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MrCere
Sr. Staff
Jul 11 2008, 6:11pm
Post #1 of 27
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What do you think of Hellboy 2?
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My review of the film is on TORn's front page. (www.TheOneRing.net)
What do you think of the film?
For those who haven't seen it yet, or will not see it, do you think it will inform us of what "The Hobbit" will be like? I argue against that in my review but that is simply one man's opinion. What do you think?
I have no choice but to believe in free will.
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
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Magpie
Elvenhome
Jul 11 2008, 6:16pm
Post #2 of 27
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I was actually thinking of maybe two threads
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One could be completely spoiler free but with viewers (or reviewers) reactions/thoughts esp. those that might pertain to what GDT would do with The Hobbit.
The other thread could contain spoilers for those viewers who want to discuss the movie in more detail.
magpie avatar gallery ~ soundtrack website ~ Torn Image Posting Guide
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Jazmine
Dor-Lomin
Jul 11 2008, 6:40pm
Post #4 of 27
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til August 20th when it's released over here! But I'm looking forward to it, not because I think it has much to do with GDT's approach to The Hobbit. More because I've come to really enjoy his movies!
*Jazminatar the Brown*
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Lunamoth
Nargothrond
Jul 11 2008, 7:30pm
Post #6 of 27
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I'm a-scared of the crowds, so I tend to wait before seeing new films until it's been out a week or 3. But, I'm looking forward to HBII.
I don't think it'll inform at all what the Hobbit will be like. The Orphanage and Pan's Labyrinth are completely different movies, yet both directed by Del Toro. In fact, if I hadn't known they were both by the same director (by some bizarre chance), I would in no way have guessed it. I think the fears we're seeing in people about this aren't necessary.
(This post was edited by Altaira on Jul 12 2008, 3:48pm)
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Woodyend
Mithlond
Jul 11 2008, 9:30pm
Post #7 of 27
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I liked it, but not loved it like HB.
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I'm a bit battle fatigued. There were simply to many of them, and all of them to long. It was great visually but the storyline suffered from all the time spent on fighting. I expected time and energy to be spent on fighting the Golden Army, but he spent just as much time on the lesser battles. So that's my biggest beef. The special effects were brilliantly done and much better than HB. All in all, it was a good movie, that is well worth the price of the ticket.
May your beer be laid under an enchantment of surpassing excellence for seven years!
~~~~~~~~Gandalf~~~~~~~
Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!
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Miret
Ossiriand
Jul 11 2008, 9:41pm
Post #8 of 27
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It's showing at our local (only) drive in
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Along with Wanted. Tempting. Very tempting.
It is by Caffeine alone I set my mind in Motion - It is by the juice of the Bean that thoughts acquire speed - The hands acquire shakes - The shakes become a warning - It is by Caffeine alone I set my mind in Motion...
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wilsonst541
Lindon
Jul 11 2008, 10:10pm
Post #9 of 27
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Not only do I appreciate your well-written review of GDT's movie, but I also appreciate how you encourage movie-goers to treat HB2 as something separate from and wholly independent of The Hobbit.
I am beginning to almost pity GDT, who can't seem to walk down the street without having to answer some question about his next two films. PJ at least had some modicum of secrecy/privacy, as well as the added bonus of not having to live up to any preceding movies. Hopefully GDT's skin is thick enough, and his sense of humor strong enough, to roll with the impatience of some fans and reporters.
Of course, I am sure (and I hope) that he is crying all the way to the bank, but I also hope that he gets some well-deserved time to himself before too long.
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diztrek
Registered User
Jul 11 2008, 10:41pm
Post #10 of 27
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Hellboy2 prelude to The Hobbit?
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I saw Hellboy2 this morning and I tried very hard not to judge it as a prelude to The Hobbit. I enjoyed it for the most part although it seemed to lag in the some parts and almost get silly in others. But, for the most of the time, the movie had some incredible, beautiful and very creative scenery, sets and creatures. I did notice "Death" looked very much like Pan's Labyrinth creatures. I DO see the POTENTIAL for the great Hobbit movies!
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L. Ron Halfelven
Hithlum
Jul 11 2008, 10:48pm
Post #11 of 27
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I don't dare see it until someone determines its gender for us./
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Far he journeyed in that ship, even into the starless voids; but most often was he seen at morning or at evening, glimmering in sunrise or sunset, as he came back to Valinor from voyages beyond the confines of the world.
More pictures here.
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Rivendweller
Menegroth
Jul 11 2008, 11:03pm
Post #12 of 27
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I read the thread that you are implying about but did not partake. Too much fun to read.
There's something of everything here, The Shire and the Golden Wood and Gondor and kings' houses and inns and meadows and mountains all mixed.
....and there are Elves when you want them.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Formerly A'amel from days gone by.
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MrCere
Sr. Staff
Jul 11 2008, 11:40pm
Post #13 of 27
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There isn't enough interest for one thread, let alone two, but your idea is very sensible. Sorry I didn't see your post Magpie or think of it in time.
I do think the film deserves its own thread and not the Monday wrap up because its directed by our fellow message board user and, in the Tolkien film universe, the guy who is taking on the next big thing.
