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AshNazg
Hithlum
Oct 2 2024, 8:13pm
Post #2 of 180
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Do we know when Season 3 will happen? //
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DGHCaretaker
Nargothrond
Oct 2 2024, 8:25pm
Post #4 of 180
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Do we know when Season 3 will happen?
There's no renewal yet from Amazon/Prime Video, so there's no production or air date estimates yet. My uninformed guess is renewed to air Summer or Fall 2026. At that pace, 2030 final season?
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DGHCaretaker
Nargothrond
Oct 2 2024, 8:29pm
Post #5 of 180
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One of the show runners recently said we would have good news about Season 3 soon. I'm assuming the terrific Nielsen ratings along with strong international views have easily clinched a third season for RoP.
Executive Producer Charlotte Brandstrom's actual quote was a less presumptuous "I think there'll be good news soon."
Ratings likely matter far less than Bezos's ego. It'll get all five seasons.
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Oct 2 2024, 9:53pm
Post #6 of 180
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I think that is by far the most likely scenario //
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'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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TFP
Menegroth
Oct 2 2024, 10:03pm
Post #7 of 180
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I think I've avoided any leaks other than briefly watching the teaser. I'll manage to stay unspoiled now, will watch it early UK time in about 10 hours or so's time.
I hope it's decent. would really like to see Celebrimbor go out with some style [and possibly get made into a banner immediately afterwards].
(This post was edited by TFP on Oct 2 2024, 10:04pm)
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
Oct 3 2024, 8:41am
Post #8 of 180
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Loved it loved it loved it. *spoilers marked*
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I stayed away from the leak reports so I don't know how accurate they are but having just finished watching episode 8, I can say that that was an excellent end to the season and a strong set-up for season 3.
The visuals, again, were remarkable - especially the opening sequence in Khazad-dum. Charlie Vickers and Charles Edwards are as phenomenal as always - especially Vickers, who lets his shifting emotions show so subtly.
Ahead be ******spoilers******
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King Durin III vs the Balrog is a visual I'd happily have as a large poster on my wall - that was magnificent. But, did the Balrog fly? Or was it more a 'controlled fall'?
Celebrimbor as 'Sauron's banner' was tastefully done (as tasteful as a brutal murder can be). I'd wondered if we'd get it at all so as part of canon, I'm glad it's there - and both actors delivered it so well.
I love that we ended in the spot where Rivendell will be built. Makes for a nice bit of hope and light, especially with Galadriel repeating Celebrimbor's last words to her.
And to the shock of no-one, we have Gandalf's name (although why he dropped the R from the name given to him is quirk that's ignored), and confirmation that the Dark Wizard is a Blue.** Sounds like we'll get more of him in season 3 so it'll be interesting to see how that story continues.
But overall, season 2 has been a really good watch. I'm really glad that I kept with the show.
**Actually, on second thoughts, I don't think he did say anything to indicate that he's a Blue; only that he's an Istari. I've just added 'Istari' to 'Rhun' and up popped 'Blue'.
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Fantasy novel - The Arcanist's Tattoo
My LOTR fan-fiction
(This post was edited by Ataahua on Oct 3 2024, 9:13am)
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OldestDaughter
Mithlond
Oct 3 2024, 11:01am
Post #9 of 180
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First thing, great episode and overall, really good season. I loved it.
Kinda expected that the Stranger is a younger Gandalf (since the lore change with him being in the 2nd Age, he would appear younger in this show vs the third age of the films) but they did it tastefully. His staff even looked like it could be curved into the one from the Hobbit so I like the connections there.
Elendil and Narsil gave me chills. Love that the sword looks overall the same with the hilt as it did in PJ'S films. Even the scene of Elendil unsheathing it was similar to when Aragorn unsheathed Narsil.
Poor Celebrimbor, they did justice to the banner in such a grotesque way.
The Balrog and King Durin was wild. Especially when seeing the whip and the sword.
I'm sad about Adar, but it was a good throwback to the Prologue.
I wonder if Galadriel will be more ethereal now that she was healed and start to become the Lady of Lorien as we know her. Hoping for Celeborn next season!!!
The end was beautiful, with the elves finding the land that will become Rivendell. I got happy seeing it knowing exactly where they were by just the waterfalls and trees.
Good episode, good season. Sad I have to wait another two years but at least we have War of the Rohirrim in three months.
"Keen, heart-piercing was her song as the song of the lark that rises from the gates of night and pours its voice among the dying stars, seeing the sun behind the walls of the world; and the song of Lúthien released the bonds of winter, and the frozen waters spoke, and flowers sprang from the cold earth where her feet had passed."
