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DanielLB
Elvenhome
Sep 4 2012, 2:59pm
Post #1 of 58
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Some new(ish) spoilers and snippets
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This website has an article up with some new spoilers (some old, some speculation) from this years DragonCon, during TORn's panel.
The most interesting bits:
Although Sylvester McCoy as Radagast the Brown is rumored to have been included in the London filming of the White Council scene with Saruman, Gandalf, Galadriel, and Elrond (pictured above), he was not in White Council scenes screened at this year's San Diego Comic Con.
Figwit returns! Bret Mackenzie will appear in The Hobbit as Lindir, an elf in Rivendell who is present during a poetry reading by Bilbo at Elrond's house.
Thrain and Thror appear in the first film and we will most likely see them in earlier (and happier) times as part of sequences that illustrate the dwarven race of Middle-earth in its glory days. The panel was split on whether we'll see the history of Moria, such as the battle at the Gates of Moria.
We'll see Legolas and his father Thranduil spar.
What Smaug looks like is being kept a complete secret. During a five-week stint that Larry Curtis, the DragonCon Tolkien track coordinator, spent working on The Hobbit there were absolutely no trace of the dragon anywhere on or off set. The offices of illustrators John Howe and Alan Lee were similarly vacant of Smaug sketches.
And most importantly:
The OneRing folks also revealed some exclusive set pics, but requested that they continue to be kept hush-hush
Come on TORN .... hand 'em over!!!
(This post was edited by DanielLB on Sep 4 2012, 3:01pm)
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Carne
Dor-Lomin
Sep 4 2012, 3:04pm
Post #2 of 58
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I heard Smaug is going to be about the size of Laketown
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Ardamírë
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 3:14pm
Post #3 of 58
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Except keeping the pictures from us! 
Radagast - so his inclusion in the White Council is still unknown. But since I assume there will be more than one council scene, it's very possible he's in some but not all of them.
Now who all was filming in London? The report makes it sound like perhaps Cate, Ian, and Hugo all went to London. That would be great.
Figwit - seems like the poetry scene from LOTR will just be lifted seamlessly into The Hobbit. Sounds good to me. 
Thrain & Thror - figured we'd get them in AUJ. Can't wait to see Erebor in all it's glory. I'm sure the Dale set will be part of this scene.
Legolas & Thranduil - sounds cool. It was awesome seeing them training together in the vlog.
Smaug - so glad he's be kept secret. It's as it should be!
"...and his first memory of Middle-earth was the green stone above her breast, as she sang above his cradle while Gondolin was still in flower."
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dave_lf
Mithlond
Sep 4 2012, 3:18pm
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I suspect the writer just looked Lindir up on the internet, and that's what he got based on the scene in LotR. But it is certainly possible that The Hobbit will include a scene of Bilbo reading a poem to Lindir as a sort of homage.
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Kangi Ska
Gondolin
Sep 4 2012, 3:26pm
Post #5 of 58
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Perhaps the size of a B52 Bomber?
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Anyway, I will wager that Smaug is bigger than a breadbox.
Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.
At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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Ardamírë
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 3:27pm
Post #6 of 58
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The vlogs show a feast in Rivendell.
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I wouldn't be surprised if the poem is read then. Very likely I think.
"...and his first memory of Middle-earth was the green stone above her breast, as she sang above his cradle while Gondolin was still in flower."
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mandel
Ossiriand
Sep 4 2012, 3:30pm
Post #7 of 58
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...Benedict Cumberbatch said that Smaug is the size of the Empire State Building. But it might very well have been an off-hand hyperbole...
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dormouse
Gondolin
Sep 4 2012, 3:32pm
Post #8 of 58
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I like the idea of a poetry reading...
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Missed the Hall of Fire in 'Fellowship'
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Earl
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Sep 4 2012, 3:41pm
Post #9 of 58
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... given that when he goes down, he takes pretty much the entire town with him
The Plan 9 Interview... in celebration of the 10th anniversary of the release of The Fellowship of the Ring.
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Earl
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Sep 4 2012, 3:43pm
Post #10 of 58
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That "poetry reading" needs, I think, different punctuation to make proper sense...
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... I think the writer is trying to describe who Lindir is, so what he meant to say is "Bret Mackenzie will appear in The Hobbit as Lindir, an elf in Rivendell who [according to the book] is present during a poetry reading by Bilbo at Elrond's house."
I don't think the writer is saying that Bilbo will actually do a poetry reading with Lindir watching over.
The Plan 9 Interview... in celebration of the 10th anniversary of the release of The Fellowship of the Ring.
(This post was edited by Earl on Sep 4 2012, 3:44pm)
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 3:48pm
Post #11 of 58
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At of the time that the company reaches Rivendell, Bilbo should not have reached the point of reciting poetry. That would really lessen the theme of his growth and change.
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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mandel
Ossiriand
Sep 4 2012, 3:49pm
Post #12 of 58
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Some speculation about Gandalf on this basis of this article
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Late in the article, it says:
The movies focus on the journies of three characters: Bilbo Baggins, Thorin Oakenshield, and Gandalf. The panel was very insistent that Thorin will not be portrayed as a supporting character; that is he is absolutely a main character in these films. Bilbo and Thorin's journies have emotional arcs to them, while Gandalf is more plot-heavy.
