|
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Frodo's Pearl
The Shire
May 24 2011, 5:50pm
Post #1 of 35
(7442 views)
Shortcut
|
|
What Type of Accent Does Frodo Have?
|
Can't Post
|
|
Lately I've been wondering, if Henry Higgins from "My Fair Lady" happened to meet (Elijah Wood's) Frodo, where would he guess he was from?
I've been looking for a definite answer to the question of what type of British accent did the film makers give Frodo. I read somewhere that they had given the hobbits the Gloucestershire accent, but obviously Frodo's accent is rather different than say, Sam's; I'm no accent expert, so I cannot tell who has what. (Can you tell I'm American?  ) So, are there any experts or fellow geeks out there that help me out with my question? Thanks muchly!
Yes, you have seen a thing or two since you last peeped out of a looking-glass. ~Frodo, FotR --- ..May you come to realize that insignificant as you may seem in this great universe, you are an important part of God's plan. May He watch over you and keep you safe from harm. ~Roma Downey
Artisan of the Shire
|
|
|
Junesong
Rohan
May 24 2011, 9:06pm
Post #2 of 35
(6367 views)
Shortcut
|
|
He's got one of those American accents
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Referring to Elijah's accent in LOTR as British is pretty generous.
"Tim... Canterbury... Canterbury Tales... Chaucer... Shakespeare."
|
|
|
Kangi Ska
Half-elven
May 24 2011, 9:24pm
Post #3 of 35
(6304 views)
Shortcut
|
Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.
At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
|
|
|
Bumblingidiot
Rohan
May 24 2011, 11:52pm
Post #4 of 35
(6451 views)
Shortcut
|
Referring to Elijah's accent in LOTR as British is pretty generous.
It was actually very good. It would be called a 'Home Counties' accent - ie. the area around and including London, although more accurately, it would be described as English received pronunciation (RP, as taught at RADA etc) , sometimes known as a 'BBC accent', which is the standard accent of the middle classes over much of Britain. He did it very well, and it didn't get in the way of his role. Likewise, Mr Mortensen's seemed effortless. Mr Astin's seemed forced at times, and he often lost it - it came across as an impersonation of a West Country accent, although to be fair to him, most English actors can't do it either (have a watch of Doc Martin, for example, or anything else set south west of Bristol.
|
|
|
Wraith Buster
Gondor
May 25 2011, 2:48pm
Post #5 of 35
(6292 views)
Shortcut
|
They had to have Pip say "Get down!" in Fellowship because when Sean would say it every time it was like "Git dowin".  I thought Elijah did pretty good. Sometimes you could see through it a little but overall it was convincing.
Pedich Edhellen? Lau? Hria cuilė.
End of line.
|
|
|
Gimli'sBox
Gondor
May 25 2011, 2:49pm
Post #6 of 35
(6260 views)
Shortcut
|
Or was it Idaho? Anyway, it doesn't matter.../
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Some who have read the book, or at any rate have reviewed it, have found it boring, absurd, or contemptible; and I have no cause to complain, since I have similar opinions of their works, or of the kinds of writing they evidently prefer.
I'm a user. I'll improvise. -Sam Flynn, TRON: Legacy
|
|
|
Twit
Lorien
May 25 2011, 8:33pm
Post #7 of 35
(6300 views)
Shortcut
|
just a bit posh. RP is like the Queen I believe. I didn't really mind Frodo's accent but I have waffled on many a time about Sam's. I am from the West COuntry and and so I know how tooth itchingly bad it really is.
I found Viggo's accent not that great TBH. (and he sounds like kermit sometimes)
|
|
|
Kangi Ska
Half-elven
May 25 2011, 9:53pm
Post #8 of 35
(6216 views)
Shortcut
|
|
El Wood is fom Cedar Rapids Iowa
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
and it makes a big difference to the people of Iowa and Idaho (And I might also add Ohio & Hawaii)
Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.
At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
|
|
|
Kangi Ska
Half-elven
May 25 2011, 9:56pm
Post #9 of 35
(6232 views)
Shortcut
|
Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.
At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
|
|
|
Gimli'sBox
Gondor
May 26 2011, 2:32am
Post #11 of 35
(6226 views)
Shortcut
|
|
I was referring to the Easter Egg w/ Dom...//
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Some who have read the book, or at any rate have reviewed it, have found it boring, absurd, or contemptible; and I have no cause to complain, since I have similar opinions of their works, or of the kinds of writing they evidently prefer.
I'm a user. I'll improvise. -Sam Flynn, TRON: Legacy
|
|
|
taekotemple
Grey Havens
May 26 2011, 5:28am
Post #12 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
|
|
I just made my mom watch that easter egg the other day!
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
I laugh so hard every time I watch it... especially the part where Dom says that Flipper died in a car accident. I keep picturing a scene like on the Saturday Night Live Toonces the driving cat skits. "Flipper, look out!"
|
|
|
Loresilme
Valinor
May 26 2011, 2:09pm
Post #13 of 35
(6259 views)
Shortcut
|
|
I thought his accent was done very well and
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
in particular, it was very consistent. I did notice Sam's dropped from time to time (e.g. "Those wraiths are still out there!"). Also Viggo's was inconsistent, sometimes very flowing, very well done, sometimes not.
