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weaver
Gondolin
Jan 11 2009, 5:44pm
Post #1 of 13
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Homeward Bound 7 -- Final Questions and Wrap-up
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Now that we've taken this chapter apart, let's look at a it as a whole again, in terms of how it fits in with the rest of the tale, and along some other lines of musing as well.
Here are a few final observations and questions for your Reading Room pleasure:
1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles? I ask because they all emerge as unexpected guides to help the hobbits. Tolkien also has someone point out that each of them are more than what they seem. (Several people say that about Tom, Tom talks about Maggot like this, and Gandalf about Butterbur). Would it be going too far to call Maggot and Butterbur minor "masters" of their realms, in the same way Tom is a major one with a capital M in his?
2. Butterbur's responses to the trouble at Bree seem pretty similar to how people respond to terrorism today -- he doesn't relate to it until it shows up in his land, and then, he has a knee jerk reaction against foreigners and immigrants. Gandalf's remarks about how Aragorn's government is going to put systems in place to take care of things also has a pretty modern ring to it, too. Any comments on this line of thinking?
3. What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again? Would the end of LOTR be so poignant if Frodo's goodbye was not the final one in a whole string of endings and departures?
4. Compare this chapter to one of the ones where the hobbits first set out -- like the Old Forest.
At the end of that Chapter, the hobbits follow Tom to his home and end up standing on the threshold bathed in golden light. In this section, Tolkien writes about "forgotten" tales of errantry, which the hobbits themselves are the reminders of to the Bree folks (who "gape with wonder" at them.)
The Old Forest chapter, to me, also feels less "constructed" than this one -- where Tolkien was letting the tale unwind for him earlier, now, he he's working hard to close it down.
Do you think the imagery in this chapter reflects Tolkien's mindset/perceptions about writing the tale as whole, and where he was in that process? (I can picture him feeling like Frodo at this point, that he has to get through the final chapters, so he can have a bittersweet goodbye, and then sail off to some well earned rest where he can get back to the Silmarillion again.) Anyone else care to comment or muse along these lines -- or to tell me I'm being too romantic about all of this?
5. What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
6. What does this chapter contribute to the tale? Would LOTR be LOTR if it were not included?
7. Any other thoughts, insights, comments or questions on the chapter as a whole?
I enjoying trying to come up with good questions for you all, and only wish I would have had more time to respond, during the week, to all of the good points you raised in return. If I get a chance I'll drop back in and add some replies, but likely as not we'll all be on to the Scouring of the Shire soon.
Thanks to all who participated -- I learned a lot from you. Also, glad to entertain the lurkers -- hope you can join in on the final chapters!
Weaver
(This post was edited by weaver on Jan 11 2009, 5:48pm)
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batik
Dor-Lomin
Jan 11 2009, 6:58pm
Post #2 of 13
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What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
It's back to being a tale of Hobbits --they've been there and are now on their way back again. This chapter really helps me *get* that concept--I've *heard* this whole grand tale from the Hobbits' perspective and even get to stick around for a bit longer and find out what happened after the quest--what happens after the 'happily ever after'.
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simplyaven
Hithlum
Jan 11 2009, 8:02pm
Post #3 of 13
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Thanks from a mostly lurker :))
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Thank you, weaver, for the very interesting questions! I hope I'll have more time to participate but I enjoy reading too 
1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles?
Yes and no. Yes in the old-fashion sense that even the smallest owner is a master in his property/land. It was even more true in medieval times when ownership of land was an exception and a privilege. And no, because Tom is something quite bigger and more important than the other two. Tom is related to them as long as he gathers their moss, he collects their history, he is their master as they are settled down, stable, fixed if we use the astrological terminology. Tom's words about Maggot are more related to the brain and conclusions of the farmer (as well as his courage which also comes from this feeling "my home is my stronghold") than to his importance or being anything hidden for the eyes, IMHO. Same with Gandalf and Butterbur.
6. What does this chapter contribute to the tale? Would LOTR be LOTR if it were not included?
Due to the lack of time, I'll have to skip the other questions (unfortunately) but I'll say that if any of the chapters of LOTR was absent, it would not be the LOTR I love 
Culinary journey through Middle Earth continues! Bright new in the New Year - January 15 on the Main board
I believe
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Beren IV
Mithlond
Jan 12 2009, 12:47am
Post #4 of 13
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I mostly lurked, because I thought most of the things in this chapter were so self-explanatory!
