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ringers rock!
Ossiriand
Aug 1 2009, 5:15pm
Post #1 of 14
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Why Vampires Never Die - article by Del Toro
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I did a quick prowl and didn't see this posted. Really cool article and my respect for the author continues to swell. He's marking across so many platforms it's hard to keep up! Just how I like 'em
Why Vampires Never Die - Times, Global Edition
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weaver
Gondolin
Aug 3 2009, 4:40pm
Post #2 of 14
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If it was posted somewhere already, I didn't see it either -- so thanks!
I'm betting GDT could write a similar article on dragons -- he really does have a very fine sense of the value/appeal of monsters, doesn't he?
Weaver
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MrCere
Sr. Staff
Aug 3 2009, 9:55pm
Post #3 of 14
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I have no choice but to believe in free will.
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
My blog
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greendragon
Sr. Staff
Aug 4 2009, 8:53pm
Post #4 of 14
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Interesting stuff - and very well written. I especially liked the idea that 'the only remote place remains within' - so true.
The only point I would add - it isn't known for sure that Polidori was, indeed, at that famed gathering which led to Mary Shelley's nightmare and subsequent writing of 'Frankenstein'. He later claimed that he had been there, and as Byron's constant companion, he may well have been. However, what is less certain is that 'The Vampyre' was a direct result of the 'let's write a scary story' competition. Again, Polidori only claimed, later, that it was. Ever one to try to live off Byron's reflected glory, he stated (after the poet's death, I believe) that the story was part of that evening's challenge - which led to its brief fame. 'Lord Ruthven' may well have been based on Byron, and Polidori may indeed have felt that the dashing, thrilling nobleman was some kind of parasite, sucking Polidori's life blood as the doctor tended to the poet's every need; but one could argue that Polidori was more the vampire in that situation, trying to boost his own cold life by feeding on Byron's brightly burning flame, even writing him into his fiction in order to have Byron's energy infect(!) his story. Either way, what little we know of Polidori's true life story gives us an interesting parallel to the vampire tale he created.
Another fascinating, early vampire novella (about twenty years pre-'Dracula') is le Fanu's Carmilla, from which most lesbian vampire stories can claim their ancestory. I also liked GDT and Hogan's comment that, 'if there are demons in our midst, there surely must be angels lurking nearby as well.' This reminded me of the Supernatural panel at ComicCon, at which Eric Kripke (producer/creator) commented that he had always said there would NEVER be angels in Supernatural. Inevitably, however, they came along - you can't have a show about demons without angels cropping up sooner or later!
Good stuff. I love the hold the vampire has on our collective subconcious, so I was fascinated to read these remarks. Thanks for posting it, RR!
'There are older and fouler things than orcs in the deep places of my fridge...'
'You never know what will happen next, when once you get mixed up with TORnsibs and their friends.'
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Guillermo
Ossiriand
Aug 5 2009, 7:59pm
Post #5 of 14
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Thank You for your kind words and notes. It is true that little evidence can be offered about Polidori's stay in the Villa. But by now most people choose to print the legend. A curious anecdote: Years ago, in the golden age of EBAY, I was OUTBID by the University of Copenhagen in bidding for the famed Lord Byron retraction letter in which he disowns Polidori's story. From this bidding war emerged a brief correspondence with other bidders that illuminated that, in fact, a few contemporary documents place Polidori at the crime scene at the time it was commited, so- hopefully we will find out. A few fascinating essays and novels have emerged about that Summer. I am currently reading MONSTERS (which I find highly entertaining.) and more will, I am sure.
I DID write a similar essay about Dragons. You may look for it as the PROLOGUE to John Howe's FORGING DRAGONS! And perhaps someone will be charitable enough to post it here.
In "The Strain" we also do a brief hommage to "The Visitor in the Storm" which is the most famous chapter of "Varney The Vampire" which along with Le Fanu's "Carmilla" remains the most popular precursor of Dracula. Before these writings it is inarguably that Vampires were more often peasant creatures, Unholy Carrion that feed from the living but very often were just a nuisance (kicking and biting people, often in the bottom) and not so often nobleman in castles.
Yr Obt Svt
GDT
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Jettorex
Menegroth
Aug 5 2009, 9:07pm
Post #6 of 14
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quite a hallucinegenic fever dream of a movie.
Polidori is portrayed in it as being there.
- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
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greendragon
Sr. Staff
Aug 5 2009, 9:15pm
Post #7 of 14
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How fascinating to have that insight into Byron's letter and various other documents. What an intriguing pair Byron and Polidori make; I have always been a huge fan of Byron's writing but only more recently became interested in Polidori.