Now, based on the wording here, it seems to me that the 'journies' of these characters will not simply be literal journeys, but character development arcs.
If this is right, then I wonder, in particular, what Gandalf's character arc will be. It's clear in the novel what the basic character developments are for Bilbo and Thorin, but not so much for Gandalf. What is his character arc going to be for the films?
Here's some speculation. As people have been pointing out in the current Reading Room discussion of TH, in the novel, Gandalf is confident, even flippant and arrogant at times in TH. But in the LOTR, his character is much more somber and serious. One important character arc for him might lie in this change. Encountering the Necromancer and making the sobering discovery that he's Sauron might very well cause a deep change in Gandalf's outlook.
As far as I know, there isn't any indication in Tolkien's work that the Istari know precisely what their tasks are in being sent to Middle-Earth. I can imagine Gandalf, upon discovering that Sauron has returned, undergoing the realization that *this* is his task - that he hasn't been sent to Middle-Earth just to aid in the minor squabbles and trials of its people, but to be a leader in the final battle against the last remnant of Morgoth's rebellion. This indeed would naturally be a character-altering moment for him, and would explain the personality change from TH to LOTR.
Seem plausible?
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TomthePilgrim
Nargothrond
Sep 4 2012, 4:14pm
Post #13 of 58
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. . . and smaller than the Lonely Mountain!
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We'll win both bets . . .
The Road goes ever on and on
Down from the door where it began
Now far ahead the Road has gone
And I must follow, if I can
"Thorin sat up with a start. 'Something is not right,' he muttered to himself as he stood up and
looked towards the mirror . . . . . . . . . 'Durin's bones', he gasped, 'what's happened to my beard?'"
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Fardragon
Nargothrond
Sep 4 2012, 4:17pm
Post #14 of 58
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Suggests there is little development of Gandalf's character.
Stuff happens that involves Gandalf.
A Far Dragon is the best kind...
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mandel
Ossiriand
Sep 4 2012, 4:22pm
Post #15 of 58
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...I was just stretching for an idea.
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DanielLB
Elvenhome
Sep 4 2012, 4:38pm
Post #16 of 58
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It was quite a journey just getting to Rivendell!
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Carne
Dor-Lomin
Sep 4 2012, 4:49pm
Post #17 of 58
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Really hope we get to see those pictures soon!
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Or at least someone can tell what was shown?
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Radagast-Aiwendil
Mithlond
Sep 4 2012, 4:54pm
Post #18 of 58
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Whilst I want to see as much of Radagast as possible, I hope that he is not clearly portrayed as a member of the White Council (i.e. he's not at their meetings). This is simply for the purposes of accuracy to the source material, as Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel and Saruman are the only people who were *definitely* members.
Of course, the location of Rhosgobel is close enough to Dol Guldur to suggest that Radagast would almost certainly have been involved in the attack, and undoubtedly he'll be there (and might even die).
"Radagast is, of course, a worthy wizard, a master of shapes and changes of hue, and he has much lore of herbs and beasts, and birds are especially his friends."-Gandalf, The Lord of the Rings.
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dormouse
Gondolin
Sep 4 2012, 5:16pm
Post #19 of 58
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That's true. But I'd just like to see the Hall of Fire in operation. Maybe if someone else were to do the reciting....?
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HiddenSpring
Menegroth
Sep 4 2012, 5:24pm
Post #20 of 58
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The Goblin King as the big Film 1 baddy --- love this!
Looks like the Goblintown scenes will be given the Moria treatment; they definitely won't be as short as in the book.
Radagast as the link between Bilbo's and Gandalf's storylines is an interesting idea.
The Necromancer will be in all three films.... so maybe The Battle of Dol Guldur will be at the beginning of film 3?
And confirmation that we will have three lead characters - Bilbo, Gandalf and Thorin.
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There&ThereAgain
Nargothrond
Sep 4 2012, 5:26pm
Post #21 of 58
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the hair-brushing scene from the trailer could play into this idea.
I mean were we ever supposed to get into the psychological headspace of Gandalf? Did Tolkien even care to?
"The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater."-J.R.R. Tolkien
"Thanks for the money!" -George Lucas
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 5:29pm
Post #22 of 58
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Would be for it to happen in the return to Rivendell, in the third film.
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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Shelob'sAppetite
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 5:31pm
Post #23 of 58
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He's still an uber-prosaic hobbit at that time.
Makes me wonder if PJ and company really understand the material...
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Sep 4 2012, 5:35pm
Post #24 of 58
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As Earl points out, mostly likely this snippet is based on some description of Lindir from his role in LOTR.
Although there are plenty of other examples that we can point that show either a lack of understanding of the material, or at least a willingness to deviate from the material (e.g., Aragorn beheading the MoS).
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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dormouse
Gondolin
Sep 4 2012, 5:56pm
Post #25 of 58
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Oh yes - that really would be good
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It would delight me if the ending could be as gentle and measured as it is in the book. It would round things off nicely.
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