1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles? I ask because they all emerge as unexpected guides to help the hobbits. Tolkien also has someone point out that each of them are more than what they seem. (Several people say that about Tom, Tom talks about Maggot like this, and Gandalf about Butterbur). Would it be going too far to call Maggot and Butterbur minor "masters" of their realms, in the same way Tom is a major one with a capital M in his?
I don't think the parallels are too deep; from a power prospective, Tom is a much greater Master than either of the other two. Maggot can defeat the Black Riders only by offering the hobbits concealment, and Butterbur really can't at all - it's Strider who offers them that.
2. Butterbur's responses to the trouble at Bree seem pretty similar to how people respond to terrorism today -- he doesn't relate to it until it shows up in his land, and then, he has a knee jerk reaction against foreigners and immigrants. Gandalf's remarks about how Aragorn's government is going to put systems in place to take care of things also has a pretty modern ring to it, too. Any comments on this line of thinking?
Well, it's a logical reaction, at least in this case. Foreigners come, they do bad things, and then they leave, and things are more peaceful again. Then more foreigners come - wouldn't you trust only the people you know?
Also, Butterbur knows nothing of the history of the Rangers and who they really are. A king to him is a snooty noble who looks down his nose at landed yeomen like Butterbur thinking them nothing more than uppity peasants who should be put to the whip and worked.
3. What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again? Would the end of LOTR be so poignant if Frodo's goodbye was not the final one in a whole string of endings and departures?
It's not really the final one - Gandalf and Bilbo go with him, and Elrond, Celeborn, and Galadriel are on the ship waiting for them, too. It is poignant that they all say good-bye, and that Frodo is among them, but it's not the last in a string of good-byes.
Do you think the imagery in this chapter reflects Tolkien's mindset/perceptions about writing the tale as whole, and where he was in that process? (I can picture him feeling like Frodo at this point, that he has to get through the final chapters, so he can have a bittersweet goodbye, and then sail off to some well earned rest where he can get back to the Silmarillion again.) Anyone else care to comment or muse along these lines -- or to tell me I'm being too romantic about all of this?
No - Tolkien would not have felt pain or sorrow about his story and his writing being over. It wasn't. Remember, he still had the Silmarillion to work on, and when we go to Heaven, I hope we'll see a new and improved version of it! 
5. What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
They are relieved to be going home - and don't yet realize that home isn't what it was!
6. What does this chapter contribute to the tale? Would LOTR be LOTR if it were not included?
It foreshadows the finale - the enemy abroad is defeated, but not the enemy in our own homes! It's no coincidence that the final casualties of the War of the Ring fall on the doorstep of Bag-End!
Once a paleontologist, now a botanist, will be a paleobotanist
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Laerasëa
Dor-Lomin
Jan 12 2009, 2:54am
Post #5 of 13
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I just lurked on this one, but I loved reading your analyses (correct plural?) here, and learned a whole lot; you got some really interesting discussions going!
Great job on your discussion, weaver!
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"Who needs drugs when you spend all your money on books?"
-Menelwyn
"A friend helps you find your Silmaril. A true friend helps you slay kin, cross icy wastes, battle your rellies, lose your hand to a Dark Lord and cast yourself into a fissure in the earth."
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"...But life has thus far failed to adjust itself to my liking, so I soldier on."
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"I just thought I would share this story, because today is a great day."
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"True nerddom/geekdom/dorkdom does not kick in until you are in your 50s taking a nerd/geek/dork test on the discussion board of an internet fan site for a fantasy novel/film."
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(This post was edited by Laerasëa on Jan 12 2009, 2:55am)
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sador
Gondolin
Jan 12 2009, 9:40am
Post #6 of 13
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A few answers, some to the point
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1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles?
They're all Brittish, in a way. Strider is the one who'll take the hobbits abroad.
I ask because they all emerge as unexpected guides to help the hobbits.
I won't say that. Frodo knew he should go to Bree, and Tom recommended Butterbur as a help. Maggot is not unexpected by Pippin, and one would assume some hobbits around the Brandywine might be helpful.
Tom is unexpected - although had Frodo consulted with Maggot before, he might have known of him!
Tolkien also has someone point out that each of them are more than what they seem. (Several people say that about Tom, Tom talks about Maggot like this, and Gandalf about Butterbur).
Aragorn says Butterbur is less than he seems.
