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Arannir
Doriath
Nov 14 2013, 6:32pm
Post #1 of 56
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Massive SPOILER(S) for DoS
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They come from the German "Cinema" magazine and are summarized here on a German website.
However, they (CINEMA) have been wrong in the past, so I guess at least a pinch of salt is no mistake ;)
http://www.herr-der-ringe-film.de/...ilme/news_112132.php
Summary in English of the main points
AGAIN: SPOILERS (and one of them a huge one)
- after saving each other during the fight (which was shot mainly in September of 2011) against the spiders, Kili courts Tauriel
- Beorn will be peculiar and grouchy
- DoS will feature 1.900 effect shots instead of AUJ's 2136, but is also around 19 minutes shorter
- Bard's arrows will be essential for Smaug's attack AND the Bot5A ad his role in general key to the plot of TABA
- Legolas will find the pictures of Gloin's wife and son after the fight against the spiders and talk to Gloin about it
- there are hints to the Gandalf/Thorin meeting in Bree (although that was confirmed already)
- the Laketown set consists out of 54 houses
The two biggest spoilers, should all be true:
- Smaug will die in TABA
- The White Council will move against the Necromancer (however, we of course basically knew that, it doesn't really say in which movie)
“All good stories deserve embellishment."
Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.
(This post was edited by Arannir on Nov 14 2013, 6:33pm)
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Smeagol Bagginsess
Ossiriand
Nov 14 2013, 6:41pm
Post #2 of 56
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That Smaug will die in TABA?
Because I was like 99.9% sure about it even half a year ago.
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Arannir
Doriath
Nov 14 2013, 6:43pm
Post #3 of 56
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I said so from the beginning myself...
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... but there has been a lot of speculation about it on these boards and several people are convinced it needs to happen in DoS.
So I wanted to make absolutely sure noone who does not want to know something like this will not accidently read it.
“All good stories deserve embellishment."
Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.
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dave_lf
Mithlond
Nov 14 2013, 6:47pm
Post #5 of 56
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If Smaug does not die in this one, I'm going to go out on a limb and say he survives the attack on Laketown and will participate in the battle of five armies. Alternately, the attack on Laketown and the battle have been combined.
It makes no sense to begin film three with a major action scene and the death of the (heretofore) main villain.
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The Mitch King
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 6:49pm
Post #6 of 56
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I just made that thread below wondering when he will die. So I guess DG will be the big climax then?? Smaug dying at the beginning of TABA will be an awesome opener but I am bummed out we have to wait… AEDGSFGAETRGAETR!!!!!
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The Mitch King
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 6:51pm
Post #7 of 56
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A Bo5A and Laketown hybrid sounds bada**!!!
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If Smaug does not die in this one, I'm going to go out on a limb and say he survives the attack on Laketown and will participate in the battle of five armies. Alternately, the attack on Laketown and the battle have been combined.
It makes no sense to begin film three with a major action scene and the death of the (heretofore) main villain.
But unfortunately it would complicate the build up to the Bo5A.
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dave_lf
Mithlond
Nov 14 2013, 7:06pm
Post #8 of 56
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Maybe he destroys Laketown and then flies away? Maybe they think he's dead but he's not? Make they completely changed the story in order to have enough material for a third film?
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LoremIpsum
Menegroth
Nov 14 2013, 7:27pm
Post #9 of 56
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.... The Necromancer brings Smaug's carcass to life but Bo5A happens and he only manages to keep one eye for himself .. ! oops
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Elskidor
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:30pm
Post #10 of 56
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.... The Necromancer brings Smaug's carcass to life but Bo5A happens and he only manages to keep one eye for himself .. ! oops
That was leaked last week and quickly removed from the net.
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malickfan
Mithlond
Nov 14 2013, 7:39pm
Post #11 of 56
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Hmm the running time could be an issue or an improvement over AUJ
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DOS should move faster than AUJ I guess (apart from Mirkwood which will probably form a sizable amount of the film) and there are less retread locations and new characters to introduce this time around, so hopefully it will launch straight into the film. 150 minutes just feels right to me for a middle film.
One thing I am concerned about is the Dwarves being further characterized, if the film is a as fast moving and packed as has been hinted, we could see the secondary members of Thorin's company full by the wayside again.
Personally I would welcome a more tighly paced shorter theatrical cut, with an extended cut that actually adds to the film and doesn't feel bolted on-some of the scenes in AUJ (The Dwarves in the Fountain, The Goblin King's Song, Bilbo in the market) whilst nice, didn't do much for me, I'd rather have the maet of the story well done and fine tuned, rather than the soggy vegetables on the side cluttering up the plate.
I don't have much to say.
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Elskidor
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:40pm
Post #12 of 56
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the way he is suppose to? Will Bard get close to killing him and Smaug retreats, and returns for the big battle? Will his weak spot not be enough to kill him, but just weaken him?
