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Thorins_apprentice
Rohan
Jan 31 2015, 1:19am
Post #1 of 20
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Anyone else feel the Misty mountains song didnt go with the tone of the movie?
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When i hear the Dwarves sing in the sombre tone, i feel like the movie should have felt more adventurous but shorter.Like an old tale rather than Epic CGI action fest.
It's a missed opportunity.In my opinion,i think it would have been better if Del Toro directed it.It was essentially Lotr 2
We are more connected than ever before, more able to spread our ideas and beliefs, our anger and fears. As we exercise the right to advocate our views, and as we animate our supporters, we must all assume responsibility for our words and actions before they enter a vast echo chamber and reach those both serious and delirious, connected and unhinged.
(This post was edited by Thorins_apprentice on Jan 31 2015, 1:24am)
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Lissuin
Valinor
Jan 31 2015, 5:39am
Post #2 of 20
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No. Fast forward to Thorin's death scene,
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not forgetting Rivendell, riddles in the dark, burning pines, eagles, the Carrock, Mirkwood, spiders, elven dungeons, a rotting town on a lake, a vast treasure hoard in a ruined city under a mountain, a dragon, a burning town on a lake, a ruined city on a hill, mortal combat, and the return home of a deeply changed hobbit.
And no.
But consider that I am probably the only one here who did not appreciate Pan's Labyrinth.
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Earl
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Jan 31 2015, 6:11am
Post #3 of 20
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I felt like the rest of the movie didn't go with the tone of Misty Mountains :)
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I did wish the films had more of a "wondrous" feel, were much more relaxed in pace, and spent more time at locations instead of between them.
The EEs do help a bit, but still, there was no sense of wonder when we got to the different locations. LOTR had that - along with the characters, even the audience felt it, even at minor locations like the Argonath.
Oh well, it's all said and done now, almost all anyway :)
The Hobbit Soundtracks - Being an online archive of information concerning Howard Shore's score for The Hobbit films.
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Elizabeth
Half-elven
Jan 31 2015, 6:19am
Post #4 of 20
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I was practically moved to tears when I saw that in the trailers. I thought maybe Peter really did "get" it. And, truly, all the Hobbiton scenes felt that way, Alas, it veered off into "action movie" territory, and left all the real visionary, mythical stuff behind.
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Arannir
Valinor
Jan 31 2015, 11:21am
Post #5 of 20
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I was practically moved to tears when I saw that in the trailers. I thought maybe Peter really did "get" it. And, truly, all the Hobbiton scenes felt that way, Alas, it veered off into "action movie" territory, and left all the real visionary, mythical stuff behind.
If only the movies had the feeling of that masterpiece of a scene...
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
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burrahobbit
Rohan
Jan 31 2015, 11:54am
Post #6 of 20
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Evocative and wondrous as Earl and Elizabeth said above.
For me, the Hobbit movies only again reached these heights in Riddles in the Dark and Bilbo's encounter with Smaug, both of which are scenes with great characters, wonderful dialogue and rich settings (and adapted closely to the book).
Often the Hobbit book is patronised as merely a children's tale, but this misses the nature of the story. Little scenes such as tra-la-lally elves, or a conversation with Roac, or the dwarves playing their harps in Erebor, are vital in creating a wonderful and rich fairy tale world. Without these scenes (and with many incongruous and dull chase and fight scenes added), the films felt flat, and largely missed the joys of the original story.
(This post was edited by burrahobbit on Jan 31 2015, 11:54am)
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dormouse
Half-elven
Jan 31 2015, 12:06pm
Post #7 of 20
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No - it's a spine-tingling moment that says so much....
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... about the character of the dwarves, whom we then follow through the rest of the story. That magical moment expresses everything they feel about the quest: feelings they echo later in the films, especially when they open the hidden door and re-enter the Mountain.
The magic, the wonder, the depth of feeling - it's all there. I didn't see an 'Epic CGI action fest' whatever that might be. I saw the unfolding of a 'quest to regain a homeland and slay a dragon' and the consequences that had. I saw a wonderful film.
If Guillermo del Toro had directed some things would have looked very different and some would have been done in different ways, but the link to Lord of the Rings would have been present: he said that he wanted his films to tone in with Peter Jackson's.