But anyway, similar observations are made about Frodo (by Gandalf, Elrond, Faramir), Sam (appearing as Merry's 'chief investigator'), Gandalf (by Aragorn, Hama), Aragorn (by Pippin, Gandalf, the Master of the Houses of Healing), Faramir (by Beregond), Pippin (by Denethor, Beregond), Merry (by the Master of the Houses of Healing), Saruman (by Gandalf) and probably some others I don't remember at the moment. So it is not that special acout these three.
Would it be going too far to call Maggot and Butterbur minor "masters" of their realms, in the same way Tom is a major one with a capital M in his?
They're Brittish - and as we know, an Englishman's home is his castle!
(with Butterbur, perhaps the castle should have a capital C in it).
2. Butterbur's responses to the trouble at Bree seem pretty similar to how people respond to terrorism today -- he doesn't relate to it until it shows up in his land, and then, he has a knee jerk reaction against foreigners and immigrants. Gandalf's remarks about how Aragorn's government is going to put systems in place to take care of things also has a pretty modern ring to it, too. Any comments on this line of thinking?
Bree-folk were suspicious about immigrants back in At the Sign of the Prancing Pony (remember their reaction to the Southrener's talk of others who'll want to come?). Quite normal, in an insular way.
Having the king put things in order is also an old yearning.
No, I don't think it has any modern, err, ring to it.
3. What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again?
According to Merry, the effect of waking up.
According to Frodo, falling back to sleep.
Would the end of LOTR be so poignant if Frodo's goodbye was not the final one in a whole string of endings and departures?
Hard to say.
Some time ago, visualweasel led the discussion of Treebeard, and asked what one word best sums the story (question no. 7) - to which a.s. replied "loss".
Following that line of thinking, the multiple farewells are critical.
4. Compare this chapter to one of the ones where the hobbits first set out -- like the Old Forest.
If the comparison is valid, it should be to the beginning of The Old Forest.
And maybe we can contrast Fatty Bolger's hoping they won't need rescuing before the day is over (based on nothing he actually knew) to Barliman's confidence that the Famous Four will do all right.
Do you think the imagery in this chapter reflects Tolkien's mindset/perceptions about writing the tale as whole, and where he was in that process? (I can picture him feeling like Frodo at this point, that he has to get through the final chapters, so he can have a bittersweet goodbye, and then sail off to some well earned rest where he can get back to the Silmarillion again.) Anyone else care to comment or muse along these lines -- or to tell me I'm being too romantic about all of this?
Nice thought; but I can't see it that way.
And rest from Middle-Earth would mean more work at Oxford, not well-earned rest. No Precious.
5. What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
Return to the mundane, everyday life.
6. What does this chapter contribute to the tale?
An extra farewell, foreshadowing the Scouring of the Shire, closure of some open ends.
Would LOTR be LOTR if it were not included?
Yes.
7. Any other thoughts, insights, comments or questions on the chapter as a whole?
Thank you for a great job this week.
"I am going home now to put my notes in order" - Frodo
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Curious
Gondolin
Jan 12 2009, 9:54am
Post #7 of 13
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1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles?
Butterbur and Maggot are similar characters, as is the Gaffer. They are wise within their limited areas of expertise, and foolish outside of that area of expertise. Note that each of them express prejudice about each other -- the Gaffer doesn't trust hobbits from Buckland, Maggot doesn't trust hobbits from Hobbiton, and Butterbur said "'there's no accounting for East and West, as we say in Bree, meaning the Rangers and the Shire-folk, begging your pardon.'" But within their own domains they are wise people, and earn the respect of more travelled people like Bilbo, Frodo, and Gandalf. Even though Aragorn said some pretty harsh things about Butterbur, Gandalf assures Butterbur that Strider loves Bree. Butterbur, Maggot, and the Gaffer are good simple folk, well worth consulting on matters of local importance -- and utter fools about foreign affairs.
I agree that Bombadil is, in some ways, similar to Butterbur, Maggot, and the Gaffer. Bombadil is of course a much more powerful creature, and immortal. But while Bombadil knows everything there is to know about his limited territory, he has no interest in events outside that territory, and therefore Gandalf considers him untrustworthy as an ally in the War of the Ring. Bombadil is not prejudiced about outsiders, but he is not numbered among the Great and the Wise, or invited to their Councils. On the other hand, when Gandalf has given up his burden of Stewardship, he visits Bombadil to learn how to gather moss. On that subject, Bombadil's expertise is unmatched.