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Lieutenant of Dol Guldur
Mithlond
Oct 3 2024, 11:09am
Post #10 of 180
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All in all it was a solid finale I think
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Crazy how fast things go. We've been waiting for this second season for two years and now it's already gone and done. I really, really hope it won't take another two years to make the third one on the other hand if they can improve on S2 with S3 like they improved on S1 with S2 I guess give them all the time they need to figure things out because despite having some minor and some mayor problems with S2 it was a HUGE improvement compared to the first season to me with some stellar moments.
But let's dig deeper into todays finale just like Durin III. dug for Mithril. Like with previous episodes I'd like to do it storyline for storyline because again imho the show stands and falls with it's individual stories:
The Sack of Eregion
The battle continued to be well done. Although I had seen that amazing one-shot going through the battlefield as a preview it was great to see it again in context. A minor gripe: Most of the Eregion scenes took place at the same small courtyard with the same few characters as if this gigantic city wasn't bigger. It made it look small. I loved Elronds dread seeing all those scrolls being destroyed. A very true to his character moment. I've been very vocal about my admiration about Charles Edwards and Charlie Vickers throughout the entire season and their final moments together was no exception. What a way for Celebrimbor to go out. Charles Edwards will be missed! Maybe they find a way to give him a cameo in S3. Either as an illusion by Sauron to torment Galadriel or as an flashback. Also farewell to Adar who was among my favorite characters in S1 and became even more of a great addition in this season. Particular in this episode. Although I saw his Caesar-esque ending coming weeks ago it still was a great scene. Sauron vs Galadriel worked for me as well. Their fight was well choreographed and both actors did a fantastic job. If there's one thing I didn't like about the Eregion storyline was the lack of Arondir and Gil-galad. Arondirs inclusion felt like I was missing some important scenes as he was nearly dead the last time we saw him in last weeks episode while today he looked quite healthy. It's a shame they didn't really know what to do with him this season because Ismael Cruz-Córdova is just a great guy and Arondir was among my favorite characters of S1. At least he gets a chance to fight in the War of the Elves and Sauron next season. Also looking forward to Rivendell being build. The area looked beautiful!
Durin's Bane
Not much going one here except for the epic scene between Durin III and his Bane. Of course they needed to reference the PJ films again with the whip but the shot of Durin attacking the Balrog was beautiful. I guess in future seasons the Dwarves will be mostly concerned with each other. I wonder how the rings play into things because I can't see Durin IV, Disa or Narvi using them. Therefore the question arises as to why the Seven rings are still there. Did Durin IV bring his fathers ring back with him? Why?
The Adventures of Grand Elf and his Little Fellas
To be fair I was not a fan of this storyline. The actors were great but all in all it felt strange (no pun intended). I think the Dark Wizard is one of the Blues but is called "Dark" because they don't have the rights to call him "Blue Wizard"? But one question remains: What happened to the Mystics? Are they alright? We never saw them again. The wizard brought back the Dweller from S1 but she never appeared again since. I'm also not happy with this whole Gandalf thing. But enough is said and will be said on that matter so I won't contribute to that. It felt cheap and done for the wrong reasons imho. I have no idea what his story will be going further. It seemed like the Harfoots and Stoors won't be part of his ongoing story so maybe there will be more going on with him in S3. This season didn't do much for him. But I loved his finale scene with Tom Bombadil, chilling in front of a fire, drinking tea and sing. That was very Tolkien-esque I think.
Rise of the Númenórean Empire
Being a huge fan of the Númenóreans and their storyline in lore but also the version the show wanted to tell I was very sad to see how little screen time they got this season but I guess S3 and S4 will be big on them. At least they started to expand on Middle-earth paving the way for Sauron to deliver some of his Rings to them. Elendil getting Narsil was a cool scene and I am looking forward to Youtubers putting it next to Aragorn receiving Anduril in the ROTK movie. I THINK it was almost completely identical from the camera shots to Elendils reaction. This one felt ok to me because of his connection to Aragorn. Isildur, Estrid and Theo however felt really underdeveloped. As with Arondir I think the show runners were not sure what to do with the Southland storyline after Bronwyn actress Nazanin Boniadi decided to not return for S2. Their storyline felt the most loosely attached to the season in general. But I am looking forward to Númenor in S3. Will we see some sort of Rebellion of the Faithful against the Kings Man until Míriel decides to marry her cousin to keep the peace up until Zigûr arrives?
