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Laineth
Menegroth
Dec 21 2014, 1:08am
Post #1 of 125
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Tauriel/Kili Appreciation...
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... just because I'm feeling alone. Not quite sure how one of these threads work. 
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Dec 21 2014, 2:05am
Post #2 of 125
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Well if you're going to have an elf/dwarf romance,
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you can do a lot worse than cast Aiden and Evangeline in the roles - I totally believe that anyone would fall for those two.
For me, Kili's death scene was well played: no OTT gasped declarations of love, just desperate anguish. That hit me right in the chest.
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Ataahua's stories
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tarasaurus
Nargothrond
Dec 21 2014, 2:41am
Post #4 of 125
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When she says, "why does it hurt so much?", Evangeline's voice does this thing where it's like all the breath she was holding in is exhaled during that line and I just lost it crying when I saw it both times. It was so very well-played, all of it.
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BalrogTrainer
Ossiriand
Dec 21 2014, 3:39am
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I thought this narrative thread was very tastefully done. You truly got the sense that long-sheltered Tauriel was experiencing love for the first time -- and then losing it. Yes, if you absolutely HAD to cut a thread from the trilogy, this would've been the one, but then, like the book, these movies would've been a near-complete sausage-fest. 
I only hope we get some closure on Tauriel's character in the EE (ditto why Radagast chose to completely sit out the War of the Ring  ).
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DigificWriter
Menegroth
Dec 21 2014, 3:46am
Post #6 of 125
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For as much flack - undeserved, IMO - that the inclusion of Tauriel's character gets, she really does serve a thematic and narrative purpose. Her romance with Kili also does serve a very fundamental thematic purpose in that it serves as a precursor to/set-up for Legolas' friendship with Gimli.
One of the things that I appreciate most about the way Peter and Co. handled the Kili/Tauriel romance subplot is that they didn't do the typical and obvious thing by having him die because he was trying to save her. Her presence during his death was almost incidental to the death itself, which I think made the death even more impactful. I also really enjoyed her reaction to it and the conversation she has with Thranduil about it.
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mae govannen
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 5:05am
Post #7 of 125
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Ditto, ditto, ditto... I love those two!!!
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I appreciate really their presence in the story, for the same reasons as you describe.
'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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mae govannen
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 5:08am
Post #9 of 125
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that such had been your reaction to that scene...
Thank you for sharing it.
'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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mae govannen
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 5:10am
Post #10 of 125
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Beautifully said! Agree with you...//
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'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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PWOKristy
Nevrast
Dec 21 2014, 5:32am
Post #11 of 125
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I love Tauriel's! She's my favorite. I'm all for her! There should be a woman in the Hobbit movies. Excellent to of had those interaction things going on (Tauriel and Kili)!
I love the inclusion of Tauriel! There has to be a woman fighter in the Hobbit movies. I enjoy the romantic thing between Tauriel and Kili.
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Eleniel
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 7:52am
Post #12 of 125
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Are you sure you were watching the same film as me?
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Kili most certainly dies because he takes on Bolg just as he is about to deal a death blow to Tauriel. Kili had been fighting lesser orcs on a level above whilst Tauriel was getting badly beaten by Bolg. she had already alerted Kili to her presence, calling out his name twice and distracting him. He sees the dire straights she is in and launches himself at Bolg to save her!
oh, and please can someone tell me what it is that Kili mouths to Tauriel as he is dying in Bolg's grasp?? It sure looked like "I love you" (twice) to me...
"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort
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DigificWriter
Menegroth
Dec 21 2014, 7:59am
Post #13 of 125
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Kili most certainly dies because he takes on Bolg just as he is about to deal a death blow to Tauriel. Kili had been fighting lesser orcs on a level above whilst Tauriel was getting badly beaten by Bolg. she had already alerted Kili to her presence, calling out his name twice and distracting him. He sees the dire straights she is in and launches himself at Bolg to save her!
oh, and please can someone tell me what it is that Kili mouths to Tauriel as he is dying in Bolg's grasp?? It sure looked like "I love you" (twice) to me...