I ask because they all emerge as unexpected guides to help the hobbits.
Well, so does Gildor. And later, so do Treebeard and Faramir, and even Gollum. The world is full of unexpected guides. I'm not sure that's what makes Maggot, Bombadil, and Butterbur similar, although I agree that they are in some ways similar.
Tolkien also has someone point out that each of them are more than what they seem. (Several people say that about Tom, Tom talks about Maggot like this, and Gandalf about Butterbur). Would it be going too far to call Maggot and Butterbur minor "masters" of their realms, in the same way Tom is a major one with a capital M in his?
No, I think you have a point there, as I discussed above. But we must emphasize "of their realms." Outside of those limited realms, their mastery fails.
2. Butterbur's responses to the trouble at Bree seem pretty similar to how people respond to terrorism today -- he doesn't relate to it until it shows up in his land, and then, he has a knee jerk reaction against foreigners and immigrants. Gandalf's remarks about how Aragorn's government is going to put systems in place to take care of things also has a pretty modern ring to it, too. Any comments on this line of thinking?
I think most people react not just to terrorism but to all foreign affairs like Butterbur does -- ignore such matters until they cause trouble at home, and then react ignorantly. It's no wonder the reaction is ignorant when the subject has been ignored. This was even more likely in the world where Tolkien grew up, where international travel and communication was much less common and more difficult than today.
Gandalf's assurances are interesting. One might think some interaction with outsiders would do Butterbur some good, and that the Breelanders should not begrudge new neighbors settling nearby, when there is plenty of empty land to be settled. But Gandalf assures Butterbur that the King will protect Bree, and that the nearest settlers will be a hundred miles away. And indeed we have seen King Elessar assure the Woses that they will be undisturbed in their forest, and later we hear that King Elessar prohibited any big folk from entering the Shire, even though that seemingly shut down the only road to the sea in the North Kingdom.
Tolkien seems to treasure a certain amount of insularity in the world, and in his letters bemoans the way the world is becoming more uniform, and less varied. Similarly, King Elessar's first order of business seems to be protecting the various regions in his kingdom from peaceful invasions by friendly neighbors, so that the kingdom does not become uniform. And yes, this is a very modern and mundane issue, as befits this portion of the story, where the fairy tale has ended, the magic is fading, and the hobbits are entering the Age of Men.
3. What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again?
Melancholy. It's one good-bye after another, and the reader is also saying good-bye. It's a strange sort of melancholy, because everyone is moving on to good things -- even Frodo will get to live in Elvenhome -- but it is sad nonetheless. It's like saying good-bye when a child goes to college, or when someone leaves for a better job, or moves to a bigger house, or leaves for a long stay in a foreign land, or leaves for home after a long stay in a foreign land. You want to be happy about good fortune, either for yourself or for your family and friends, but good-byes are still sad. As Gandalf says later, "not all tears are an evil."
On the other hand, at this particular point in the story the melancholy is perhaps set aside for the moment as we contemplate the challenge Gandalf has given the hobbits -- to prove that they are more than capable of rescuing the Shire in a time of crisis. But the cumulative effect is melancholy -- and after the hobbits' triumph, to melancholy we will return.
Would the end of LOTR be so poignant if Frodo's goodbye was not the final one in a whole string of endings and departures?
No, but the whole build-up to Frodo's good-bye might seem pointless if Frodo did not, in fact, say good-bye. Everything that happens after Aragorn's marriage points towards and foreshadows that final good-bye, even if we might only realize that fact in hindsight. But even the first time reader should sense that this long denoument is building up to something, something big -- and I think would be confused and disappointed if there were no payoff, or if the only payoff were the five hobbits (Bilbo would have to stay with Frodo) saying good-bye to Gandalf and the elves.
4. Compare this chapter to one of the ones where the hobbits first set out -- like the Old Forest.
At the end of that Chapter, the hobbits follow Tom to his home and end up standing on the threshold bathed in golden light. In this section, Tolkien writes about "forgotten" tales of errantry, which the hobbits themselves are the reminders of to the Bree folks (who "gape with wonder" at them.)
In the early chapters, it was the hobbits who were doing the gaping -- although often in fear. Now the hobbits have become the figures of legend come to life.