It is also an interesting literary pathway that the Vampire took - from peasant creature of oral legend to noble (man or woman!) of the written medium. Given that the gothic novel (it could be argued), in the Romantic period, was the form which first moved supernatural and demonic forces from their peasant, folkloric origin and placed them firmly in the domain of the educated upperclasses (reflecting their fears of social upheaval, in the wake of the French Revolution), it was surely only a matter of time before the Vampire found his own place in this educated realm. Joining the upperclasses during a time of anxiety and social change, however, was not enough to give him universal appeal; it took the Victorians and their continuous need covertly to express the sexual (whilst covering up piano legs!) to make the Vampire a real star! Thus the Vampire has always been a kind of zeitgeist, and as your article points out, he continues to be so, confirming his place in pop culture today. Only now there seems to be desire for sparkle in our vampires - a backlash against the recession, perhaps...?? 
I should add that your own movie, 'Cronos', is my personal favourite vampire movie. A great twist to the genre.
I just bought 'Forging Dragons' whilst I was at ComicCon, and I look forward to reading your Prologue. If I can find a moment, I will type it up and post it here - although very likely another TORnsib will beat me to it!
Thanks for gracing us with your presence, sir! 
'There are older and fouler things than orcs in the deep places of my fridge...'
'You never know what will happen next, when once you get mixed up with TORnsibs and their friends.'
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entmaiden
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Aug 5 2009, 9:54pm
Post #8 of 14
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I hadn't really thought about how the gothic novel could be a catalyst for improving the social status of vampires, but it makes sense. I have a friend who collects the gothic novels of Jane Austen's time, and I've always wanted to read them. Might have to look harder for them now.
My first vampire was Barnabas Collins of Dark Shadows, and he of course was upper class. I read Stoker's Dracula several years later. I learned that the immortality conferred upon vampires also gives them the ability to amass enormous wealth - stealing from their victims and taking advantage of compound interest .
Each cloak was fastened about the neck with a brooch like a green leaf veined with silver.
`Are these magic cloaks? ' asked Pippin, looking at them with wonder.
`I do not know what you mean by that,' answered the leader of the Elves.
NARF since 1974.
Balin Bows
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weaver
Gondolin
Aug 5 2009, 10:53pm
Post #9 of 14
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I would love to read GDT's dragon essay and I bet others would too -- I did not realize it was in the John Howe book..
I have an Amazon gift certificate sitting here, so guess what I'm going to buy,..so I can post it later if you or someone else doesn't get to it first...
I bet if we put it on the Hobbit board it would get a great response!
Weaver
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Buchanicus
Menegroth
Aug 6 2009, 12:18am
Post #10 of 14
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TORn member formally known as ryan1976.
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Buchanicus
Menegroth
Aug 6 2009, 1:26am
Post #11 of 14
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I DID write a similar essay about Dragons. You may look for it as the PROLOGUE to John Howe's FORGING DRAGONS! And perhaps someone will be charitable enough to post it here.
I went ahead and did just that (see new thread).
TORn member formally known as ryan1976.
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agutierrez20
Lindon
Aug 6 2009, 6:35pm
Post #12 of 14
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Sorry about going off topic here GDT, I purchased the english copy of the Strain and someone gave me the spanish version as a gift, I haven't started reading the book cause frankly I don't know which version should I read, I'm afraid of the translation in the spanish version as I've had horrible experiences with translations. Should I stick to the english version?
Thanks!
A.G.
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Guillermo
Ossiriand
Aug 7 2009, 6:47pm
Post #13 of 14
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If given a choice- stick to the original English version. 100%
We wrote it that way.
And, Buchanicus-
My Sincere Thanks
GDT
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Garfeimao
Nargothrond
Aug 27 2009, 4:35pm
Post #14 of 14
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I find it so interesting that some people really like the dark hero aspect of vampires, such as Lestat and Nick Knight, and other rather tormented immortal vamps, while others really like the monster that a vampire can be. And some of us rather like both, which may just mean we are very confused.
I'm not sure if Bela Lugosi was my first vampire, or if it was Christopher Lee in those Hammer movies. I do recall watching a lot of those when I was a kid, and I do mean I was a little kid. Not entirely age appropriate, but I was fond of them. And then there were all the goofs with Abbot and Costello meet Dracula and the like.
I haven't read some of the older novels, except Stoker's Dracula, so it might be interesting to read some of the other Vampire as monster stories. I did read Strain, and I must say, it's not a good idea to start reading that on a plane. Talk about creepy.
Peace, Love and Rock & Roll,
Garfeimao
The orange stripey One
Cruise to Middle earth
My page in the Traveling Journal
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