Let me clarify what I meant. Kili does come to Tauriel's rescue, but he doesn't die directly because of her. He dies while they're fighting side-by-side, but he doesn't 'sacrifice' himself for her as would have been the obvious choice to make in handling/resolving their romantic subplot.
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Eleniel
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 8:05am
Post #14 of 125
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I think that is a matter of interpretation...
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Sure, Kili might have died sooner or later at Ravenhill, outnumbered, over-powered, etc. He would have come up against Bolg eventually, I guess, if Legolas had not stepped in. But Kili most certainly takes on an opponent he has no real chance of besting to save the love of his life. Therefore he did sacrifice himself to save her!
Let me clarify what I meant. Kili does come to Tauriel's rescue, but he doesn't die directly because of her. He dies while they're fighting side-by-side, but he doesn't 'sacrifice' himself for her as would have been the obvious choice to make in handling/resolving their romantic subplot.
"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort
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arithmancer
Hithlum
Dec 21 2014, 2:36pm
Post #15 of 125
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...on "taking on an opponent he has no real chance of besting" before he even knew Tauriel was there. I thought the movie made pretty clear that he was intent on avenging Fili's death (so that he was charging around slaying Orcs, hoping to get to Azog).
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Spriggan
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 2:51pm
Post #16 of 125
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That the idea Kili would otherwise have run away from Bolg sounds right!
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Eleniel
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 3:09pm
Post #17 of 125
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No one is suggesting that he would have run away...
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but actually Arithmancer makes a good point...the focus of Kili's anger was Azog, and that is who he was aiming to reach. However, he sees Tauriel in mortal danger and takes on Bolg to save her from the blow that most likely would have finished her off.
"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort
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arithmancer
Hithlum
Dec 21 2014, 3:36pm
Post #18 of 125
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I appreciate Kili/Tauriel. Personally I loved Tauriel the moment she showed up, I thought she was an excellent addition for the films. I was not initially a huge fan of the idea of a Kili/Tauriel romance, or especially, a love triangle involving Legolas (I am not in general partial to romance). In DoS I took the "romance" to be one sided, and liked it because it included the Feast of Starlight conversation, which was just a beautiful illustration of Elvishness, to me, and had that so-incredible piece of music Shore composed for them.
To me it is clear now that this was a love triangle (Kili and Tauriel in love, Legolas in love with Tauriel). But for me, the objection to this that why must the only major female character in these films be primarily a love object...int he end does not matter. First, because I thought Tauriel was shown to have her own beliefs and agenda before she fell for Kili (her desire to wipe the spiders out at Dol Guldur in DoS can certainly not be linked to a nascent love for Kili...) And second, because in her story's end as a heartbroken, grieving person who has lost her love, she is seen to find understanding from another (male) character who has had the same experience (Thranduil).
Finally, for me the way the film intercut between her grief, and Bilbo's for Thorin, was not distracting, but rather cumulative. I found it effective.
I'm not likely to seek out Kili/Tauriel fanfiction of an alternate universe variety, the romance per se and the compatibility of these two people and how they might have lived together, is not of particular appeal to me, but as an element of the overall Hobbit film story, I liked it.
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Spriggan
Dor-Lomin
Dec 21 2014, 4:32pm
Post #19 of 125
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Well, they were there to remove the leadership.
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Obviously they didn't know Bolg was there when they set out.
My question is this. Imagine Tauriel was not in the film and Kili had encountered Bolg during the course of the fight on Ravenhill. How would he respond in your view?
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marillaraina
Nargothrond
Dec 21 2014, 5:49pm
Post #20 of 125
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Kili most certainly dies because he takes on Bolg just as he is about to deal a death blow to Tauriel. Kili had been fighting lesser orcs on a level above whilst Tauriel was getting badly beaten by Bolg. she had already alerted Kili to her presence, calling out his name twice and distracting him. He sees the dire straights she is in and launches himself at Bolg to save her!
oh, and please can someone tell me what it is that Kili mouths to Tauriel as he is dying in Bolg's grasp?? It sure looked like "I love you" (twice) to me...
I'm going to see it again today so I'll try to watch figure it out, the first time I was caught up in the moment. In the mean time I've seen some gifs of that moment on tumblr and I'm almost thinking maybe he's trying to say what he said to her at the lake, amralime. But I think it might be easier.
