders You can also find my novel at most major book retailers online (and for those outside the US who prefer a print book, you can find the print version at Book Depository). Search "Amazing Grace Amanda Longpre'" to find it. Happy reading everyone!
(This post was edited by Cirashala on Jun 2 2019, 1:16am)
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kzer_za
Menegroth
Jun 2 2019, 2:24am
Post #9 of 41
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Looks like meat's back on our menu, boys!
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I do like that scene in all its ridiculousness, though it's a bit of a guilty pleasure...
(This post was edited by kzer_za on Jun 2 2019, 2:24am)
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sevilodorf
Dor-Lomin

Jun 2 2019, 11:23am
Post #10 of 41
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One ring to rule them all and turning it to One King to rule them all. also Sam and his Po-tay-toes gets some play time.
Fourth Age Adventures at the Inn of the Burping Troll http://burpingtroll.com Home of TheOneRing.net Best FanFic stories of 2005 and 2006 "The Last Grey Ship" and "Ashes, East Wind, Hope That Rises" by Erin Rua (Found in Mathoms, LOTR Tales Untold)
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2ndBreffest
Menegroth

Jun 2 2019, 5:49pm
Post #11 of 41
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All of PJ's subplots were bad, but that one stands out above the rest.
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hanne
Menegroth
Jun 3 2019, 2:25am
Post #12 of 41
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Number of google hits is a very looseygoosey measure, but in lieu of anything better, it looks like you are right and the "only hope" line rules pop culture utterly. But "One Anything to rule them all" and "not simply walking" is up there with not looking for droids. And "my Precious" has Admiral Akbar beat. STAR WARS 1,700,000,000 - "Help me, *, you're my only hope" 675,000,000 - "These aren't the * you're looking for." 12,800,000 - "It's a trap" 894,000 - "I've got a bad feeling about this." (721,000 for "I have a bad feeling about this") LORD OF THE RINGS 783,000,000 - "One * to rule them all" 505,000,000 - "one does not simply walk into *" 16,600,000 - "My Precious" 3,080,000 - "You Shall Not Pass!" 1,310,000 - "second breakfast" 154,000 - "Fly, you fools!" 67,800 - "Looks like meat's back on the menu, boys!" 47,900 - "My Captain, My King" 33,000 - "Po-tay-toes" 3,820 - "No one tosses a dwarf" HOBBIT 9,570,000 - "Because it was real." (probably lots of false positives for unrelated uses) 6,690,000 - "There and Back Again" (I decline to google this one) "There could be anything down my trousers."
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome

Jun 3 2019, 2:48pm
Post #13 of 41
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"It's not my fault!" turns up 1,060,000,000 results on Bing! Granted, I'm sure that not nearly all of them are SW-related. For Curious G: By the way, Leia's exact line is: "Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi. You're my only hope."
"I reject your reality and substitute my own." - Adam Savage
(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Jun 3 2019, 2:55pm)
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Hasuwandil
Menegroth
Jun 3 2019, 8:49pm
Post #14 of 41
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Is it enough for it to have become a meme? Then I propose: "You have my sword...and you have my bow...and my axe!" (possibly replacing the weapons with something else).
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CuriousG
Gondolin

Jun 5 2019, 5:50pm
Post #16 of 41
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They are as close to numbers as I think we'll get. That line from TH "Because it was real" probably would rank as the cheesiest from the whole franchise, but you're right, it's pretty general in the words it uses, so hard to separate it out. I guess we'll let Star Wars reign with the cheesiest lines to enter pop culture. I think that Yoda-speak probably gets imitated more than Gollum-speak too. Influential he was.
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hanne
Menegroth
Jun 6 2019, 4:14pm
Post #17 of 41
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And there's no way of applying the google test for Yoda speak - it can and is used in so many more situations than just gloating over something precious. Thank you for an interesting discussion! I'm not sad that Tolkien isn't as cheesy as Star Wars :) I note that the simply walk into Morder line was by Jackson, Walsh and Boyens, while of course One Ring to rule them all and Precious are all Tolkien. I thought "You shall not pass" was Tolkien too but huh, it's not - he wrote "You cannot pass".
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CuriousG
Gondolin

Jun 6 2019, 5:09pm
Post #18 of 41
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It's all in the delivery, isn't it?
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I think seeing "One simply does not walk into..." in print doesn't convey Sean Bean's memorable delivery, just as movie-Gandalf's lines in Moria are much more dramatic than the way my head canon plays out. There's something about the book description that makes me think book-Gandalf has lowered his voice and is speaking firmly but not terribly emotionally or loudly. I have no idea why, but that's how I picture it (maybe because the Balrog never says a word so the scene is essentially taut with silence?). Whereas movie-Gandalf is emotional as he should be--it's a short but dramatic scene that needs to be punched up for the audience to appreciate it, plus he has to be heard over the music/drums. For me, the most memorable part of the book passage is Gandalf's cryptic remarks about Secret Fire, Anor, and Udun--it's almost like he's reciting a spell in an arcane language. No one on first read has a clue what he's talking about. The Balrog reached the bridge. Gandalf stood in the middle of the span, leaning on the staff in his left hand, but in his other hand Glamdring gleamed, cold and white. His enemy halted again, facing him, and the shadow about it reached out like two vast wings. It raised the whip, and the thongs whined and cracked. Fire came from its nostrils. But Gandalf stood firm. ‘You cannot pass,’ he said. The orcs stood still, and a dead silence fell. ‘I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. You cannot pass. The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn. Go back to the Shadow! You cannot pass.’ The Balrog made no answer. The fire in it seemed to die, but the darkness grew. It stepped forward slowly on to the bridge, and suddenly it drew itself up to a great height, and its wings were spread from wall to wall; but still Gandalf could be seen, glimmering in the gloom; he seemed small, and altogether alone: grey and bent, like a wizened tree before the onset of a storm. From out of the shadow a red sword leaped flaming. Glamdring glittered white in answer. There was a ringing clash and a stab of white fire. The Balrog fell back, and its sword flew up in molten fragments. The wizard swayed on the bridge, stepped back a pace, and then again stood still. ‘You cannot pass!’ he said.
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Cirashala
Doriath