Closing thoughts
All in all I am quite happy with this second season. It was a huge improvement over the first season and unlike two years ago I really want to rewatch certain episodes and scenes. It also reignited my interest in discussion Tolkien with you in this forum being away for many years and it also made me want to revisit Tolkiens original texts. I've just started to re-read his works and for the first time in English having only read them multiple times in German over the years. So I really am looking forward to this unexpected but very welcome road ahead of me :)
"There is only one Lord of the Ring, only one who can bend it to his will. And he does not share power."
(This post was edited by Lieutenant of Dol Guldur on Oct 3 2024, 11:18am)
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TFP
Menegroth
Oct 3 2024, 12:05pm
Post #11 of 180
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What did I think overall? A few preliminary thoughts.
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(1) Spending at least some time with all of the characters IMO served as a strong reminder that the Celebrimbor/Annatar material has been by a distance the strongest part of the show, across both seasons, so far. The other material seemed at times badly outclassed today. Did I love Celebrimbor's death bed [he wishes it was on a bed] prophesising? Not really, but it was by no means awful.
(2) Sorry, but I didn't like the Stranger/Gandalf stuff much... I would very much like to believe that the DS is a blue, but do, I suppose, doubt they'll be able to resist going with a familiar face in Saruman, he and Gandalf set in show-canon to spend the coming centuries offscreen as uneasy allies/frenemies - yuk. Generally having either of the pair of them in the second age is a little problematic because their canonical modus operandi, of not trying to face Sauron with might, but rather by stealth and inspiring others, feels like it's much more a Third Age than Second Age thing.
(3) I daresay we were supposed to find the Isildur/Theo/Estrid goodbyes moving or suchlike but it just felt to me like we'd not spent nearly enough time with any of them to care. I suppose I quite liked the Numenoreans turning up as colonial overlords, that seemed very proper.
(4) I quite liked the elves finding future-Rivendell as a place or respite, though it feels like a very long way for them to have carried Galadriel.
(5) I've started to mentally filter out/ignore most of the pointless callbacks to other parts of the books or especially to the PJ films [which I, ahem, coridally dislike], I flatter myself that I'm getting quite good at this.
(6) Adar's end was not unpredictable, but felt satisfying enough, and strongly preferable to seeing him unsuccessfully go toe-to-toe with Sauron. Seeing the impact of the ring on him felt right to me somehow.
(7) The K-d stuff wasn't bad. I wonder whether they'll try to stay there or look to move right away. I suppose it'll be the former, although that seems problematic... and now that Prince D has seen the balrog, isn't he likely to at least mention it to his bestie Elrond, who you'd imagine would then at the Council of Elrond give a rather more explicit warning about it?
(This post was edited by TFP on Oct 3 2024, 12:16pm)
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TFP
Menegroth
Oct 3 2024, 12:23pm
Post #12 of 180
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I think it'll take me some repeat viewings to reach a considered view of the season as a whole, and I suppose the two seasons to date as a whole.
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Yistaan
Lindon
Oct 3 2024, 2:47pm
Post #13 of 180
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(7) The K-d stuff wasn't bad. I wonder whether they'll try to stay there or look to move right away. I suppose it'll be the former, although that seems problematic... and now that Prince D has seen the balrog, isn't he likely to at least mention it to his bestie Elrond, who you'd imagine would then at the Council of Elrond give a rather more explicit warning about it? Even in the books, it wasn't exactly a secret that SOMETHING killed Durin VI in Moria so I'd argue that this plothole about something bad in Moria being known about and no one talking about it was already there (they don't even have to know it's a balrog, just something obviously really bad).
People are complaining why they don't leave Moria now that it's known a balrog's in there, but like real world governments I'd imagine there's a coverup among the rulers to prevent mass panic. Only Durin IV, Narvi, and Disa saw the balrog anyway I think.
I'd argue that it now being openly known that the dwarven rings cause insanity and why all 7 of them are still used up till Thrain's time is a bigger plothole.
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OldestDaughter
Mithlond
Oct 3 2024, 3:40pm
Post #14 of 180
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I would of thought that the Dark Wizard was going to be Saruman
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Since the Stranger is a younger Gandalf(I do believe he meant to appear like a younger version of Sir Ian's Gandalf since it is thousands of years apart between what the RoP and the Hobbit are supposed to be). But it sounds like from the Vanity Fair article I just read from the creators that they are saying that the Dark Wizard is definitely not Saruman which really only leaves the option of either of the two Rhun Wizards. I found that interesting since they played with Gandalf for four years, but are flat out saying that the Dark Wizard is not Saruman.
