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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 29 2008, 10:54pm
Post #1 of 79
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Did Shadowfax sail into the West?
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Did Gandalf take Shadowfax (and the elves take their horses) on the ship?
I so hated to ask, but am curious and a site search didn't help me.
My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
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Beorneo7
Lindon
Oct 29 2008, 10:59pm
Post #2 of 79
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It seemed that for Tolkien horses in Middle Earth had a want to be free and on their own or with their own kind. Hasufel and Arod's response to Shadowfax when they spotted him in TTT kind of hints at some kind of equine heirarchy and even intelligence. I'm not saying that going with Gandalf over the sea is continued bondage I would just think he'd like to be free with his own kind.
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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 29 2008, 11:06pm
Post #3 of 79
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I'm not even sure if he rode Shadowfax there. I think I read he was on a grey horse.
So they get off the horses and say "Goodbye now. We are off sailing."
LOL
My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
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Beorneo7
Lindon
Oct 29 2008, 11:11pm
Post #4 of 79
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But yes, that sounds plausible. I mean really, what DO you say? "We had some good times and we had some bad times and I will always cherish that especially those times that I rode to what should have been exhaustion or even death. Yeah, those were the times. Well goodbye now."
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Magpie
Elvenhome
Oct 29 2008, 11:23pm
Post #5 of 79
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Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien
#268
From a letter to Miss A. P. Northey
19 January 1965
I think Shadowfax certainly went with Gandalf [across the Sea], though this is not stated. I feel it is better not to state everything (and indeed it is more realistic, since in chronicles and accounts of 'real' history, many facts that some enquirer would like to know are omitted, and the truth has to be discovered or guessed from such evidence as there is). I should argue so: Shadowfax came of a special race (II 126,129, III 346)1 being as it were an Elvish equivalent of ordinary horses : his 'blood' came from 'West over Sea'. It would not be unfitting for him to 'go West'. Gandalf was not 'dying', or going by a special grace to the Western Land, before passing on 'beyond the circles of the world': he was going home, being plainly one of the 'immortals', an angelic emissary of the angelic governors (Valar) of the Earth. He would take or could take what he loved. Gandalf was last seen riding Shadowfax (III 276). He must have ridden to the Havens, and it is inconceivable that he would [have] ridden any beast but Shadowfax; so Shadowfax must have been there. A chronicler winding up a long tale, and for the moment moved principally by the sorrow of those left behind (himself among them!) might omit mention of the horse; but had the great horse also shared in the grief of sundering, he could hardly have been forgotten.
LOTR soundtrack website : FOTR Lyrics Update, Oct 2008
magpie avatar gallery ~ Torn Image Posting Guide
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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 29 2008, 11:24pm
Post #6 of 79
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I can't recall mention in the book of his saying his goodbye to Shadowfax. Or when he left him.
My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
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N.E. Brigand
Gondolin
Oct 29 2008, 11:29pm
Post #7 of 79
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<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
We're discussing The Lord of the Rings in the Reading Room, Oct. 15, 2007 - Mar. 22, 2009!
Join us Oct. 27-Nov. 2 for "The Last Debate".
****************************************
And we're discussing Tolkien's classic essay, "On Fairy-stories", Oct. 20-Nov. 30. This week:
"Max Müller’s view of mythology as a ‘disease of language’ can be abandoned without regret. Mythology is not a disease at all, though it may like all human things become diseased. You might as well say that thinking is a disease of the mind."
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.
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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 29 2008, 11:31pm
Post #8 of 79
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My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
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Mar
Mithlond
Oct 30 2008, 12:09am
Post #10 of 79
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I think he got in on the tail end ; ) //
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Most people don't know there are angels whose only job is to make sure you don't get too comfortable - fall asleep and miss your life.
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dernwyn
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Oct 30 2008, 2:29am
Post #11 of 79
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According to the Epilogue, Yes.
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In the second version of the Epilogue, which is the one Tolkien intended to place at the end of LotR had others not dissuaded him, Sam is making notes for items to be included in the Red Book, and writes:
"Q. Horses. Merry is interested in these; very anxious for a pony of his own. How many horses did the Riders lose in the battles, and have they got some more now? What happened to Legolas's horse? What did Gandalf do with Shadowfax?
A. Shadowfax went in the White Ship with Gandalf, of course. I saw that myself. I also saw Legolas let his horse run free back to Rohan from Isengard..."