I think "The Lovely Bones" later this year will also need its own thread. 
I have no choice but to believe in free will.
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
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MrCere
Sr. Staff
Jul 12 2008, 12:11am
Post #14 of 27
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I really, sincerely appreciate your comments and compliments. Thanks.
I have no choice but to believe in free will.
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
The cake is a lie
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Magpie
Elvenhome
Jul 12 2008, 12:16am
Post #15 of 27
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...posting some quotes from my local paper's reviewer. (non spoiler) He had some good things to say about it.
I would be interested in very general reviews and comments. I don't need to be 100% spoiler free but I'm not interested in reading much about plot. I'm probably not going to see it till it's second run. First run movies are too expensive for our budget and we have this lovely restored, vintage theater that shows second run movies on a very good screen/sound set up.
(also... the weekend is young. It's only now 7:00 pm Central. I'd be hard pressed to get to a movie this early even if I wanted to.)
magpie avatar gallery ~ soundtrack website ~ Torn Image Posting Guide
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L. Ron Halfelven
Hithlum
Jul 12 2008, 12:34am
Post #16 of 27
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Offhand, it seems like it should be dead butch...
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But then, I once made a similar assumption about a movie where two guys have a competition to see who can leave the most corpses in his wake, and look how that turned out.
Far he journeyed in that ship, even into the starless voids; but most often was he seen at morning or at evening, glimmering in sunrise or sunset, as he came back to Valinor from voyages beyond the confines of the world.
More pictures here.
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Laerasëa
Dor-Lomin
Jul 12 2008, 1:20am
Post #17 of 27
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I just saw it, and I'm itching to find a place to discuss it with spoilers. I'll just have to wait, I guess!!
(btw- Magpie- I didn't know Danny Elfman did the music!! It was really good- you honestly wouldn't have guessed it was him composing! Well, maybe if you'd thought about it, but it was a bit different from his usual style, I think!)
********************************
I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying. - Oscar Wilde
This is a work of fiction. All the characters in it, human and otherwise, are imaginary, excepting only certain of the fairy folk, whom it might be unwise to offend by casting doubts on their existence. Or lack thereof. -Neil Gaiman
Age is an issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter. - Mark Twain
You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway. - Walt Disney
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. - Louis Hector Berlioz
Don't use words too big for the subject. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. -C.S. Lewis
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Daughter of Nienna
Hithlum
Jul 12 2008, 2:03am
Post #18 of 27
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How it didn't work for me:
I think the film suffered from some of the same sort of ills that many sequals suffer from, though not profoundly. I found the story line to be bit unfocused and the film was generally all over the place, and had a lot going on. More is not always better.
The film didn't give us enough chance to be involved in the characters, not like with HBII. It seemed that the film was taking for granted that there was enough audience affection for the characters held over from the first film. Most of the Character stuff involved a subplot that felt kind of surface-y. The film seemed to lack some of the depth of the first. And, the mythology was, though present, seemed weakend some how... can't put my finger on that yet... that is, the themes werent' as strong.
What I did like about it: /
I liked the compassion GDT seems ro exhibit for the bad guy elf... he wasn't entirely evil
I liked that it was still about choice, And, that the choice was often challenged... that Hellboy's choice to fight evil is challenged by how humans treat him, by the ominous warnings given him, etc.
I liked the Abe character even more in this film... enjoyed his story in this (trying not to give too much away).
I liked how the characters changed from being impressed by that German agent because he waa so different from Hellboy (rational, ) realizing how shallow that was in the end. I also liked how that German character opened up because he remembered how important love is. (this reminded of the HP series and the utter relevance of love in tha tseries).
Wonderful visuals: the sets, the makeup, etc. I was impressed by the sword skills of the bad elf. It was awesome in his opening sequence with the 'drop'. An overall 'good ride'
What I think it might say for the Hobbit:
The empathy shown for the bad guy elf made me think that he could do justice to the Gollum character.
I need to think more on it to see how else it may inform, if at all on the Hobbit. Perhaps as I read more comments, more thoughts will get stimulated.
**Tribute: Lt. J.G. Robert Sterling, WWII Pilot MIA, by Gramma & DoN**
Art Gallery Revised, Aloha & Mahalo, Websites Directory
Nienna: “ those who hearken to her learn pity, and endurance in hope . . . All those who wait in Mandos cry to her, for she brings strength to the spirit and turns sorrow to wisdom." — Valaquenta
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Compa_Mighty
Dor-Lomin
Jul 12 2008, 4:12am
Post #19 of 27
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I thought it was only fair to talk about in what they could relate
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So I went ahead and created a thread in The Hobbit Movie forum, where I discuss some of the things that could *maybe* get to The Hobbit, palette-wise and the wooden puppet scene, as told by Guillermo.
http://newboards.theonering.net/...i?post=116561#116561
Anyway, and to comment on the film, I have to say I liked it, I did not love it. Perhaps the story of the first one was a little stronger, I don't know.
It's visually impressive, as Pan's Labyrinth. The creatures (especially the Angel of Death) are really great, and the design is first class.
