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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 12:59am
Post #201 of 269
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Not if the subject of that humor
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Are real-life dwarfs who have died as a result of "dwarf-tossing." It is a sickening practice, and I feel perfectly liberal and humane for being opposed to it, and for criticizing those who use it as fodder for humor.
And I don't see what is so reactionary about that. I am not saying people should not be allowed to joke about dwarf-tossing. I just reserve the right to call them insensitive if they do so.
This issue extends far beyond the bounds of political correctness. People die as a direct result of dwarf-tossing. Ha ha? Not so much.
EDIT: And when exactly were ethics divorced from liberalism? I am a liberal Democrat (in the American, not the European sense of the term) and my political philosophy is deeply grounded in a set of ethical norms regarding liberty, justice, equality and fairness. I am not an ethical relativist, which is an entirely different beast.
(This post was edited by Shelob'sAppetite on Nov 17 2012, 1:01am)
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Elenorflower
Mithlond
Nov 17 2012, 1:03am
Post #202 of 269
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I think SA did explain that he liked the odd poop joke as much as the next person. Its not that he is anti vulgarity, he is anti vulgarity and cheap laughs in Tolkien based films. Which is fair enough.
There is no need for it. In another film jokes about farting and or cake stuffing big guys would be perfectly reasonable and funny, in the Hobbit/LOTR. not so much. It kind of cheapens the atmosphere IMO.
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Bombadil
Gondolin
Nov 17 2012, 1:05am
Post #203 of 269
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Bomby Stands alone..what a Weird Thread..?
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Honestly
Tension Much?
Bomby is feeling like packing my Bags
and Heading for Rocky Mountains..
Un-Plugging from the Internet
Until.
These "Evil Winds from the East" blow over..
I'll be "Not listening ..Not until slandering each other
STOPs..
Namarie'
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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 1:07am
Post #204 of 269
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I did indeed explain that earlier in the thread. I imagine LR just missed it, which is why she may have assumed I was being disdainful. It would certainly be an understandable conclusion, if that's the case.
I also apologized to anyone that may have been inadvertently offended by my rather strong opinions. And I'll apologize again.
I'll also reiterate, just to end this silly bit of tension:
I like poop jokes. Just not in Middle Earth! 
(This post was edited by Shelob'sAppetite on Nov 17 2012, 1:09am)
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Lacrimae Rerum
Hithlum
Nov 17 2012, 1:10am
Post #205 of 269
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And they may be accepting of you.
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But that is not at issue. Those responding do not claims to be people who enjoy crude, low brow, vulgar crud and do not say that what they enjoy fits that description. (There is also no discussion of toilet humour, by the way, before we head off down that road.)
You can choose to not mind about whether people feel insulted and that is your prerogative but defining people in those terms is very likely to result in insult (as it clearly has for a number of posters).
And to be honest a phrase like "I don't care for this sort of humour in ME" does an extraordinarily similar job without the implications about those with contrary views.
LR
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Ardamírë
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 1:10am
Post #206 of 269
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Make me think of Radagast nowadays 
"...and his first memory of Middle-earth was the green stone above her breast as she sang above his cradle while Gondolin was still in flower." -Unfinished Tales
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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 1:14am
Post #207 of 269
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But those tensions seemed to have been largely resolved around page 7, where I both apologized and agreed to disagree. So, you are fanning dead flames, unfortunately. Let's just leave it there, if we can.
Here was the resolution with Faenoriel, if you're interested:
Honestly, this conversation wasn't funny at all, and I was getting bored with it anyway. Friends it is!
From now on, let us *** together in peace and harmony.
(This post was edited by Altaira on Nov 18 2012, 7:09pm)
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Lacrimae Rerum
Hithlum
Nov 17 2012, 1:15am
Post #208 of 269
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However, what SA enjoys is not at issue. Offering the comment on a stranger's partner, "It's ok, I sometimes go out with ugly people too" wouldn't be any less offensive even were it true.
