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Elladan
Ossiriand
Oct 25 2010, 10:53pm
Post #26 of 40
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how are the producers/director making this film? We can quibble one way or another over these questions and argue how we think the film should be made but at the end of the day, the film makers will make it in 1 way and there have been a lot of clues and straight up facts as to what that will be. For instance we were told the hobbit will be 2 parts that will conect to tLotRs into a pentology drawing new lines of meaning through the whole series, we were told that they would be expanding the story line of the hobbit to give more background and depth to the story, including the white council and its actions against Dol, Guldur, and we were told the films would strive to retain visual continuity with the original trilogy but with enhancements of its own.
Now that to me says the films will complement tLotRs epic style, it will maintain its live action real world feel (so no magical talking wallets or bipedal sheep). and it will strive to maintain continuity with reguards to the origin cast. This is pure speculation, but I cant imagine they had not considered trying to get Christopher Lee to reprise his role, given he cannot fly, and that a boat would just be absurd, the only course I can see would be to see him film in London, to me his age does not pose a problem, I cannot imagine that at 90 he looks much different to how he looked at 80, however if he has developed a few more wrinkles they are easily hidden by make up or CG.
Transporting the entire cast and a sizeable crew back and forth on a 20 hour one way flight to me seems unfeasible, coupled with the sheer annoyance of discovering you have left Glamdring back in Wellington, so the only solution I can see would be filming Saruman on a blue screen and having a double in a Gollum suit as a stand in on the New Zealand set, if (10 years ago) they could make a convincing character on live action using CGI I dont see the difficulty of simply importing a real person into the shot to replace the stand in.
If not there are a few actors who could surely do a decent substitution of Christopher Lee for the role, I dont think dubbing his voice ove rthe new actor is neccesary or fair.
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entmaiden
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Oct 26 2010, 12:21am
Post #27 of 40
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While I admire Sir Christopher Lee, I don't want to compromise the Hobbit movies by trying to include him. He is not THE Sarumanq to me, so if the character is included in The Hobbit, I'm fine with a different actor.
I don't want The Hobbit to be a reproduction of the LOTR movies. It's a great story that can stand on it's own.
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Gandalf'sMother
Nargothrond
Oct 26 2010, 1:09am
Post #28 of 40
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...but for the most part, I felt it was a mawkish, melodramatic, soap opera-esque version of the Lord of the Rings. I am not a content purist, but I do think the films should try to capture the "tone" of the books, and LOTR, IMO, failed at that.
Having said that, there are many scenes that I found to be sublime. What is frustrating is that those sublime scenes were often sandwiched between some very bad scenes, whether it was Gimli falling or farting, or a 20 minute slo-motion shot of Elijah Wood's face.
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Eruonen
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 1:17am
Post #29 of 40
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Google Christopher Lee 2010...images...the upper left is from this year...
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Yes, at 88 he is older....he still has the voice and I do not doubt the make up or digital techniques to show him consistent with LOTR Saruman. Wizards did not change much in their chosen form over the centuries.
(This post was edited by Eruonen on Oct 26 2010, 1:18am)
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Richie Rich
Ossiriand
Oct 26 2010, 1:19am
Post #30 of 40
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Wow, Mr. Lee looks very good for his age
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My grandma is about that age, and she looks like a walking corpse (it probably doesn't help that she's a raving alcoholic). 
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Plurmo
Nargothrond
Oct 26 2010, 1:20am
Post #31 of 40
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In order to preserve continuity with LOTR
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Saruman must be nothing more than the head of the Wizard's Order, wise and powerful, and he must have the total confidence of Gandalf.
A single scene in the beautiful gardens of Isengard with an intimate and cordial chat between Saruman, Gandalf and Radagast where Saruman tells the other two about his suspicion that the Necromancer might be more powerful than what the other two believed and giving them orders to go to Rivendell (Gandalf) and Lorien (Radagast) would set the stage for an eventual encounter of the two (Gandalf and Radagast) at the borders of Mirkwood. Radagast would be coming from the South on horse, perhaps fleeing a pair of Nazgul and would tell Gandalf about imminent danger, confirming Saruman's prediction. Maybe Radagast would die on the spot from wounds caused by Nazgul weapons.
This single appearance of Saruman would be enough, I think, to place him as a relatively important figure in The Hobbit and also assure the continuity of trust and respect between him and Gandalf even if the real intention of Saruman was the killing of Radagast.
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squire
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 1:48am
Post #32 of 40
(940 views)
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Christopher Lee, then and now in photos.
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Here is a comparison between him as Saruman in LotR, and in this year's video, promoting his album "Heavy Metal Charlemagne":
Obviously he was quite old already when playing Saruman, and he hasn't changed too much in his basic appearance since then. Still, in watching the video and in this photo, I perceive a distinct lack of energy and focus compared to his earlier rather electric performance. I'm not sure make-up or CGI will take us to a convincing "younger" and "good" Saruman on the big screen of The Hobbit.