That said I don't see the problem if he died for her. I mean he's sacrificing himself for someone else, what kind of world is it if that's considered dishonorable or selfish?
And for all that people say they wanted it I have very little doubt that if Kili had run blindly headlong into Azog everyone would be talking about his stupid recklessness and finding some other way to criticize him for it.
Either way he was going to die because he was intent on getting to Azog, an opponent he also didn't have a chance in hell of defeating or even probably seriously wounding. Instead he faced Bolg and was able to help save Tauriel even if he died doing it.
But I agree with Digific, it wasn't done in such a way where he like jumped in front of a blade for her. He was fighting his damnedest, they were BOTH over matched and let's face it it's the Durins that Azog was really interested in and I'm quite sure Bolg knew that so naturally he's the one he'd kill first.
And if he was trying to say I love you or something a long those lines the point is, he couldn't so there were no declarations.
I both love and hate that death scene. It's very effective so it's a good death scene but at the same time it's so enraging. Bolg - his awful expression and the way he throws Kili's body down on the ground like he's trash to release his blade. It's ugly. And Tauriel had to see it.
(This post was edited by marillaraina on Dec 21 2014, 6:03pm)
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Nira
Menegroth
Dec 21 2014, 5:53pm
Post #21 of 125
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I love Tauriel and I love Kili and I love their friendship...just not their romance //
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"Why, to think of it, we're in the same tale still! It's going on. Don't the great tales never end?" -Samwise
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marillaraina
Nargothrond
Dec 21 2014, 6:02pm
Post #22 of 125
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I appreciate Kili/Tauriel. Personally I loved Tauriel the moment she showed up, I thought she was an excellent addition for the films. I was not initially a huge fan of the idea of a Kili/Tauriel romance, or especially, a love triangle involving Legolas (I am not in general partial to romance). In DoS I took the "romance" to be one sided, and liked it because it included the Feast of Starlight conversation, which was just a beautiful illustration of Elvishness, to me, and had that so-incredible piece of music Shore composed for them.
To me it is clear now that this was a love triangle (Kili and Tauriel in love, Legolas in love with Tauriel). But for me, the objection to this that why must the only major female character in these films be primarily a love object...int he end does not matter. First, because I thought Tauriel was shown to have her own beliefs and agenda before she fell for Kili (her desire to wipe the spiders out at Dol Guldur in DoS can certainly not be linked to a nascent love for Kili...) And second, because in her story's end as a heartbroken, grieving person who has lost her love, she is seen to find understanding from another (male) character who has had the same experience (Thranduil).
Finally, for me the way the film intercut between her grief, and Bilbo's for Thorin, was not distracting, but rather cumulative. I found it effective.
I'm not likely to seek out Kili/Tauriel fanfiction of an alternate universe variety, the romance per se and the compatibility of these two people and how they might have lived together, is not of particular appeal to me, but as an element of the overall Hobbit film story, I liked it.
I didn't find the triangle troublesome because I didn't think it was done in a super obvious way, though I don't know that it enhanced anything.
Like I remember some people saying she just turned to Kili because Thranduil said "No way I'm letting my son marry down" but I actually think it was more a case of well Legolas was there, they were already close so it was just a proximity thing but then when she met Kili she felt the real thing, a real meeting of souls. I don't think after her conversation with Kili Legolas was on her radar that way anymore if he ever was.
And I guess for Legolas it was just something that gave him the initial push to start really thinking for himself instead of just following what his father wanted in terms of the world outside the Woodland Realm. I mean I still like bands I discovered when going out with a certain person even though that person is long out of my life. LOL You never how you are going to discover certain paths in your life.
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Cirashala
Doriath
Dec 22 2014, 8:54am
Post #25 of 125
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She kisses his hand, then kind of "cups" the back of her head with it when she leans down to kiss his lips 
I remember it in that order specifically because the thought entered my mind that she was trying to emulate how a real kiss would have happened between them had he been alive to participate 
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Re:
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Of course he wouldn't have run away, anymore than Fili would have begged for his life. They died heroically. Terribly and caught by more powerful opponents but still heroically 
) 
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