LR
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Lacrimae Rerum
Hithlum
Nov 17 2012, 1:16am
Post #209 of 269
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I think you can trace the current discussion back to its source
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Very straightforwardly.
LR
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Elenorflower
Mithlond
Nov 17 2012, 1:22am
Post #210 of 269
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A hobbit was terribly overweight so her doctor put her on a strict diet,
"I want you to eat regularly for 2 days,then skip a day,& repeat this procedure for 2weeks.The next time I see you ,youl have lost at least 5pounds"
When the Hobbit returned, she shocked her doctor by losing 20 pounds.
"Why thats amazing! the Dr said,"did you follow my instructions?"
The Hobbit nodded."Il tell you though,I thought I was gonna drop dead on the 3rd day!"
"From hunger,you mean?"
"No,from skipping!"
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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 1:22am
Post #211 of 269
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As I said, I apologized for my tone earlier
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I am perfectly aware of the fact that my indelicate comments started the heated exchange. That is why I chose to apologize. So your reprimand is late, though I won't say undeserved. If I offended you in any way, you have my apologies as well.
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Tim
Dor-Lomin
Nov 17 2012, 1:54am
Post #212 of 269
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Eh, I thought the dwarf tossing joke in the movie was funny in its context
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And I liked just about all the humor in LOTR, including the hobbits farting with the lembas. I don't really think this is the place to discuss anything else more disgusting than a dwarf making a joke about being thrown about.
-Tim came by. Tim! If you had heard only a quarter of what I have heard about him, and I have only heard very little of all there is to hear, you would be prepared for any sort of remarkable tale.
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Eowyn of Penns Woods
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 1:55am
Post #213 of 269
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*ahem* Was that a deliberate typo? *eyes SA verrry suspiciously*//
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**********************************
NABOUF
Not a TORns*b!
Certified Curmudgeon
Knitting Knerd
NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Nov 17 2012, 2:22am
Post #214 of 269
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I'm putting a belated end to this subthread.
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There has been too much discussion of board members rather than the topic at hand. A reminder to everyone to please not descend to personal comments or they will be removed.
If anyone has an issue with a particular post, please alert an admin (either on Feedback or by private message) and we'll handle it.
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Ataahua's stories
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entmaiden
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Nov 17 2012, 2:29am
Post #215 of 269
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I would normally delete a response like this, since it violates our Terms of Service, however I see that others have responded, and removing your post will also take away those responses.
However, the next personal attack will be deleted, and official warnings might ensue.
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DarkJackal
Nargothrond
Nov 17 2012, 2:38am
Post #216 of 269
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The soundtrack gives me hope that much of these funny bits will be bits only. I like some of it, while some is too simple for my taste (I take no aggressive stand on anything!) but most of Shore's music grips you like a rabid warg that won't let go for hours.
The Hobbit Photo Gallery
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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 2:43am
Post #217 of 269
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I have quite a few reasons to be positive, actually.
1. The glorious soundtrack
2. Freeman's perfectness as Bilbo, and excellent comedic timing
3. What I have seen of Armitage thus far
4. Lots of Ian McKellen
5. Dwarf history (I really love this stuff)
My only real worry is that the humor invented for some of the dwarves will be so ridiculous that it spoils the soup.
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burgahobbit
Nargothrond
Nov 17 2012, 2:45am
Post #218 of 269
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I think that it is the way down into Rivendell //
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AinurOlorin
Gondolin
Nov 17 2012, 4:35am
Post #219 of 269
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It may be that he had never tried it, assumed he wouldn't like it,
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then relished it upon actually having some. . . unless he was devouring it at Bag End. . . in which case. . . foolishness.Now hang on. On the scroll, you were gleefully taking a bite out of a piece of salad. Make up your mind, Ori  Seriously though, why wouldn't the elves have meat?
"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"
"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."
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emre43
Nargothrond
Nov 17 2012, 7:08am
Post #220 of 269
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What? Why am I the one accused of a personal attack?