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Riven Delve
Tol Eressea
Jan 31 2015, 12:25pm
Post #8 of 20
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When the hidden door is opened...
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Not only the song, but the reverent way in which the Dwarves sing it, gives us a glimpse into their culture that we've never had before--and in fact, few in Middle-earth, I would guess, have ever had it, since Dwarves are such a secretive race. The song, and the mystery behind it, is, IMO, what stirs Bilbo's Tookish side and inspires him to leave everything behind to explore this mysterious people on their adventure.
All throughout the adventures abounding in AUJ, Bilbo is the outsider, and it isn't until he declares his intention to help them regain that icon of their culture, the Lonely Mountain, that the Dwarves as a whole really accept him into the company.
Fast-forward to the moment that the Dwarves enter the secret door, and see the overpowering emotion of Thorin and Balin. The reverence they feel there is a direct parallel to the reverence of the Misty Mountains song--a song of an exiled people, who have now achieved the first important step in their quest to restore the glory of their culture.
That magical moment expresses everything they feel about the quest: feelings they echo later in the films, especially when they open the hidden door and re-enter the Mountain.
“Tollers,” Lewis said to Tolkien, “there is too little of what we really like in stories. I am afraid we shall have to try and write some ourselves.”
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Glorfindela
Valinor
Jan 31 2015, 12:28pm
Post #9 of 20
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I think the song works beautifully as part of the entire story – and I think there should have been a hint of it in the later films.
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swordwhale
Tol Eressea
Jan 31 2015, 3:50pm
Post #10 of 20
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also, Misty Mountains and LET IT GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
are kind of vying for Stuck In My Head Forever song....
Na 'Aear, na 'Aear! Mýl 'lain nallol, I sûl ribiel a i falf 'loss reviol...
To the sea, to the sea, the white gulls are crying, the wind is blowing and the white foam is flying...
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swordwhale
Tol Eressea
Jan 31 2015, 4:55pm
Post #11 of 20
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I appreciate it, I get it, I like the way myth (the young girl's forays into Faerie) and reality (the woman's struggles against a repressive regime) intertwined (when the girl aquires a "magic item" in Faerie, the woman gets a similar item in reality to help her).
it's just too dark and violent for me to ever watch again.
Na 'Aear, na 'Aear! Mýl 'lain nallol, I sûl ribiel a i falf 'loss reviol...
To the sea, to the sea, the white gulls are crying, the wind is blowing and the white foam is flying...
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Michelle Johnston
Rohan
Jan 31 2015, 7:03pm
Post #12 of 20
(988 views)
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What is the tone of the 480 minutes
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Good Morning
Misty Mountains Song
Bilbo wordless entranced by Rivendell
You don't have a home
Bilbo wordless scene inside a desolate Bag End or
with Gandalf scratching his pipe
or
food fights and naked frolics
stone giants as transformers
it could have been worse
action ……no reaction
Elves leaping over Dwarves in CGI unison
Legolas stepping improbably on people and masonry
or
The glorious images of Bilbos view above the trees or the first view of Lake Town or the magnificent Dragon.
If you watch any of David Leans master pieces you never notice whether its a light or a dark moment a magnificent view of the desert or a tension wrapped interpersonal exchange. You are gripped by a story cohesive whole and believable across 180 minutes as you travel in the world the story takes you through. Substance is everything style is to support it.
My Dear Bilbo something is the matter with you! you are not the same hobbit that you were.
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Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor
Jan 31 2015, 9:23pm
Post #13 of 20
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I thought it was WONDERFUL!!! I'm probably in the minority here, in that I LOVED the movies (not every scene, mind you, but overall) and I've never seen "Pan's Labyrinth" so I couldn't tell you if del Toro would have been better. IMO, no, even if this was essentially LOTR 2 I've gotta wonder, what's wrong with that?
Why yes, I DO look like Anna Friel!
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Rembrethil
Tol Eressea
Jan 31 2015, 11:41pm
Post #14 of 20
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That song set a standard I thought would be followed in later films, but the lack of any more songs or sweeping musical movements did seem a bit incongruous with the first film. I was surprised that the 'Misty Mountain Theme' never once featured again. I thought it was going to be the new 'Fellowship Theme'.