Of course, his mental acuity and can-do spirit at the age of 88 are still an inspiration to all of us "mature" fans.
squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Footeramas: The 3rd (and NOW the 4th too!) TORn Reading Room LotR Discussion; and "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
squiretalk introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary
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Eruonen
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 2:30am
Post #33 of 40
(914 views)
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If she made it to 88 as a raving alcoholic I guess she has
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a great liver .......don't tell me she also smokes!
What is this about Saruman killing Radagast? Where did that come from?
Yes, I know...Wiki....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radagast_(Middle-earth)
"The only other reference to Radagast in The Lord of the Rings is after the Council of Elrond when it is decided to summon all the allies against Sauron together. Scouts are sent to look for help, and it is reported that Radagast is not at his home at Rhosgobel and cannot be found. Tolkien makes no mention of what has happened to Radagast, and he plays no further role in events.
Tolkien wrote that he gave up his mission as one of the Wizards by becoming too obsessed with animals and plants. Tolkien also wrote that he did not believe that Radagast's failure was as great as Saruman's and that he may eventually have been allowed (or chose) to return to the Undying Lands.[4]"
Obviously he was not killed...I don't think an Istari can be "killed" by another in a real sense...afterall, their form can be renewed.
Love this drawing or Radagast
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/uploads/radagast.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/%3Fa%3D22023&h=354&w=248&sz=26&tbnid=pU-z_trpxTYIbM:&tbnh=121&tbnw=85&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dradagast&zoom=1&q=radagast&usg=__7sgzlR_jBdF6Wu35jVqriJk_gJ4=&sa=X&ei=-jvGTJadIZHvngemiOmpAQ&ved=0CCMQ9QEwAQ
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sphdle1
Hithlum
Oct 26 2010, 2:34am
Post #34 of 40
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Yeah I was never on team McAvoy
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I couldn't never understand why people wanted him...he looks nothing like Holm, his physical appearance is not even remotely Bilbo-like, let alone Hobbit-like. He doesn't have the comedic side of things in his abilities from what I've seen so far...I just don't get it...anyway I am beyond thrilled that Freeman is Bilbo, and that they made the right choice.
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AinurOlorin
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 2:46am
Post #35 of 40
(910 views)
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The Wizards came old and stayed that way for 2000 years.
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Early on Saruman's hair was black, but this film is not going THAT far back. Gandalf was always a grey/white bearded old timer from the moment he stepped onto the shores of Eriador. In fact, I will throw a series of tantrums if Gandalf's beard is a single centimeter shorter than it is in the incarnation of Gandalf The Gray we saw in Fellowship of the Rings. None of that goatee s#@!# they hit us with in TTT and ROTK. Lee would be half buried under flowing hair and beard. As long as they didn't make him run about, which should not be necessary, everything should be fine in the appearances department. These Wizards are Holy Spirits, Angels (Maiar) in manlike forms. They are not subject to aging, and were never young. So it isn't like, say, Dumbledore, where to show him sixty years prior means trying to make him look sixty years younger. If Gandalf or Saruman look more than a year or two younger than the did in Fellowship, then someone is messing up the story, even if the scenes being shot are from six hundred years ago.
"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"
"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."
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Eruonen
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 2:49am
Post #36 of 40
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In many ways, Radagast is Tom Bombadil in his ability and
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actions in Middle Earth.....both strongly attached to flora and fauna, both disliked traveling beyond their home areas etc.
(This post was edited by Eruonen on Oct 26 2010, 2:49am)
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Richie Rich
Ossiriand
Oct 26 2010, 3:50am
Post #37 of 40
(896 views)
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Is that she is slowly pickling herself, and will live forever. 
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Kangi Ska
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 4:57am
Post #38 of 40
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10-4: I hesr you loud and clear
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and am with you on both counts.
Kangi Ska Resident Trickster
New Zealand is as close to Middle-earth as you can get.
At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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AinurOlorin
Gondolin
Oct 26 2010, 4:57am
Post #39 of 40
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I don't really see how they work Tom in and remain faithful. Radagast and Glorfindel are easier
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In so much as Glorfindel spends much of his time in Rivendell, the mightiest Elf Lord there by Tolkien's account, and is one of the few known members of The White Council. Twould be the easiest (and most Appropriate!) thing in the world to give him the odd line or two at the council scene. Radagast is one of the Wizards, and while not specifically mentioned as a council member through direct nor indirect means, we know that he lent aid to their efforts, and it is likely that he met with them. But Gandalf explicitly tells us that Tom Bombadil would not have come to Elrond's councils in any event, and that he no longer stepped beyond the boundaries of his own land.
"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"
"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."
(This post was edited by AinurOlorin on Oct 26 2010, 4:58am)
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Flagg
Dor-Lomin
Oct 26 2010, 1:59pm
Post #40 of 40
(874 views)
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...Radagast and Tom Bombadil never did appear together at the same time, did they? Hmm...
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