It will seem odd if Smaug and Dol Guldur bothe end at the start of the third film, which will eat up a huge chunk of time and then battle prep and plot and then a massive massive battle (you know PJ is going to try to make it larger than ROTK)...err a lot to tie in. And there will be still a lot of story to finish after the big battle too.
Well, in less than a month I suppose we will know exactly what will be put into the third installment.
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book Gandalf
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:41pm
Post #13 of 56
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gravity was 90mins, the perfect length for a film!
This is a serious journey, not a hobbit walking-party.
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Elskidor
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:44pm
Post #14 of 56
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I don't care for short films. I consider a 6 season long TV show 1 massive poor quality film. I like my stories loooooong. 1 hour and 30 minutes? No thanks.
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Faleel
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:46pm
Post #15 of 56
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Gravity was not based of a book with some extra backstory written down in an appendice was it?
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tarasaurus
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:47pm
Post #16 of 56
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while the thought of Laketown/Smaug/BO5A is a really cool idea, I feel like that wouldn't leave much time for the whole Arkenstone plot. I feel like they would all be too distracted by all these big events that they won't have time for that story, or it would be rushed.
With the shorter theatrical time, that could leave more room for some neat extended cuts later...and I mean necessary ones 
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Elskidor
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:50pm
Post #17 of 56
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It's funny how, at one time, 2 movies was thought to be too many for the Hobbit, and now we are wondering how they are going to cram material and separate different parts of the story into movie 2 and movie 3.
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tarasaurus
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 7:54pm
Post #18 of 56
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Well I've personally been open to as many movies as they need/want; the more Middle earth the better to me  but I feel like they need to have a major event take place in DoS - I hate to compare it to LotR, but that's partly what made those movies feel so complete. I'm still rooting for Smaug's demise in DoS, but it's looking like that might not be the case 
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Bernhardina
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 8:02pm
Post #19 of 56
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Peculiar? Should we be worried?
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- Beorn will be peculiar and grouchy
Boromir: One does not simply walk into Mordor...
Gandalf: FLY, YOU FOOLS!
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Arannir
Doriath
Nov 14 2013, 8:10pm
Post #20 of 56
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I think there is no real English word for the German word they used... something between peculiar and solitary.
So not that he stands out as a weird character but someone who may not be the easiest person to get to know especially when you kind of stumpled into his realm.
“All good stories deserve embellishment."
Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.
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Rheged
Nevrast
Nov 14 2013, 8:30pm
Post #21 of 56
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I disagree: his death at the start of TABA would make sense
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It makes no sense to begin film three with a major action scene and the death of the (heretofore) main villain.
I completely disagree. The attack on Laketown would make for an exciting and fast paced start for TABA and more importantly, Smaug's death would set the stage for the rest of the film: his death is what leads to the conflict between Thorin/Dain and the men and elves, and ultimately the Battle of the Five Armies (they are all in conflict over the dragon's legacy: the treasure). So having him die in the first 20-30 minutes of TABA would work IMO.
Also, Smaug isn't THE main villain but rather one of the main villains. In the RotK EE, PJ killed off Saruman at the beginning of the film, so it has been done before in a Middle Earth film.
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There&ThereAgain
Nargothrond
Nov 14 2013, 8:36pm
Post #22 of 56
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It would be very strange to kill such an important character after only a one-film appearance as well.
The point is that Smaug's death wasn't a climax in the book either, so why would they make it that in the film?
"The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater."-J.R.R. Tolkien
"Thanks for the money!" -George Lucas
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dave_lf
Mithlond
Nov 14 2013, 8:37pm
Post #23 of 56
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In the RotK EE, PJ killed off Saruman at the beginning of the film, so it has been done before in a Middle Earth film.
He died at the start of film three, but he was defeated at the end of #2 (for Smaug, the two are indistinguishable. At least as written). Can you image if TTT had cut to the credits just as the ents marched out of Fangorn, and ROTK had begun with the attack on Isengard?
(This post was edited by dave_lf on Nov 14 2013, 8:37pm)
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Arannir
Doriath
Nov 14 2013, 8:37pm
Post #24 of 56
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I always thought Smaug dying at the beginning of TABA would nicely underline the notion of how his demise and the lust for the treasure as well as compensation and old feuds will lead to the politics that eventually almost lead to a battle among the Free Peoples. The politics aspect so to say.
“All good stories deserve embellishment."
Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.
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BornOutOfTheWest
Ossiriand
Nov 14 2013, 9:08pm
Post #25 of 56
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I can't think of anything worse (IMO) than Smaug surviving Laketown to participate in BOFA. Usually, I'm quite happy for PJ and Co to change storylines and adjust timelines, add characters and remove them because at the end of the day, they are making a film, not a page by page description of the novel. However, I really would feel like they've overstepped the line if this turns out to be true, however unlikely it may appear.
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