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Smaug_The_Magnificent
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 2:51pm
Post #1 of 132
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How Disappointing!!!
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What a sad end to an era. Having enjoyed The Lord Of The Rings Trilogy so much, to hear that someone else will be helming The Hobbit is an absolute let down. I was all for The Hobbit being made, but I'm certainly not now. I understand that PJ is busy at present, but let's not forget, he promised the fans that HE would make the film when all the distrubution rights were sorted out. Anyone else directing these films will not capture the same magic and atmostphere that The Lord Of The Rings potrayed so well. I understand that everyone is eager for these films to be made, but I can only see these films being a cheap knock-off with anyone other than PJ directing. I know for certain, unless things change I will not waste my time watching these films.
Long Live The Lord Of The Rings Trilogy!!!
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 3:12pm
Post #2 of 132
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once you've read through the various threads on all 3 boards! Believe me, I'm a HUGE supporter for Peter Jackson to direct these films; but he seems to be happy as Executive Producer who will have final say over how these films are directed, edited, orchestrated, etc. Peter's at the helm, but he's allowing another director to stand behind the camera, just as he did with several other directors for LotR. Remember how he sat behind a bank of monitors and oversaw what was done? I see this as essentially being the same thing.
It's assured that all the NZ people will be recreating the Middle-earth we know and love. Weta is on board and they still have the specs for the sets, locations, props, costumes, etc. I'm sure they're already looking into ordering ooodles of foam latex! From what we're led to believe, everything's in place and in control by Peter Jackson. Del Toro is very excited to be working with him, and you know Jackson would never have agreed to do this at all if he wasn't happy with the agreement. I'm sure he's also going to have plenty of pre-viz/story boards for Del Toro to follow.
I'm delighted with this. If you think about a year ago that we had no idea if Peter was going to be involved at all... this is a huge success. I trust he's not going to let anything happen to Tolkien's story and the visual world that's been created. He's a geek and a fan, too... and he's all over this project.
Now if we can get the writer's strike over with, we can get on with it! :D
 
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
TORn's Observations Lists
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 3:25pm
Post #3 of 132
(2247 views)
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Anyone nervous about Del Toro, read Tehanu's note
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from the homepage. Her words have reassured me that Del Toro is a perfect match for Jackson's style and sentitivity in how he films fantasy.
I wonder if she's going to don her camoflage and load her camera to do some more spying for us? ;)
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
TORn's Observations Lists
(This post was edited by grammaboodawg on Jan 31 2008, 3:26pm)
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Smaug_The_Magnificent
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 3:26pm
Post #4 of 132
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Thanks Grammaboodawg, all the points you brought out have gone a long way to ease my mind.
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vtboyarc
Menegroth
Jan 31 2008, 3:38pm
Post #5 of 132
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I've never heard of him, or seen any of his movies. I feel let down.
Theres some good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and its worth fighting for.
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Darkstone
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 3:40pm
Post #6 of 132
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I understand that PJ is busy at present, but let's not forget, he promised the fans that HE would make the film when all the distrubution rights were sorted out.
David O. Selznick made Gone With The Wind, Samuel Goldwyn made The Best Years of Our Lives, Darryl F. Zanuck made The Longest Day, Tim Burton made The Nightmare Before Christmas, and George Lucas made The Empire Strikes Back. All great films.
They made them, but they didn't direct them. (Can you name the directors?)
I'm sure The Hobbit will have "The PJ Touch".
******************************************
The audacious proposal stirred his heart. And the stirring became a song, and it mingled with the songs of Gil-galad and Celebrian, and with those of Feanor and Fingon. The song-weaving created a larger song, and then another, until suddenly it was as if a long forgotten memory woke and for one breathtaking moment the Music of the Ainur revealed itself in all glory. He opened his lips to sing and share this song. Then he realized that the others would not understand. Not even Mithrandir given his current state of mind. So he smiled and simply said "A diversion.”
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Elven
Doriath
Jan 31 2008, 3:53pm
Post #7 of 132
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I think Peter has secured a good position ...
