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lionoferebor
Nargothrond
Feb 27 2016, 4:15pm
Post #1 of 31
(2051 views)
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Bifur loosing his axe...
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Since the release of the BOFA ee, periodically I've seen a number of post expressing disgust in regards to the amount of gore in the chariot scene. While there is a quite a bit of gore - though as part of battle sequence, IMO, it's not entirely out of place - it's the moment Bifur looses his axe that makes me squirm. Especially when he is leaning over the cliff and the Orc is hanging from his forehead. Does anyone else find this scene squeamish? Or is there another moment - aside from those mentioned - that make your squirm?
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 5:17pm
Post #2 of 31
(1977 views)
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it's the moment Bifur looses his axe that makes me squirm. Especially when he is leaning over the cliff and the Orc is hanging from his forehead. Does anyone else find this scene squeamish? I thought that scene was good and was not out of place.
Or is there another moment - aside from those mentioned - that make your squirm? No, not really. I never understand the complain about the chariot scene has to much blood, because except for the ogres getting there head cut of, there is not so much blood in that scene.
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Gandalf the Green
Ossiriand
Feb 27 2016, 5:34pm
Post #3 of 31
(1971 views)
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Bifur losing his axe is one of the most idiotic, worst scenes of the entire film.
It's just plain ridiculous and totally screams "LOTR parody" to me, like many other scenes in The Hobbit.
(This post was edited by Gandalf the Green on Feb 27 2016, 5:34pm)
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 5:43pm
Post #4 of 31
(1966 views)
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Bifur losing his axe is one of the most idiotic, worst scenes of the entire film.
It's just plain ridiculous and totally screams "LOTR parody" to me, like many other scenes in The Hobbit. It is a brilliant scene, with great humor and a perfect way to get the axe out of Bifur's head. It is not LOTR parody because it is just as good as many scenes from LOTR.
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LSF
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 6:00pm
Post #5 of 31
(1958 views)
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Bifur losing the axe wasn't squeamish at all for me. I really like the scene. The only "gore" thing I jumped at first time I saw was the 6-ogre chariot decapitation, but only because I wasn't expecting it. As a fan of Starz Spartacus show, such blood/gore effects don't make me queasy anymore.
Actually, I was a bit disappointed that they didn't have even a little blood on Bifur's face after. And on Bofur after he got hit directly up the chest and chin with a spike mace. The only Company dwarf that got dirtied/bloodied up was Thorin. So in this respect of having good characters get bloody, this battle was a little too clean, especially compared to Moria. (This was also my criticism for most of the fighting in LOTR). I'm not asking for buckets of blood, just a little bit of that and bruising 
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Avandel
Gondolin
Feb 27 2016, 6:10pm
Post #6 of 31
(1949 views)
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That scene doesn't bother me but...
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In the EE, being an animal lover, there's a quick scene of a clubbing of a dwarf/ram cart, and that makes me wince. Even if it's CGI. And when the dwarves crash into the elves, and a few of the Dale shots.
And some other shots that I will not name.
But Bifur doesn't bother me. I guess on some inherent level I figure he's had the axe head for a long time, and it's pretty healed like having pierced ears or something.
On the other hand, some of the stuff I find hysterical, like the trolls all getting decapitated. (Thanks for this thread, now I gotta re-watch BOFA tonight.)
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LSF
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 6:21pm
Post #8 of 31
(1941 views)
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I love the Moria behind the scenes bit. "We started we these little spray bottles... Not enough blood... Then we had these cups... MORE BLOOD!... So we threw buckets of it." 
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Gandalf the Green
Ossiriand
Feb 27 2016, 6:38pm
Post #9 of 31
(1945 views)
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Bifur losing his axe is one of the most idiotic, worst scenes of the entire film.
It's just plain ridiculous and totally screams "LOTR parody" to me, like many other scenes in The Hobbit. It is a brilliant scene, with great humor and a perfect way to get the axe out of Bifur's head. It is not LOTR parody because it is just as good as many scenes from LOTR.
LOL!
I almost fell off my chair! Now that's good humor!
You should look into doing stand-up comedy!
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 6:40pm
Post #10 of 31
(1935 views)
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In AUJ, when Thorin pulls Orcrist from a warg, and the blade is all squeaky-clean, same for Bilbo when he pulls Sting from a warg. And Legolas in DOS doing all that knife work and there's no "goo" at all. Maybe elven weapons don't get blood on them? Have Sting ever had blood on its blade in LOTR or the hobbit?
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lionoferebor
Nargothrond
Feb 27 2016, 6:44pm
Post #11 of 31
(1925 views)
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Bifur losing the axe wasn't squeamish at all for me. I really like the scene. The only "gore" thing I jumped at first time I saw was the 6-ogre chariot decapitation, but only because I wasn't expecting it. As a fan of Starz Spartacus show, such blood/gore effects don't make me queasy anymore.
Truth be told, I'm a Game of Thrones fan  , one of the bloodiest and goriest shows on television today. You'd think as scene like Bifur loosing his axe would not phase me  , yet different things make different people squirm (or laugh, or cry, etc).
Actually, I was a bit disappointed that they didn't have even a little blood on Bifur's face after. And on Bofur after he got hit directly up the chest and chin with a spike mace. The only Company dwarf that got dirtied/bloodied up was Thorin. So in this respect of having good characters get bloody, this battle was a little too clean, especially compared to Moria. (This was also my criticism for most of the fighting in LOTR). I'm not asking for buckets of blood, just a little bit of that and bruising
Fili also ends up bloody - though we never see how  - and Dwalin has smears of black orc blood on his head, but other than that rest of the Company stays relatively clean. Maybe the others a immuned to blood and grime? I agree, however, a little more grit and grime (not a lot) would have been nice.