I agree with MrCere in that you can't compare them, and you can't go watch it wanting to get a preview of The Hobbit. It's a good movie in its own right,and radically different of what will happen with The Hobbit.
However, if you are in the mood for discussing elements and traces of Hellboy 2 that could get to The Hobbit, visit the abive link.
Here's to Del Toro becoming the Irvin Kershner of Middle Earth!
Essay winner of the Show us your Hobbit Pride Giveway!
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Mithrandír
Menegroth
Jul 12 2008, 7:17am
Post #20 of 27
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The report just shows how little some know about tolkiens universe and about filmmaking. I feel im starting to get worked up and a we bit angry. argh!!!
If a social phenomenon is interpreted as real by the agent, it becomes real in its consequence. Thomas.
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Sunflower
Doriath
Jul 12 2008, 8:23am
Post #21 of 27
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1)Give Guillermo Navarro his 2nd Cinematography Oscar now, this was some of the best stuff visually I've ever seen. All the interior sets were fantastic, the garish colors (interestingly, even the machinery of the Elven Kingdom was earth-colored) and his contrast of light and shadow, while again evoking Mignola's inking style, are beginning to be a style all his own.
2)Del Toro pays visual and thematic tribute to LOTR throughout the film, both Tolkien and the PJ films. There are several lines of dialogue and even set pieces, things going on that are charmingingly remeniscent. For those who have not seen the film, you may not spot all the refs on a first viewing. But OF COURSE he surpasses himself in other ways, with the full scope of his myriad creations. I was searching for the character he called Cathedral Head, and it/he was not hard to find! The Troll Market IS everything you've heard it cooked up to be.
3)Most of what I'm dying to say is spoiler, but I will try to pull all my thoughts together here. The main thing I am concerned with is whether Del Toro understands that a large part of the cinematic Middle-earth's charm for me is that it feels different. It feels as if it was hand-crafted in that time. What I mean here is the editing, the camera work.. ME is not the modern world of today, with its bright and handy gadgets and MTV quick-pace; nor is it the much slower but still fast 1940's of PL, which call for thier own levels of introspection.
With ME, (not to disprage anyone's editing skills) we NEED to see those extended close-ups, the slowing down of scenes and use of camerra angles, etc, to say. People in Middle-earth live and die by the patterns of the sunset and sunrise, and the films should slow down to PJ';s LOTR level so we can take time to see for ourselves what we in the modern world have lost. PJ's films have a sort of gauzy, timeless feel to them b/c you sense you are on the "time zone" of its denizens. The worlds of HB2 is of course NY and NJ (or under it), and as such, it's OK to have an MTV "zip, zip" quality to them. But at times it took away from the narrative. *We* communicate through extended close-ups, etc.
4)Acting, etc-- can't really talk about this yet without spoiling anyone, and it's 3 Am and nodding off over the laptop, so I will save that for Compa's thread asap.
5)Overall, this is the experiment of Del Toro trying to bridge the 2 seemingly disperate elements of his career, and balance them in one film. It does not always succeed. The big drawback, is that when he starts to get too serious, he immediately goes back to comedy; and from there, veers back towards the serious.
(This post was edited by Sunflower on Jul 12 2008, 8:32am)
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Sunflower
Doriath
Jul 12 2008, 9:04am
Post #22 of 27
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Please bear in mind that it's the middle of the night and I've seen it twice, I'm nodding over the keyboard and I won't have a chance to say everythng I want to for a bit--there is SO MUCH more that is both thought-provoking and delightfiul--and yes I am well aware that this is much different than what we will see in 4 yrs--I am speakig of patterns I see in his other work though--
Back in a bit
PS Mr. Goss is FANTASTIC! The real new find of the film for me.
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mae govannen
Dor-Lomin
Jul 12 2008, 9:11am
Post #23 of 27
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Love your remarks about PJ's 'gauzy' time-feel in the LotR movies
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and how important that is for us to get the right feel when going back into that M-e world with 'The Hobbit'.
Quite true, and very nicely expressed! 
'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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Rivendweller
Menegroth
Jul 12 2008, 3:08pm
Post #24 of 27
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Well, I haven't seen this yet for myself but my daughter ( 17 ) and her best friend Matt, ( also 17 ) saw it last night and they both liked it a lot. They attend the same School of the Arts for Film and Television and their tastes in films are identical.
There's something of everything here, The Shire and the Golden Wood and Gondor and kings' houses and inns and meadows and mountains all mixed.
....and there are Elves when you want them.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Formerly A'amel from days gone by.
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Marionette
Nargothrond
Jul 12 2008, 3:26pm
Post #25 of 27
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Hellboy has great creatures and FX, but I don´t relate it to The Hobbit, at least not more than "El laberinto del Fauno". This movie speaks by itself, it´s how I think The Hobbit would be, at least something close
I wonder why people relate Hellboy to The Hobbit, is the most different Del Toro´s movie from Tolkien...
Well, I see that´s only me.
"Dear friend good bye, no tears in my eyes.
So sad it ends, as it began"
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