But I thought Elijah's was really well done and I never noticed, ever, that it wavered.
Some posters here seem very critical of Elijah's accent. Could someone please provide an example of why they think so -- where they felt it fell flat or was off the mark?
|
|
|
Gimli'sBox
Gondor
May 26 2011, 5:02pm
Post #14 of 35
(6217 views)
Shortcut
|
|
I thought it was the funniest Easter Egg I've seen but,
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
I wish they would have left some stuff out. I'm not a big fan of crude humor and I think it would have been funny enough without it. Dom did great on the accent though!
Some who have read the book, or at any rate have reviewed it, have found it boring, absurd, or contemptible; and I have no cause to complain, since I have similar opinions of their works, or of the kinds of writing they evidently prefer.
I'm a user. I'll improvise. -Sam Flynn, TRON: Legacy
|
|
|
Starling
Half-elven
May 27 2011, 7:03pm
Post #15 of 35
(6219 views)
Shortcut
|
|
He totally sounds like Kermit when he is talking about the ring
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
I think the line is, "It has no other master".
I always makes me laugh!
|
|
|
Bumblingidiot
Rohan
May 27 2011, 11:54pm
Post #16 of 35
(6211 views)
Shortcut
|
just a bit posh. RP is like the Queen I believe. I didn't really mind Frodo's accent but I have waffled on many a time about Sam's. I am from the West COuntry and and so I know how tooth itchingly bad it really is.
I found Viggo's accent not that great TBH. (and he sounds like kermit sometimes)
The Queen used to be a bit too posh for RP - the traditional upper class accent is not RP - think 'hellay' instead of 'hello', or 'orff' instead of 'off'. Now, according to the scientists, she's gone a bit down market, so is closer to actual RP.
Elija's accent was RP (the current, modern version) - a derivation of the traditional version, as used by news readers such as Sir Trevor Mc Donald and Moira Stewart and Alvar Lidell.
http://www.islandfarm.fsnet.co.uk/HOMEPAGE/BBC%20News%20Report%20Of%20Escape.mp3.
Viggo's accent may have had some influences (Danish?), but his character is supposed to be of foreign descent, and not using his ancestral language (a bit like the Norman's or the Romans perhaps, a few generations after they came and settled in Britain?).
|
|
|
frederica bolger
Lorien
May 28 2011, 8:47pm
Post #17 of 35
(6133 views)
Shortcut
|
|
...well, he could learn from the masters...
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Not just one, but TWO perfect wordsmiths (the two Sir Ians). I think where his accent comes out best is in the scene with Boromir (and it would seem like wisdom but for the warning in my heart). There were some slightly American 'r's' but I can't now remember where exactly.
Rain may fall and wind may blow
And many miles be still to go
But under a tall tree I will lie
And watch the clouds go sailing by.
|
|
|
taekotemple
Grey Havens
May 28 2011, 8:58pm
Post #18 of 35
(6205 views)
Shortcut
|
|
Yeah, the British R and the American R can be so different.
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Sometimes when I listen to the Queen's English, I often hear extra "r's" that aren't spelled into the word. For example, sometimes when someone with a British accent says water, it sounds like warter to me. But then, when I listen to an American doing a British accent and they leave out those extra "r's," I don't notice it at all and accept it as a normal part of the accent. I think that's what makes it hard for me, as an American viewer, to really identify when an American actor is doing a British accent justice.
However, I do notice when someone doesn't get an American accent right. I couldn't stand Orlando Bloom's American accent in Elizabethtown because it sounded too precise and generic. Which is funny, as when I was taking singing lessons for a musical I was in, I was taught to sing with a quasi British accent, because it would help the words sound clearer and more precise. So I'm thinking that sound of precision in Orlando's attempt on the American accent is related to his natural accent.
I think all of these things explain why trying to speak in another accent intimidates me. I'm always so impressed when someone does it well, like Hugh Laurie.
|
|
|
Wraith Buster
Gondor
May 29 2011, 1:49am
Post #19 of 35
(6226 views)
Shortcut
|
I did a literal LOL when I read this. So true...
Pedich Edhellen? Lau? Hria cuilė.
End of line.
|
|
|
MissBaggins
Bree
May 30 2011, 2:37pm
Post #20 of 35
(6118 views)
Shortcut
|
Frodo's accent in the movies isn't actually a 'real' accent. Known as Received Pronunciation (RP), it was created by the BBC as a means of broadcasting an accent which is audible to all regional dialects. There is a common misunderstanding that RP is the established accent of the upper and sometimes middle classes - in truth accent goes by region rather than by social standing (I believe American accents do likewise?) Accents such as the Queen's are often the result of elocution lessons, and it is from this accent that RP was developed.
My guess is that Elijah chose RP because it is the easiest for an American to grasp - many British actors (including yours truly) opt for 'General American' for much the same reasons. Also, because the LOTR movies were being marketed on a global scale, the actors were probably advised to select accents that non-English speakers could understand.