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on these two films - it's a sensible manouver - and who's to say he wont at some point Direct - I have faith - I hold to the belief that his name will be there ... and his vision will be seen through. I just feel he can reap a deserved reward this time round - the legals would have sorted that - and also take the focus off him to some degree ... he gets to make the decisions - he's further up the pyramid ... Have hope that Peter will make sure these films are as good as LOTR, Smaug The Magnificent.
Cheers
Elven
The Shire was never the same after
Barbra Cartland moved into Bagshot Row.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!
The Hobbit!!
Its a Happening Thing!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn
Sauruman: "Do know how the fan girls/boys first came into being? ... they were Tolkien scholars once ... Taken by the Dark Director, tempted to hold moots & dress up like Hobbits, Elves, Dwarves and Wizards ... A ruined & terrible form of life, not to mentions bad grades ... and now perfected at TORN ...
Whom do you serve!"
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 5:17pm
Post #8 of 132
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who can say whether or not he'd find a moment here or a moment there to peek through the eye of the camera. ;) The world would be none the wiser, and he'd have his fun being behind the camera without the responsibility of doing it every day. I'll betcha real money he couldn't resist!
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 5:28pm
Post #9 of 132
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but I'd strongly suggest renting Hellboy (sequel out this summer) and Pan's Labyrinth. Hellboy is a comic book remake that's lots of fun. It has Ron Pearlman in it as Hellboy (tv's Beauty and the Beast, played Elijah's mean Pa in Huckberry Finn, etc.), and it also has John Hurt (Harry Potter wand-seller, voiced Aragorn in Bakshi's LotR), and a few other faces you may recognize. It's just fun with a lot of action, "I'm fireproof, and you're not." *shudder* Tehanu has a great writeup of Pan.
Pearlman is also said to be one of those who may be in The Hobbit, so it'd be a two-fer... seeing Del Toro's work and our possible Thorin ;)
Let me know what you think of Hellboy. I watch it all the time when I'm working at the computer.
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
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merklynn
Menegroth
Jan 31 2008, 5:35pm
Post #10 of 132
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Is the Hobbit film in trouble?
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I thought Perlman was a fan pick, not actually up for the role. I like the idea, though I hope he can do a less american sounding accent. Also, maybe I'm in the minority, but Pan's Labyrinth and Hellboy had no small share or faults, and certainly don't make me think of LOTR. No reason to think Del Toro will not do a good job, but not enough for me to click my heels in the air and think the Hobbit film is in safe hands. I'd like to hear more from Peter Jackson about what is going on.
On a slightly different topic, I'd like to see some kind of announcement in the next two weeks on the status of the Hobbit. I appreciate that the writer's strike is interfering, but It's almost February, and we need to hear that this project has some genuine life to it and isn't going to turn out to be a colossal let down as time constraints and NL problems end up nipping this movie in the bud. Activity on this movie is going to have to pick up pretty soon, otherwise I think there could be some internal problems we are not aware of.
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Elven
Doriath
Jan 31 2008, 5:39pm
Post #11 of 132
(1952 views)
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Its almost evil, In the nicest possible way of course!!  ... we just know he's gonna be there! Yeah!! 
The Shire was never the same after
Barbra Cartland moved into Bagshot Row.
Tolkien was a Capricorn!
The Hobbit!!
Its a Happening Thing!!
Russell Crowe for Beorn
Sauruman: "Do know how the fan girls/boys first came into being? ... they were Tolkien scholars once ... Taken by the Dark Director, tempted to hold moots & dress up like Hobbits, Elves, Dwarves and Wizards ... A ruined & terrible form of life, not to mentions bad grades ... and now perfected at TORN ...
Whom do you serve!"
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 5:44pm
Post #12 of 132
(1976 views)
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I'd love to hear of some real plans being made. But we've just heard about Del Toro, and supposedly the papers haven't even been signed yet. Pearlman is a rumour; but I'm sure having worked with Del Toro on the Hellboy films, he's not out of the question. I just get the feeling that actors and directors working in NZ are shown a whole new approach to acting, character development, and directing. It's not Hollywood, so I get the feeling there tends to be more freedom in flushing out a character and taking the time in developing them. At least, those under Jackson's watch ;)
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
TORn's Observations Lists
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shortround
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 5:56pm
Post #13 of 132
(1966 views)
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Simillarion is going to be hard to make into a story
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I had not thought about taking the simillarion and turning it into the second movie but it will be hard to due.