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I only said that what Shelob's Appetite said about not caring about other's opinion could be said by other towards his. Maybe I was inelegant in doing so but I didn't use abusive language, I didn't swear, I stated my opinion on somebody else's opinion. It just angers me when people have an opinion and they are simply dismissed, I live in a democratic country and in my country we have something called freedom of speech. I was offended myself by Shelob's Appetite's post for dismissing someone's opinion, but as we both know, he won't have a word said tohim as he is a revered poster here and I am just a greenhorn.
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dormouse
Gondolin
Nov 17 2012, 8:10am
Post #221 of 269
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It's not a case of accusing anybody of anything...
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What I'm seeing here is a tendency to build up a checklist of 'things I don't like about this film' before anyone has even seen the film. People are drawn into the flow of negativity and go along with it - isn't that what everyone thinks, and isn't it easier to go along with the crowd, and yes, good point, this or that three second clip of film seems wrong/out of keeping/not what they'd imagined. Before we know where we are, people will be going into the cinema with their judgements of the film already made - and that's not the key to enjoy it, if enjoying it is really what you want to do. It isn't for me, anyway. I know, because I went through all this before Fellowship came out, even without the help of an internet forum, and only realised I'd actually enjoyed the film after it was over.
The film will not be The Hobbit as I've imagined it, or as you have. It would be pointless and rather insular to expect that. There will be things that you or I or anyone else here would have done in another way, or not have done at all. (And please don't assume that your standards are higher than mine, or anyone else's here. They aren't. They're just different.) But surely, if you want to love the film the way to do that is to accept it as it is first. Let it unfold in front of your eyes as a whole piece of cinema - don't fight it, or try to fit it into some preconceived image of what it ought to be. Let it be what it is and look for the good in it or you won't see it, even when it's right in front of your eyes.
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emre43
Nargothrond
Nov 17 2012, 8:22am
Post #222 of 269
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I just wanted to say fair play mate and well said. I apologise as well and all the best.
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Eleniel
Dor-Lomin
Nov 17 2012, 8:27am
Post #223 of 269
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Sometimes one can enter a thread like this about the latest brief spot and it's a feeling of stepping into "The Emperor's New Clothes..." the majority seem to think what you have just watched is peerless and without reproof, you sit there wondering what it is they all see in it.
It can be incredibly encouraging to see even a few dissenting voices who seem to have had the same reaction as you! 
"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort
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dormouse
Gondolin
Nov 17 2012, 9:08am
Post #224 of 269
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I suppose it depends which direction you want to be encouraged in.....
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imin
Doriath
Nov 17 2012, 9:14am
Post #225 of 269
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That's one way of looking at it
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Another is that it keeps expectations more in check with reality. Most people here myself included loved the lord of the rings trilogy so much so that one cant help feel that this movie is going to be the best thing ever and will repeat how i felt about the lord of the rings or even top it.
People's 'negative' comments are just their worries as they want it to be good but dont have much at all to go on and so over analyse every little piece of information, screen shot or 30 second clip of reworked footage.
When the film is released and we are sitting in the cinema, people wont have time to sit and ponder the look of a certain shot as it will be seen then gone - it will be much more a case of just experiencing the movie and suspending ones disbelief than running through a mental checklist or noting with pen and paper the errors of the film.
Personally i see far more positivity for this film than negativity and i feel there is more 'pressure' to be positive even if i think something looks rubbish. Doesnt mean i have made judgements on the film it just means my unrealistically high expectations are brought back to a level which it should be. There are many on here who are so satisfied with everything they have seen so far it makes me think they would like anything that was put out by PJ and the studio, now maybe PJ's humour and theirs is an exact fit but they havent seen the film either yet so maybe they should hang back on having an opinion on the film otherwise they might not realise they didnt enjoy it until it was over and feel really sad? Its like we cant have an opinion as we havent seen anything - actually we have seen a little bit and from that people are commenting. I doubt many have fully made up their minds over the film - if they have then they wont go if they think it looks bad.
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