In response to your question, Professor Higgins would probably commend Elijah's Frodo on his flawless pronunciation, but point out that the way that he places the emphasis on certain words and his overall expression is very American!
The Road goes ever on and on...
|
|
|
Loresilme
Valinor
May 30 2011, 3:23pm
Post #21 of 35
(6084 views)
Shortcut
|
Thank you kindly MissBaggins! This was a very interesting explanation for how accents are 'done' in movies. I'd never heard of "RP". Being very American :-), I thought Frodo's accent seemed really well done - so I like the way you put it "it is the easiest for an American to grasp'. Definitely that was the case with me. Now as for "General American", I am so curious about that! Is that considered to be a regional American accent? I recall when Chris Helmsworth played Kirk's father in ST that I got caught something just the littlest bit odd about the mid-western emphasis, but I couldn't place it. I still thought it was real. So I was pleasantly shocked to learn he was Aussie. Because, lol, that's what movies are supposed to do - make you believe what you're seeing and hearing :-).
And I was also curious about how Elijah's/Frodo's emphasis of certain words was American rather than British. Now you have me thinking about the young actors in the Harry Potter films, obviously their accents are authentic :-). It would be interesting to compare how Elijah/Frodo would say a phrase compared to how Daniel Radcliffe/Harry P would say it.
Interesting topic!
|
|
|
Frodo's Pearl
The Shire
May 30 2011, 4:56pm
Post #22 of 35
(6093 views)
Shortcut
|
Thank you for your input eveyone; I've been doing research, and finally came across the man himself, Andrew Jack, who was the dialect coach in LotR, and it seems like it's true what you were saying about him having an RP-sort of accent. If you're interested, you can read more on certain LotR characters' accent types right here: http://www.andrewjack.com/projlotrar.htm
Yes, you have seen a thing or two since you last peeped out of a looking-glass. ~Frodo, FotR --- ..May you come to realize that insignificant as you may seem in this great universe, you are an important part of God's plan. May He watch over you and keep you safe from harm. ~Roma Downey
Artisan of the Shire
|
|
|
taekotemple
Grey Havens
May 30 2011, 8:48pm
Post #23 of 35
(6083 views)
Shortcut
|
|
What MissBaggins was referring to as "General American"
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
My aunt, with her theater training, has taught me a lot about training in dialect, or accents. I'm not sure if MissBaggins is referring to Standard American, which is based on the regional dialects of the Northeastern part of the US, or if she's going by current Hollywood usage. If she's going by Standard American, it's not quite in use the way it used to be... you find it more in the old Black and White film days and early color.
For the past few decades, though (probably starting in the late 60's to early 70's), there has been less emphasis on Standard American. What is generally used in Hollywood films right now is a little more like a standard Californian accent, so to speak, although it seems like the films of the past few decades have allowed for actors to just speak the way they naturally speak, unless it's necessary for the character they play to have a particular accent or if their original accent is difficult to understand.
The pressure for actors to speak Standard American came about with the advent of sound in motion pictures. If you ever watch "Singin' in the Rain," that film has some fun views regarding the impact of sound on the actors' performances.
All of this brings to mind how in Hollywood, British accents (most likely RP) have been used as the accent that villains have. I'm sure there's definitely a role that US revolutionary history plays in that choice being made. It seems like this is changing, and RP is being used as a standard for historical films that don't even take place in Great Britain. Isn't it weird to watch a movie that takes place in ancient Rome and people are speaking in RP?
|
|
|
MissBaggins
Bree
May 30 2011, 9:00pm
Post #24 of 35
(6110 views)
Shortcut
|
General American is the Transatlantic version of RP that most non-Americans find easiest to understand. I met some American actors recently. One was from Chicago, one from Texas and the other from New York. They all spoke with General American accents, and I understood them perfectly. I then asked them to demonstrate their native state dialects, and suddenly I was having to really listen to comprehend what they were saying. (My Yorkshire accent was equally as strange to them!)
With regard to Elijah Wood's vocal performance... it's quite difficult to explain, but I'll do the best I can. When Elijah delivers his lines, he tends to sound as if he ought to be speaking with an American accent - despite the fact that his pronunciation is so perfect. This is because of a difference in the way Americans and the English say sentences. This difference only slight, but crucial. Americans speak more directly, driving the energy through to the end of the sentence (often causing them to inflect down at the end of the sentence). This results in a slower tempo. The English do the complete opposite: inflecting up and therefore not sounding as direct. When emphasising certain words, an American will increase in volume where the English alter in pitch. It is this that gives Elijah's nationality away; otherwise his diction, placement of voice and tone are very, very convincing.
I hope this makes sense; it's a difficult topic to explain without being able to demonstrate!
The Road goes ever on and on...
|
|
|
MissBaggins
Bree
May 30 2011, 9:26pm
Post #25 of 35
(6085 views)
Shortcut
|
a sort of 'basic' American dialect taught to actors in the UK. It sounds convincing to the English ear, and acts as a great starting point for mastering more complex American dialects.
The Road goes ever on and on...
|
|
|
|
|
1