I think that making a second movie with a weak director is going to be risky.
(This post was edited by Altaira on Feb 2 2008, 5:12am)
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Altaira
Superuser
Jan 31 2008, 5:57pm
Post #14 of 132
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Heee, typing "welcome" to Smaug made me grin. 
Have faith that the 'team' of Jackson and Del Toro (quite a formidable one) will produce a movie that will be unique, but still worthy of Tolkien and his fans.
Also, do try to scan the boards before you start a thread. There are a few threads from the Home Page news already on Del Toro.
Welcome again!
Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.
"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower
"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase
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Arwen's daughter
Gondolin
Jan 31 2008, 6:01pm
Post #15 of 132
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They can't use the Silmarillion
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The filmmakers only have the rights for anything contained within The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. Christopher Tolkien still holds the rights for all of the Professor's other works and doesn't intend to let them go. The bridge movie will have to depend on the Appendices of LOTR and whatever they can glean from the two texts (assuming LOTR as a single book, here).
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merklynn
Menegroth
Jan 31 2008, 6:07pm
Post #16 of 132
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What is the situation with the rights for Tolkien's work? I understand that Saul Zaentz has the rights for the LOTR and the Hobbit, but how long does he retain these rights? Did Tolkien hand these over indefinitely? And I had thought Christopher Tolkien liked the Jackson LOTR movies. I thought he would probably be open to the idea of allowing works like Silmarillion to be bought and developed by Jackson if he was interested? Does anyone know the real deal on the rights and when (if ever) the Tolkien estate will get the LOTR and Hobbit film rights back from Zaentz?
(This post was edited by merklynn on Jan 31 2008, 6:07pm)
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Darkstone
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 7:09pm
Post #17 of 132
(2068 views)
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What is the situation with the rights for Tolkien's work?
Zaentz owns the exclusive merchandizing rights to The Hobbit and LOTR, including rights for film, stage, etc. The only exception is the domestic film distribution rights for The Hobbit which UA somehow held onto.
I understand that Saul Zaentz has the rights for the LOTR and the Hobbit, but how long does he retain these rights? Did Tolkien hand these over indefinitely?
Yes. The rights belong to Zaentz now.
And I had thought Christopher Tolkien liked the Jackson LOTR movies.
"'My own position is that 'The Lord Of The Rings' is peculiarly unsuitable to transformation into visual dramatic form. 'On the other hand, I recognize that this is a debatable and complex question of art, and the suggestions that have been made that I 'disapprove' of the films, whatever their cinematic quality, even to the extent of thinking ill of those with whom I may differ, are wholly without foundation."
-Christopher Tolkien
I thought he would probably be open to the idea of allowing works like Silmarillion to be bought and developed by Jackson if he was interested?
Probably not. One would suspect if he thought LOTR was "peculiarly unsuitable to transformation into visual dramatic form" it'd go doubly so for The Sil.
Does anyone know the real deal on the rights and when (if ever) the Tolkien estate will get the LOTR and Hobbit film rights back from Zaentz?
Never. (Unless of course they buy them back.) Though the estate will probably get the US distribution film rights for The Hobbit back after the film is made. Which means this may be the only film treatment of The Hobbit we'll ever get.
******************************************
The audacious proposal stirred his heart. And the stirring became a song, and it mingled with the songs of Gil-galad and Celebrian, and with those of Feanor and Fingon. The song-weaving created a larger song, and then another, until suddenly it was as if a long forgotten memory woke and for one breathtaking moment the Music of the Ainur revealed itself in all glory. He opened his lips to sing and share this song. Then he realized that the others would not understand. Not even Mithrandir given his current state of mind. So he smiled and simply said "A diversion.”