The Merry referred to here is one of his own children.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I desired dragons with a profound desire"
"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915
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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 30 2008, 3:03am
Post #13 of 79
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Do you mean the unpublished Epilogue found in the HoMe series or the Appendices of the LOTR?
It's not in the Appendices of LOTR.
Can someone point me to this? Answer this?
I do not have the HoME
My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
(This post was edited by Larewen on Oct 30 2008, 3:09am)
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dernwyn
Forum Admin
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Oct 30 2008, 3:15am
Post #14 of 79
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"Sauron Defeated". I have an "abridged" version called "The End of the Third Age", which contains only material directly related to LotR.
Unfortunately, that's the only place that I know of to find it!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I desired dragons with a profound desire"
"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915
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Larewen
Menegroth
Oct 30 2008, 3:18am
Post #15 of 79
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How many HoME volumes are there? Can they still be found?
I see volumes, but never a complete set. I don't know how to go about buying them all.
My daughter's favorite line to quote:
Sam: Nothin'. Just a bit of seasoning. I thought maybe if we was havin' a roast chicken one night or something...
Frodo: Roast chicken?
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N.E. Brigand
Gondolin
Oct 30 2008, 3:29am
Post #16 of 79
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The twelve "History of Middle-earth" volumes
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..are as follows:
1. The Book of Lost Tales, Part One
2. The Book of Lost Tales, Part Two
3. The Lays of Beleriand
4. The Shaping of Middle-earth
5. The Lost Road and Other Writings
6. The Return of the Shadow
7. The Treason of Isengard
8. The War of the Ring
9. Sauron Defeated
10. Morgoth's Ring
11. The War of the Jewels
12. The Peoples of Middle-earth
Volumes 1 through 5 trace the history of Tolkien's "Silmarillion" writings up to the point that he began work on The Lord of the Rings at the end of 1937. Volumes 6 through 9 show the writing of The Lord of the Rings itself, through the 1940s. Part of volumes 5 and 9 are two time-travel stories, "The Lost Road" and "The Notion Club Papers", that connect modern-day England to Númenor. In volumes 10 and 11 Tolkien returns to the "Silmarillion" material in the 1950s. Volume 12 contains late writings, as well as drafts for the LotR appendices.
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
We're discussing The Lord of the Rings in the Reading Room, Oct. 15, 2007 - Mar. 22, 2009!
Join us Oct. 27-Nov. 2 for "The Last Debate".
****************************************
And we're discussing Tolkien's classic essay, "On Fairy-stories", Oct. 20-Nov. 30. This week:
"Max Müller’s view of mythology as a ‘disease of language’ can be abandoned without regret. Mythology is not a disease at all, though it may like all human things become diseased. You might as well say that thinking is a disease of the mind."
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.
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dernwyn
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Oct 30 2008, 3:31am
Post #17 of 79
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There are 12 volumes total. 6-9, the "History of the Lord of the Rings", contain the background to the writing of LotR. My copies are softcover, but I think there are some volumes which have only been published as hardcovers.
Here's a page which lists the volumes and links to descriptions of each volume. And all are available through the publisher (or Amazon or other online booksellers).
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I desired dragons with a profound desire"
"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Oct 30 2008, 4:42am
Post #20 of 79
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Well, maybe not a "need," but all 12 volumes are well-worth having!
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
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Mar
Mithlond
Oct 30 2008, 4:54am
Post #21 of 79
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He may have ended up in the wrong neighhhhh-borhood. //
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Most people don't know there are angels whose only job is to make sure you don't get too comfortable - fall asleep and miss your life.
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Kelvarhin
Gondolin
Oct 30 2008, 4:58am
Post #22 of 79
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Neigh... he'd just be horsing around//
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Valinor, O Valinor
Andavë yányë hyarya
Tumna yá nyèna minya fëa
An Valinor, lissë Eldamar
Kelvarhin's Universe~~~~~~~Laerasea's Travelling TORn Journal
One book to rule them all
One book to find them
One book to bring them all
And in TORn bind them
In the land of TORnadoes...where the brilliant play
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Oct 30 2008, 5:03am
Post #23 of 79
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He might have just whipped through.../
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Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded b*****d with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Ataahua's stories
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Starling
Gondolin
Oct 30 2008, 7:42am
Post #25 of 79
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Yet another thread going off tack //
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