Jun 6 2019, 5:47pm
Post #19 of 41
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This scene is where Gandalf essentially reveals exactly WHO he is and exactly WHO sent him (Eru Illuvatar/God) on his mission. A "Servant of the Secret Fire"-well, that secret fire is Eru Himself (note he says that, not servant of the Valar ;) Wielder of the flame of Arnor- the flame that Eru instilled in the world at its creation that only comes from Him. Flame of Udun- flame of hell (Udun is hell in Sindarin) It is very subtly woven in, but Tolkien's faith shines very much here in those simple two sentences. I do wonder if the rest of the fellowship picked up on it though, or if they were a little too busy running to get it. I bet if he had said that under any other circumstance at least Legolas and Aragorn would have been completely dumbfounded (knowing he got sent by the Valar is one thing; that he was sent directly by Eru Himself would most definitely get their attention). Not sure if the others would have any clue what those two sentences really meant, but those two certainly would have.
My writing and novels: My Hobbit Fanfiction My historical novel print and kindle version My historical novels ebook version compatible with all ereaders You can also find my novel at most major book retailers online (and for those outside the US who prefer a print book, you can find the print version at Book Depository). Search "Amazing Grace Amanda Longpre'" to find it. Happy reading everyone!
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hanne
Menegroth
Jun 6 2019, 6:50pm
Post #20 of 41
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Sean Bean's suppressed frustration was great. And Ian McKellen took ‘You cannot pass,’ he said. and dialled it all the way up to 'You! Shall! NOT! PAASSS!!," he scenery-chewed, and it was awesome indeed :) But so is the book, I'm glad you quoted the whole thing. The tension is incredible, and Gandalf's power is mysterious, terrifying and numinous. If I had to choose the most effective delivery of the scene, I'd give the book the edge, as good as the movie version was.
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CuriousG
Gondolin

Jun 6 2019, 8:19pm
Post #21 of 41
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It deserves its own explanatory appendix
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and never made any sense to me until I read The Silmarillion. I think you're right about who would and wouldn't understand him. I'm assuming that Aragorn's upbringing in Rivendell included a decent education on the spiritual foundations of Middle-earth. With Legolas, I'd assume he knew, though it's hard to say. I doubt that Boromir would know since he was no "wizard's pupil," but even given Denethor's scornful use of that phase, I think when Gandalf told him "For I also am a steward. Did you not know?", that Gandalf is showing he assumes Denethor knows exactly what he means--that he's on a mission, from Valinor at least. Hence Denethor knows about Valar and Maiar, etc. Numenor had that big temple to Eru, so he should know about him too. But with the hobbits and Gimli, my assumption is that Gandal'fs words were over their heads.
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Solicitr
Mithlond
Jun 7 2019, 10:44pm
Post #22 of 41
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was in many ways very like Faramir, which is perhaps why they didn't get along. He was scholarly and perceptive, but used his insight for advantage rather than empathy and "was sooner moved to scorn than pity." I've believed ever since the movies came out that John Noble was completely wrong for the role (much as I like him as an actor); Denethor would much better have been played by someone of the Basil Rathbone/Peter Cushing/Charles Dance sort.
(This post was edited by Solicitr on Jun 7 2019, 10:45pm)
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CuriousG
Gondolin

Jun 7 2019, 11:07pm
Post #23 of 41
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Yeah, movie-Denethor didn't work for me
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I understand the movie didn't have time to develop his character like the book and instead started with him as a neurotic, the way he ended, but it still didn't work. And yeah, even the face was wrong: Denethor was old and probably wrinkled, but I see him as having very sharp features even then. (like Peter Cushing)
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome

Jun 8 2019, 1:27am
Post #24 of 41
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I would blame the screenplay for that.
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I've believed ever since the movies came out that John Noble was completely wrong for the role (much as I like him as an actor); Denethor would much better have been played by someone of the Basil Rathbone/Peter Cushing/Charles Dance sort. I don't think Noble is at fault here; he gave Peter Jackson the performance that the writer/producer/director wanted.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own." - Adam Savage
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VeArkenstone
Menegroth
Jun 8 2019, 7:42pm
Post #25 of 41
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"RUN!" Gandalf gives this advice at least 6 to 8 times to Men, Dwarves & Hobbits.
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Please, call me Ve.
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