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Gandalf the Green
Ossiriand
Feb 27 2016, 7:39pm
Post #12 of 31
(1910 views)
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In AUJ, when Thorin pulls Orcrist from a warg, and the blade is all squeaky-clean, same for Bilbo when he pulls Sting from a warg. And Legolas in DOS doing all that knife work and there's no "goo" at all. Maybe elven weapons don't get blood on them? Have Sting ever had blood on its blade in LOTR or the hobbit?
https://gyazo.com/982047651653c6d00f1f4d287d13704a
^
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 7:46pm
Post #13 of 31
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So elven blades dose get blood on them, or at least Glamdring dose, but I can still not remember Sting ever had blood on its blade, do you know a scene where it had blood on it?
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Gandalf the Green
Ossiriand
Feb 27 2016, 9:01pm
Post #14 of 31
(1887 views)
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There must be a scene where it does, but if anything...
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...have you ever seen these posters?
http://www-images.theonering.org/torwp/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/HBFA_1sht_Main_clean.jpg
http://s1.bwallpapers.com/wallpapers/2014/11/22/bilbo-baggins-in-the-battle-of-the-five-armies_110137342.jpg
Blood all over Sting...
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 9:11pm
Post #15 of 31
(1880 views)
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I just never thought about them. But yes you are right Sting dose have blood on it.
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome
Feb 27 2016, 9:56pm
Post #16 of 31
(1867 views)
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dose a unit of measurement
does present third singular of do; plural of doe
Please, don't tell me that you are doing this intentionally just to bug me!
And don't get me started on loose versus lose.
End of rant from a sometimes language cop.
"Things need not to have happened to be true.
Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure
when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."
- Dream of the Endless
(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Feb 27 2016, 10:01pm)
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 27 2016, 10:29pm
Post #17 of 31
(1856 views)
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Please, don't tell me that you are doing this intentionally just to bug me! Don't worry I am not doing this to bug you it is just me that is not good in spelling sometimes. And I am appreciating that you are telling me when I have done a mistake.
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome
Feb 27 2016, 10:31pm
Post #18 of 31
(1853 views)
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You just caught me in a mood, possibly because my coffee hadn't taken full-effect yet.
"Things need not to have happened to be true.
Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure
when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."
- Dream of the Endless
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MyWeeLadGimli
Menegroth
Feb 28 2016, 12:49am
Post #19 of 31
(1830 views)
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I hated the gore, but loved the Bifur bit
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I think the graphic violence was out of place and totally gratuitous.
However, I love the Bifur scene, I thought it was hilarious and a great character moment for the trio. The axe in the head thing was played more like a Looney Tunes gag than anything really gruesome, so it didn't bother me at all.
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MyWeeLadGimli
Menegroth
Feb 28 2016, 12:53am
Post #20 of 31
(1825 views)
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Besides the trolls (ogres?), there's the part where the Warg's head is smashed into the rock, and at the end of the scene an Orc is rather bloodily decapitated.
It makes me wonder what this scene would have looked like if they had actually finished it in time for the PG-13 theatrical release.
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Smaug the iron
Mithlond
Feb 28 2016, 1:15am
Post #21 of 31
(1820 views)
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Besides the trolls (ogres?), there's the part where the Warg's head is smashed into the rock, and at the end of the scene an Orc is rather bloodily decapitated. Both the warg and the orc thing is just for about one second each, plus it is not much blood.
And I don't think it out of place, we have seen blood before in this films ( just look at Azog's arm after Thorin cut it of, there is as much blood as the orc decapitated). Plus as other have said it makes it more realistic.
It makes me wonder what this scene would have looked like if they had actually finished it in time for the PG-13 theatrical release. Probably the same as it is now.
(This post was edited by Smaug the iron on Feb 28 2016, 1:18am)
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LSF
Mithlond
Feb 28 2016, 1:43am
Post #22 of 31
(1813 views)
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I think it would be the same as it is, except maybe with less "gushy" sort of blood.
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lionoferebor
Nargothrond
Feb 28 2016, 2:36am
Post #23 of 31
(1794 views)
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I think the graphic violence was out of place and totally gratuitous.
However, I love the Bifur scene, I thought it was hilarious and a great character moment for the trio. The axe in the head thing was played more like a Looney Tunes gag than anything really gruesome, so it didn't bother me at all.
How is violence of any kind out of place in a battle, but a looney tune moment is not? The Hobbit may be a children's novel, but Tolkien did not shy away from the horrors and gore of war - i.e. 'wolves rending on the wounded and dead' or 'great bats fastened vampire-like on the stricken.' Though Bifur loosing his axe made me cringe - IMO - wargs tearing away at bodies and bats sinking their teeth into the helpless are far darker and more gruesome images than any scene to be found in these films.
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MyWeeLadGimli
Menegroth
Feb 28 2016, 4:32am
Post #24 of 31
(1783 views)
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The movies have always been restrained
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There's very little blood in the first five movies, far less than would be realistic in a battle setting. For this movie to have buckets of blood in this one scene feels inconsistent with the way the violence has been portrayed in all the other films.
The Bifur thing wasn't really inconsistent with the films since the other Hobbit movies had a lot of silly bits in a similar vein (eg. Bombur's barrel or some of the Goblintown gags).
As for the book, I would argue that there is a difference between reading something and seeing it happen in graphic detail.
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ange1e4e5
Mithlond
Feb 28 2016, 1:11pm
Post #25 of 31
(1730 views)
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Well, it looks like most people are still glad this scene got axed.
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. In AUJ, when Thorin pulls Orcrist from a warg, and the blade is all squeaky-clean, same for Bilbo when he pulls Sting from a warg. And Legolas in DOS doing all that knife work and there's no "goo" at all. 
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