The Old Forest chapter, to me, also feels less "constructed" than this one -- where Tolkien was letting the tale unwind for him earlier, now, he he's working hard to close it down.
Well, some chapters are more connected to the plot than others. The Bombadil chapters, as many have noted, may be less connected to the plot than any in the book. I think there are connections, and Tolkien considered them necessary, but the connections are subtle. Here, on the other hand, the foreshadowing of the Scouring is almost heavy-handed, and we also see Gandalf telling us what life will be like under King Elessar. On the other hand, "The Shadow of the Past" is an early chapter which is long on exposition of plot and short on diversions.
Do you think the imagery in this chapter reflects Tolkien's mindset/perceptions about writing the tale as whole, and where he was in that process? (I can picture him feeling like Frodo at this point, that he has to get through the final chapters, so he can have a bittersweet goodbye, and then sail off to some well earned rest where he can get back to the Silmarillion again.) Anyone else care to comment or muse along these lines -- or to tell me I'm being too romantic about all of this?
I don't think Tolkien was in any hurry to get through these last chapters. On the contrary, I think he lingered over them, and was perhaps reflecting his own melancholy at coming to the end of a long enterprise. And instead of looking for rest, for a while Tolkien was determined to publish The Silmarillion with LotR, and put a good deal of work into preparing The Silmarillion for publication and summarizing it for prospective publishers before that dream died. (Tolkien later may have thought this fortunate, as LotR became a success and he realized how different it was from The Silmarillion.) So while I'm willing to speculate that these late chapters reflected Tolkien's own state of mind, I picture it differently than you do, with Tolkien lingering over the chapters in a fond farewell -- and then lingering even more by writing the appendices -- and then lingering even more by writing Galadriel's history and other musings long after LotR was published, and bemoaning, in the Foreword to the Second Edition, that LotR was too short.
5. What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
Gandalf pretty much spells it out for us. The Shire is in trouble, and the hobbits have one last task before they can settle down, but they are quite up to it. We will get a chance to see how they have changed because of their adventures in Fairie, and how it has prepared them to deal with a crisis at home.
My feelings are anticipation and excitement, set up by all of Tolkien's foreshadowing. At this point I am less focused on the elves' departure or Frodo's wounds, because they are not mentioned in this chapter -- instead I am excited to see how the hobbits will fare with one last challenge Gandalf has given them.
6. What does this chapter contribute to the tale? Would LOTR be LOTR if it were not included?
This chapter sets up the next quite nicely. It's not vital to the plot, but if we took out all the chapters in LotR that are not vital to the plot, well, we wouldn't have much left! LotR would not be LotR if we just focused on the plot.
7. Any other thoughts, insights, comments or questions on the chapter as a whole?
Just that our discussion of "On Fairy-stories" has given me a whole new appreciation of this chapter and how it introduces us to the Scouring and the mundane threats that remain in the Age of Men. The key question I asked myself after our discussion of Tolkien's essay is why LotR does not end shortly after Aragorn's wedding with something like "and they all lived happily ever after." I think my answer is that Tolkien wants to show us, rather than just tell us, how adventures in Faerie can prove useful in a mundane crisis. The Scouring, and this chapter which sets up the Scouring, is like Tolkien's stirring defense of escapism ("In what the misusers are fond of calling Real Life, Escape is evidently as a rule very practical, and may even be heroic") come to life.
Thank you for a great week!
(This post was edited by Curious on Jan 12 2009, 10:00am)
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Curious
Gondolin
Jan 12 2009, 10:12am
Post #8 of 13
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The key question I asked myself after our discussion of Tolkien's essay is why LotR does not end shortly after Aragorn's wedding with something like "and they all lived happily ever after." I think my answer is that Tolkien wants to show us, rather than just tell us, how adventures in Faerie can prove useful in a mundane crisis.
I ran out of time for corrections. I would amend this to say that part of the reason the story didn't end earlier is so Tolkien could show us the value of adventuring in Faerie in this chapter and in the Scouring. But another part of the reason -- perhaps the greater part -- has to do with Frodo's decision to return to Faerie, and to live there for the rest of his life. That part is only touched on briefly in this chapter, though, when Frodo contrasts his feelings with Merry's. I'll say more about that later, when we get to that point in the story.
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sador
Gondolin
Jan 12 2009, 3:16pm
Post #9 of 13
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On the other hand, when Gandalf has given up his burden of Stewardship, he visits Bombadil to learn how to gather moss. On that subject, Bombadil's expertise is unmatched.