"Keen, heart-piercing was her song as the song of the lark that rises from the gates of night and pours its voice among the dying stars, seeing the sun behind the walls of the world; and the song of Lúthien released the bonds of winter, and the frozen waters spoke, and flowers sprang from the cold earth where her feet had passed."
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jlj93byu
Ossiriand
Oct 3 2024, 3:46pm
Post #15 of 180
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My initial thoughts were not as positive as some, but perhaps because I was too hopeful after episode 5 for a more consistent commitment to good writing and Tolkien's own lore after that episode. Still, this episode wasn't as bad as some S1 episodes, but it's probably one of my least favorite for S2.
Honestly part of my disappointment comes down to the whole Gandalf story line and how it was handled, and the fact that I thought the showrunners early on said that while they'd have to modify the timeline, the would at least not bring any Third Age events into the Second Age, and yet Gandalf's now here and the Balrog as well. Granted, with the Balrog, they kind of indicated that perhaps it's been contained for now? Maybe it doesn't actually destroy Khazad-Dum at all in the series, and so they DO leave that to the Third Age.
Still, the whole Gandalf story line...the fact that he didn't come to Middle-earth until the TA, was the last Istari to arrive, and even specifically indicated he didn't ever travel to the East and yet here he is. Man. Yes, they've been dropping major hints, but I continued to hold out hope they wouldn't be so lazy as to go for the lowest hanging fruit and create a character which will now invite comparison to another portrayal when the door was there for them to take to introduce a new character actually in harmony with Tolkien's own writings, and one who we do know so little about they would have had a wide open canvas on which to paint their own, unique character. I would have loved to see them present two whole new Istari in the Blue Wizards and confidently create their own take on them.
I also wasn't a fan of how Celebrimbor and Galadriel's efforts to keep the Nine from Annatar/Sauron was a complete waste and accomplished nothing. I wish they would have prolonged Sauron's obtaining them longer.
Anyway, it had some good moments, but it just didn't feel like everything came together very well and the landing this season felt a little weak in this final episode.
(This post was edited by jlj93byu on Oct 3 2024, 3:53pm)
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
Oct 3 2024, 5:35pm
Post #16 of 180
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drew Narsil from its sheath, my mind jumped right to Aragorn with Anduril on Amon Hen, jumping on some Orcs, crying "Elendil!" Talk about a time-jump.
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Fantasy novel - The Arcanist's Tattoo
My LOTR fan-fiction
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
Oct 3 2024, 5:50pm
Post #17 of 180
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I'd be surprised if Durin IV left the ring where his dad placed it, if for no other reason than you don't leave a dangerous weapon just lying around for someone with personal ambition to grab.
But yeah, that was an epic way for Durin Sr to go out, from the first glow of yellow light on Durin's face right through to the charge-of-doom. Magnificent.
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Fantasy novel - The Arcanist's Tattoo
My LOTR fan-fiction
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Michelle Johnston
Mithlond
Oct 3 2024, 5:54pm
Post #18 of 180
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Symphonic moments shined the most
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I have watched it twice through, so I have had a chance to know and then enjoy.
The symphonic moments were very well executed great crescendos, the long shot in Eregion. The pulling down of Feanor's statue echoed Saddam Hussain whilst the burning of scrolls reminded me of the burning of the library of Alexandria.
Everything with Charlie in and the progressions with Celebrimbor and Galadriel were weighted inside very well developed story arcs.
However Theo (referred to Isildur's mother as mum aggh!!!) , Isildur, Estrid, Arondir, Earien suffered character whip lash as they were hurled around.
It has been really noticeable with the tight story telling of the Dwarves that they're at the other end of the spectrum, fully developed and logical. Your with D.IV and Disa. The scene from behind of D 111 jumping onto the Balrog was superb.
At last there was some movement with Gandalf but the Dark Wizard had a habit of being Saruman though we are told he is not by the show runners.
I loved the collecting together of the narrative with the voice over and Rory nailed Tom again.
The third season can still be a good deal better. Everyone is where they should be and Kemen is nicely set up.
Numenor needs some real traction in S3 not meanwhile back in Numenor.
Benjamin and Robert were much better this season.
My Dear Bilbo something is the matter with you! you are not the same hobbit that you were.
(This post was edited by Michelle Johnston on Oct 3 2024, 6:01pm)
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Yistaan
Lindon
Oct 3 2024, 6:58pm
Post #19 of 180
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The harfoots sure ditched Gandalf rather unceremoniously once that dark wizard showed up and things got dangerous. So much for sticking by your friends when they need help. They should've just made the Stranger into Saruman with Nori abandoning him being the origin of his contempt for hobbits
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Oct 3 2024, 7:07pm
Post #20 of 180
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Why introduce him, give him his ring ... and just forget all about him. One of many things that makes no sense.