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 7:53pm
Post #18 of 132
(1952 views)
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"...only film treatment of The Hobbit we'll ever get..." In the words of Peregrin Took facing a pile of dooooo... "That was close!"
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
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Smaug_The_Magnificent
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 8:04pm
Post #19 of 132
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Thank you everyone for your replies so far. My gripe wasn't exactly pointed at Del Toro, it was a general gripe that PJ wouldn't be directing the film and the fact that he was only going to be an executive producer. I thought that as a executive producer that he wouldn't carry that much power over the project. As for the script, I know there's a writers strike in the US, but I was under the impression that Fran and Peter had got some sort of pre-script together a couple of years ago. It would be nice to have a bit more info on what's happening with The Hobbit.
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Ainu Laire
Dor-Lomin
Jan 31 2008, 8:12pm
Post #20 of 132
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Lucas didn't direct one (or more) of his Star Wars films, and had a lot of control over it, IIRC. I don't imagine that PJ and co is just going to let this slide. I imagine that he has quite a bit of creative control.
And, of course, WETA is still there. Yay WETA! :D
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Darkstone
Elvenhome
Jan 31 2008, 8:19pm
Post #21 of 132
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Lucas didn't direct one (or more) of his Star Wars films, and had a lot of control over it, IIRC.
The Empire Strikes Back and The Return of the Jedi.
And if you want to make money in bar bets, ask who directed The Nightmare Before Christmas.
(Hint: It wasn't Tim Burton.)
******************************************
The audacious proposal stirred his heart. And the stirring became a song, and it mingled with the songs of Gil-galad and Celebrian, and with those of Feanor and Fingon. The song-weaving created a larger song, and then another, until suddenly it was as if a long forgotten memory woke and for one breathtaking moment the Music of the Ainur revealed itself in all glory. He opened his lips to sing and share this song. Then he realized that the others would not understand. Not even Mithrandir given his current state of mind. So he smiled and simply said "A diversion.”
(This post was edited by Darkstone on Jan 31 2008, 8:22pm)
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Smaug_The_Magnificent
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 8:23pm
Post #22 of 132
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Perhaps PJ will let us know a bit more nearer the time hey!!!
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Windfola
Lindon
Jan 31 2008, 8:28pm
Post #23 of 132
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... GDT wants to direct the Hobbit (as well as considered making the last Harry Potter) not because he is really a fan of the book (he said he could barely finish the Hobbit) but because after it, he could have enough support to do the stuff he really wants....
If he is not writing the script, just directing, them I'm very happy with the choice, definitely better than Raimi, though I had my little dream of Peter Weir making it...
Anyway, about PJ not directing it, well leave the man alone  , he already spent almost a decade adapting Tolkien's stories. Do you think if he really wanted to direct the Hobbit(s) would he give up so easily?
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Tolkien Forever
Mithlond
Jan 31 2008, 8:52pm
Post #24 of 132
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I know this isn't popular in this 'Jacksonian' era of PJ worship, but Peter Jackson is soooooooo over-rated......
The guy was plucked out of obscurity to make TLOR & has settled back into obscurity very nicely. His King Kong was the worst piece of 'poop' I've ever seen.
While TLOR was still great & his 'look' of Middle-Earth was quite excellent & precise (purposely so & PJ says that in the Commentaries), it could've been much greater dueto his twisting of many characters, which was an abomination that must've had JRR Tolkien rolling over in his grave:
Gandalf arrogantly pushing Pippin aside & rolling his eyes as Pippin offers 'fealty' to Denethor, let alone when he smashes Denethor in the face with his staff.....
Aragorn not wanting to be king......
Elrond the Super Grouch......
Sauron the Lighthouse......
Frodo wandering around The Two Towers like a zombie & worst of all, "Go home, Sam." 
And this two bit director is essential to a great Hobbit movie?
Right!
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Farawyn
Nargothrond
Jan 31 2008, 9:21pm
Post #25 of 132
(1888 views)
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*************
Disclaimer: The author of this message does not guarantee correct grammar, spelling or English usage. No responsibility can be accepted for the use of this message as a guide to written English.
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Very Comforting Thoughts
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