I think there was a quote somewhere, where PJ said he had to change some things because of the studio's demands. I think he attributed it to the lower ratings of AUJ, and he said something to the effect that they, 'let him do AUJ his way', but they stepped in later and became more demanding.
Call me Rem, and remember, not all who ramble are lost...Uh...where was I?
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Glorfindela
Valinor
Feb 1 2015, 12:39am
Post #15 of 20
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I don't think you are in a minority at all
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There are many, many people (including me, and not every scene) who love the films, hence the great box-office figures.
I have seen Pan's Labyrinth, and although the visuals were good, I did not like the tone of it and thought it was a rather horrible horror film that I would not see again.
I thought it was WONDERFUL!!! I'm probably in the minority here, in that I LOVED the movies (not every scene, mind you, but overall) and I've never seen "Pan's Labyrinth" so I couldn't tell you if del Toro would have been better. IMO, no, even if this was essentially LOTR 2 I've gotta wonder, what's wrong with that?
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Kim
Valinor
Feb 1 2015, 1:50am
Post #16 of 20
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For me, it set the tone of AUJ, and I loved how it was used throughout as the theme of the Company. I do wish it had been used in DOS and BOFA, at least as a reprise. I was hoping we'd have a scene of the dwarves singing to Thorin in Erebor as described in the book, or at least humming the tune. And AUJ felt pretty adventurous to me.
I can't say how it might have been if GDT had directed it - I did like Pan's Labyrinth, but it was so dark that I've only seen it twice and have no desire to watch it again. I wouldn't have wanted that for The Hobbit films.
#OneLastTime
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Pandallo
Rivendell
Feb 1 2015, 3:27am
Post #17 of 20
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I'm hoping that Thorin's Funeral might have a reprise of the Misty Mountains with the lyrics
"The mountain throne once more is freed!
O! wandering folk, the summons heed!
Come haste! Come haste! across the waste!
The king of friend and kin has need.
Now call we over mountains cold,
'Come back unto the caverns old'!"
It's very doubtful, (in the book this was used as a rallying cry for the Dwarves) but I could imagine Bofur starting this verse while standing next to the casket in a melancholic fashion.
What is dd is that people originally complained about the Misty Mountains theme being too prevalent. They wondered where the other Dwarven themes were and felt they were sidelined for the Misty Mountains theme.
Also to be fair... they are kind of over the Misty Mountains by the end of AUJ.
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Ereinion Nénharma
Lorien
Feb 1 2015, 9:21pm
Post #18 of 20
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...but not FAR over the Misty Mountains (cold), and not yet in dungeons deep and caverns old.
''Do not fear the shadows, for seeing them means light is near...''
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Bumblingidiot
Rohan
Feb 3 2015, 1:05am
Post #20 of 20
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If you take the 3 films as a whole, there were some misses in that respect - I thought the sense of mystery was a bit lacking sometimes. For example, the feeling of being in an unfamiliar place, and lost is a big part of the appeal of the book for me - part of the mystery of finding the hidden valley was lost, because it was filmed as the end of an action scene, and not at dusk, as in the book.
Then, when they're escaping in the goblin tunnels, in near pitch darkness, and the goblins creep up on them - again, turned into an all-out action scene. And Mirkwood - I think it was a mistake to show the Lonely Mountain from the top of the Carrock - Mirkwood is a huge forest and the feeling of being isolated inside it, being looked at by mysterious creatures when you slept (the eyes, in the book), having no sense that you'll ever get to the other side; those aspects were toned down in the book - though some of it got back into the EE (thought the white stag was beautifully photographed and ambiguous, for example). And, of course, the lack of the woodland feasts - that in the book are connected as much to dreams as to real life (the dwarves are able to visit the feasts in their dreams, but not when awake).
The lack of this mysterious feel was most noticeable in the first two films - 2nd half of AUJ and all of DOS. BOTFA, as the least magical or mysterious part of the book, was better served by the style of film-making chosen, and I thought they even managed to enhance the magical feel of some scenes in the last film - Erebor felt suitably sombre and mysterious, for example.
"Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear."
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