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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Yistaan
Lindon
Oct 3 2024, 7:12pm
Post #21 of 180
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Season 3 --
Sauron: All right Cirdan come on out, we know you have a ring there. Unless you want to end up like Celebrimbor pincushion here (waves infamous arrow-ridden Celebrimbor corpse on a pike played by a Charles Edwards life size doll)
Cirdan: ****, maybe keeping this wasn't such a hot idea after all. Hey you! Yeah beardy with a staff, you. Take this ring and go talk to the nice elf with the army out there, I'm out of here.
Gandalf: What?
(This post was edited by Yistaan on Oct 3 2024, 7:13pm)
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jlj93byu
Ossiriand
Oct 3 2024, 7:13pm
Post #22 of 180
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Plus Cirdan has Narya, which he canonically gives to Gandalf when he arrives IN THE THIRD AGE at the Grey Havens. But, since Gandalf's canonical history has been shredded and thrown out the window, at what point will Cirdan give Gandalf Narya in the show? Cirdan himself is meant to wield that ring for quite some time before finally passing it off to Gandalf. At this point a lot of the canonical history about the rings, and especially Gandalf at this point, has jumped the shark and is just being made up wholecloth.
(This post was edited by jlj93byu on Oct 3 2024, 7:14pm)
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OldestDaughter
Mithlond
Oct 3 2024, 7:20pm
Post #23 of 180
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I'm thinking since we have at least another two years
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until season three comes out, and they are in the middle of writing it, maybe they will listen to what the fans are saying. I feel like season two was a huge improvement of season one(I actually enjoyed season one) and I think they listened a little more to the fans for season 2, so I'm hopeful. Plus we have another two years until that and the Hunt for Gollum movie comes out, alot could happen with licensing and they may be able to clean it up a little more by then.
"Keen, heart-piercing was her song as the song of the lark that rises from the gates of night and pours its voice among the dying stars, seeing the sun behind the walls of the world; and the song of Lúthien released the bonds of winter, and the frozen waters spoke, and flowers sprang from the cold earth where her feet had passed."
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Noria
Hithlum
Oct 3 2024, 7:34pm
Post #24 of 180
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Loved this finale – it was exciting and moving
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Three great and well acted characters eliminated. Sad to see them go.
For me, the heart of this season has been Celebrimbor and Sauron and the conclusion of that arc was excellent – well executed and heart wrenching. Superb acting from both, and I loved Celebrimbor’s foretelling.
I’m a bit sorry but not surprised that the Stranger is Gandalf. It is what it is. We probably all expected that he’d find his name and his staff by choosing to help Nori and Poppy. The confrontation between Gandalf and the Dark Wizard was just a skirmish, and it looks like the big one is still to come.
Loved the reunion of Gandalf and Bombadil, this time on a sort of more equal footing, and the song.
I expected Poppy to stay with the Stoors and Nori to stick with the wizard. It’s interesting that the Halflings will, hopefully, have their own story next season, maybe with the Harfoots.
RIP Adar, a great original and tragic character, even more interesting this season than last. Hazeltine was at least as good as Mawle. Those who thought that Nenya would heal him were right. The Orcs who killed him were understandably not seeing the big picture and that has doomed their kind, so more tragedy.
Since Bronwyn died and Arondir left the Southlands, I find that subplot the least compelling, though I do worry about Berek. I can see fertile ground there for Sauron. Kemin is so utterly annoying – I hope the Ents get him.
The moment between Miriel and Elendil was more-or-less as expected, but the appearance of Narsil was great. It looks like we’ll see Anarion next season; however, who says “my son Anarion” to Anarion’s sister? I expect Numenor to be center stage next season.
It’s always satisfying when a great character gets a good ending, as Durin III chooses to take off his ring and attack the Balrog. The scene between the two Durins was great, like everything else in Dwarven in both seasons has been excellent. Oh, the toxicity of the Seven is a potential plot hole which presumably will be plugged, effectively or not we shall see.
After the Elves suffered all this death and destruction, it was pleasant to see the survivors reach sanctuary. Even if this is a brief respite, “the sun still shines”, is a good note to end the season on. I’m looking forward to the next.
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
Doriath
Oct 3 2024, 7:43pm
Post #25 of 180
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however, who says “my son Anarion” to Anarion’s sister?
I believe that was said by Elendil to Miriel, not someone else to Eärien.
'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'
The Hall of Fire
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