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batik
Dor-Lomin
Dec 19 2008, 6:51am
Post #1 of 9
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Many Partings V: "...and packing is such a bother."
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The travelers have been on the road for just about two months and now, on September 21, they return to Rivendell.
Bilbo is described as looking “very old, but peaceful, and sleepy”; punctual for meals; pretending to take notes as the Hobbits tell of their experiences.
Is this concern with established routines and only brief flashes of interest in other matters typical of one who feels an *end* is on the horizon?
Ah-but he was paying attention! Tolkien gives us a bit of a summary here via Bilbo:
“That’s what you went for, wasn’t it: to get rid of it? ... such a lot of other things seem to have gotten mixed up with it: Aragorn’s affairs, and the White Council, and Gondor, and the Horsemen, and Southrons, and oliphaunts…and caves and towers and golden trees and goodness knows what besides.”
Was it necessary or helpful of Tolkien to give the reader a review of the events at this point in the story?
As the change in seasons becomes apparent, Frodo and Sam discuss returning to the Shire. While Frodo’s “feeling that it was time he went back” is mentioned, he seems more preoccupied with thoughts of the Sea.
Has this seeming preoccupation been influenced by Arwen’s statement about passing into the West and/or Legolas’ song of the Sea?
(This post was edited by batik on Dec 19 2008, 6:54am)
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Elros
Ossiriand
Dec 19 2008, 5:15pm
Post #2 of 9
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Is this concern with established routines and only brief flashes of interest in other matters typical of one who feels an *end* is on the horizon? I can only speak from my experiences, but it seemed that my grandparents were quite excited by activities that broke their routine and gave them an escape from their ordinary, sometimes mundane, lives.
Was it necessary or helpful of Tolkien to give the reader a review of the events at this point in the story? Neither. I would hope that readers didn't need a review of all these things they've encountered in their reading. Even I wouldn't need a review this basic, so that should tell you something.  I think this line shows Bilbo still has wits about him and isn't just a dying old hobbit.
Has this seeming preoccupation been influenced by Arwen’s statement about passing into the West and/or Legolas’ song of the Sea? Possibly, but there might be another source. In UT, at least I'm pretty sure it was UT, when Galadriel counsels Celebrimbor to disperse the Three Rings far from Eregion and agrees to take one, an unexpected side effect of her possession of a Ring of Power was an increased longing for the Sea. Perhaps the same desires are being stirred in Frodo's heart.
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Dreamdeer
Doriath
Dec 19 2008, 7:05pm
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I do not think that Bilbo behaves like a typical old hobbit--as the other writer said, our elders often want to hear every detail of our adventures. I think he's behaving like a dead hobbit. He's hanging on, but he really should have died years ago. His soul years for the Halls of Mandos, as far as he's concerned, and it's hard to stay engaged with things of this world. I think that he only lingers because he knows that on some level Frodo needs him, though neither of them yet have a clear picture as to why.
Life is beautiful and dangerous! Beware! Enjoy!
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Curious
Gondolin
Dec 20 2008, 4:00am
Post #4 of 9
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Is this concern with established routines and only brief flashes of interest in other matters typical of one who feels an *end* is on the horizon?
Based on anecdotal evidence and personal observation it does seem that at the beginning and end of life the day revolves around sleep, meals, and bowel movements. Perhaps the elderly no longer take these matters for granted. The basic functions of life become more precious, and the ambitions of the young irrelevant.
Ah-but he was paying attention! Tolkien gives us a bit of a summary here via Bilbo:
“That’s what you went for, wasn’t it: to get rid of it? ... such a lot of other things seem to have gotten mixed up with it: Aragorn’s affairs, and the White Council, and Gondor, and the Horsemen, and Southrons, and oliphaunts…and caves and towers and golden trees and goodness knows what besides.”
Was it necessary or helpful of Tolkien to give the reader a review of the events at this point in the story?
Bilbo was listening, but perhaps not too closely. His summary seems to display his confusion more than his understanding, especially since he begins by reminding himself that, after all, the whole idea was to "get rid" of the Ring.
As the change in seasons becomes apparent, Frodo and Sam discuss returning to the Shire. While Frodo’s “feeling that it was time he went back” is mentioned, he seems more preoccupied with thoughts of the Sea.
Has this seeming preoccupation been influenced by Arwen’s statement about passing into the West and/or Legolas’ song of the Sea?
Apparently Frodo has been thinking about Arwen's offer.
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batik
Dor-Lomin
Dec 20 2008, 6:39am
Post #5 of 9
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even knowing the ending...At this point in the story I still think... now, dagnabit Frodo-you don't have to be thinking like that...you've had all that Elvish medicine, healing by the King, mithril shirt...STAY! And where's that Arwen? Need to talk to her about putting that sailing away notion in his head.
(This post was edited by batik on Dec 20 2008, 6:40am)
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sador
Gondolin
Dec 21 2008, 8:24am
Post #6 of 9
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Aren't they for Elves, and aren't Hobbits supposed to be like Men in their ultimate fates?
"I had so much to do here; and packing is such a bother" - Bilbo
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sador
Gondolin
Dec 21 2008, 8:35am
Post #7 of 9
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A few thoughts, some to the point
[In reply to]
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Is this concern with established routines and only brief flashes of interest in other matters typical of one who feels an *end* is on the horizon?
Possibly; but he is also shedding his heroic self, and becoming like an ordinary honnit again.
Was it necessary or helpful of Tolkien to give the reader a review of the events at this point in the story?
Bilbo was not paying attention (hence Sam's words about his not being able to write his book). There is no White Council in the story, and he remembers only a few details - horsemen, Southrons and Oliphaunts indeed! Is that the story? It is just the impression a hobbit-child would absorb (note his forgetting of walking trees, which hobbits seem to be very reluctant to believe in). The same applies to caves, towers and golden trees; nothing complex - no Denethro, and no mention even of Gollum!
And of course, Aragorn's affairs; a bit of gossip about his friend.
Has this seeming preoccupation been influenced by Arwen’s statement about passing into the West and/or Legolas’ song of the Sea?
Arwen; definitely not Legolas.
But remember, Frodo the wanderer from the Shire is no more. He is still walking in Cerin Amroth, among flowers of elanor and niphredil (the end of 'Lothlorien') - and these will soon cease to blossom there, so Frodo's heart is about to pass over the Sea with the Lady.
And later we find out Frodo himself will join her.
"I had so much to do here; and packing is such a bother" - Bilbo
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batik
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2008, 6:51pm
Post #8 of 9
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yes, Bilbo's including the "White Council" was a bit confusing but I interpreted that to mean he was referring to any involvement the *members* of the White Council may have had in the destruction of the ring...return of the king..thing!
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Dreamdeer
Doriath
Dec 21 2008, 10:02pm
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If I recall correctly, the Halls of Mandos have different sections. Elves go to their section temporarily, learn whatever lessons they're supposed to, and come back. Men go to another section, learn whatever lessons they're supposed to, then go to a perpetual-night shore on the edge of the world, where they party and have a good time, waiting for a ship that will someday take them to the next stage of their journey, headed beyond Arda to who knows what. Dwarves go to still another section, where they wait to find out what their fate might be at the end of the world, some of them (notably Durin) occasionally sent back into incarnation.
Life is beautiful and dangerous! Beware! Enjoy!
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