"I am going home now to put my notes in order" - Frodo
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FarFromHome
Doriath
Jan 12 2009, 9:04pm
Post #10 of 13
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Thanks for a very interesting discussion, Weaver!
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1. Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way...
I find it interesting that Tom knows both Butterbur and Farmer Maggot - Tom may be confined to his own lands, but he seems to have a little network that stretches beyond them. I like these little hints that there may be more going on than the hobbits are aware of.
... all emerge as unexpected guides to help the hobbits. Tolkien also has someone point out that each of them are more than what they seem.
As Curious says, there are other unexpected guides too. And other characters are more than what they seem - Stider to start with ("all that is gold does not glitter"), as well as Frodo ("there's more to this hobbit than meets the eye", referring to the mithril coat), and Bilbo (from The Hobbit, referred to by Gandalf when he makes the remark about Frodo).
So although these three fit the pattern of unexpected guides, as well as characters with hidden depths, they are not the only ones. But they are very clear examples of this pattern, and help to establish it, perhaps.
3. What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again? Would the end of LOTR be so poignant if Frodo's goodbye was not the final one in a whole string of endings and departures?
I think some of that poignancy is because the departures seem to be over, and everyone seems to be settling in happily at home, when Frodo's departure comes. All the departures in this chapter are positive in tone - the characters are separating willingly, with good memories and promises to come back and visit. There's melancholy, but no real regret. Frodo's departure puts paid to all that.
I like your comment that this chapter feels more "constructed" than ones at the start of the journey. There's certainly a sense at the start that the hobbits don't really know where they're going, and maybe Tolkien doesn't know either! This chapter gives him a chance to create a structure in hindsight, as he takes the hobbits back over their adventures, leaving the characters from each episode behind again as they return to their starting point.
Perhaps this chapter is a little self-indulgent, but that's part of the charm of LotR too.
Farewell, friends! I hear the call.
The ship’s beside the stony wall.
Foam is white and waves are grey;
beyond the sunset leads my way.
Bilbo's Last Song
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dernwyn
Forum Admin
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Jan 13 2009, 4:01am
Post #11 of 13
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I learn a lot from everyone here, also - and am constantly amazed at what directions some of these ideas can go!
Are Butterbur, Farmer Maggot and Tom Bombadil connected in some way, or do they just look that way because they perform similar roles?...Would it be going too far to call Maggot and Butterbur minor "masters" of their realms, in the same way Tom is a major one with a capital M in his?
I like that idea, of each the "master" of his own "realm", because each is: each is "steward" of a particular area, a homestead with farmlands or a tavern at a crossroads. Within each one's realm, adventures can happen, and they are ultimately responsible for the safekeeping of those whose travels have brought them across their borders.
What is the cumulative effect of having so many characters and places drop out of the story one at a time, until we get back to the four hobbits again?...What feelings do you have about the four hobbits being alone and on their own at the end of this chapter? What frame of mind has Tolkien put you in for the final part of his tale?
In a way, it reminds me of the Fellowship leaving Lórien, with that land slipping away: now the rest of Middle-earth is slipping away, one site at a time, as the four travel "backwards" along the road they travelled out on. It does feel like "waking up"; by the time they are back at their own borders they have left the dreams (and nightmares) of adventures behind them.
But now, the locked gate is not at the entrance from the Old Forest: it's at the entrance to their own land - a sign of "invasion" from a different direction.
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"I desired dragons with a profound desire"
"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915
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Dreamdeer
Doriath
Jan 13 2009, 6:13am
Post #12 of 13
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Tom Bombadil also knew Aragorn. Or at least Aragorn acted like an old acquaintance when he spoke of having eavesdropped on "Old Tom" and the hobbits at the brink of the road. I imagine that Tom only knew of Butterbur through Aragorn's heresay, since the Prancing Pony stood outside of his territory. (I always found it intriguing that apparently Farmer Maggot's land--and hence a significant chunk of the Shire--is within Tom's territory!)
Life is beautiful and dangerous! Beware! Enjoy!
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N.E. Brigand
Gondolin
Mar 22 2009, 4:34am
Post #13 of 13
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More fine work. Thanks, weaver! //
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We're discussing The Lord of the Rings in the Reading Room, Oct. 15, 2007 - Mar. 22, 2009!
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