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Scourge of the Stoors
Rivendell
Oct 24 2014, 2:49pm
Post #1 of 24
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Hoping the Elves will be kept at a minimum
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I really hope the Elves don't steal the show. As in, they'd better not kill Azog or Bolg. They've already taken way too much of the spotlight from the Dwarves. No more, please. Also I don't want Bolg, the one who lost a fight to an Elf, to kill Thorin. That would make Thorin look way too weak. Does anyone agree?
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Arannir
Valinor
Oct 24 2014, 3:54pm
Post #2 of 24
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Especially Tauriel needs a satisfying end now that she has been introduced imho.
Of course, no Bolg or Azog killing... but they should have their moments.
Given that the negotiations will play quite some role in Bot5A there is no question Thranduil will get to play his part.
Plus Bolg did not exactly lose... but the whole fights amidst a battle will be very different from that duel anyway.
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
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joec_34
Rivendell
Oct 24 2014, 5:12pm
Post #3 of 24
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Maybe Thorin won't look too bad.
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In the book, Bolg's guard plays a role, so maybe it won't be a fair fight between Thorin and Bolg. I hope that Thorin will be fighting Azog and about to kill him, when Bolg inflicts a mortal wound. Dain and Beorn see Thorin in peril, and charge toward Thorin/Azog and Bolg, respectively. Thorin keeps his dignity, Dain gains our trust (by rushing to Thorin's aide, and beheading Azog), and giant-bear-Beorn gets to rip Bolg limb from limb.
"Happy painting and God bless, my friend." - Bob Ross
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Glorfindela
Valinor
Oct 24 2014, 5:23pm
Post #4 of 24
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There should definitely be far more of Thranduil than there was in DoS, and far less of the other two 'elves'.
I really hope the Elves don't steal the show. As in, they'd better not kill Azog or Bolg. They've already taken way too much of the spotlight from the Dwarves. No more, please. Also I don't want Bolg, the one who lost a fight to an Elf, to kill Thorin. That would make Thorin look way too weak. Does anyone agree?
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dormouse
Half-elven
Oct 24 2014, 5:58pm
Post #5 of 24
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The elves are an essential part of the battle and of the story as written.
There has been a lot of focus on Thranduil, Legolas and Tauriel in the promotional material but I think that has to do with their popularity with the general audience. And they look good. But when it comes to the actual films, Bilbo and the dwarves are the heart of the story and I can't imagine for a minute that the last film will be any different - I can't see why it would be.
As for Bolg,I don't think he did lose the fight with Legolas. It was a stalemate - and I can't see any comparison between that and whatever happens on the battlefield. Thorin isn't weak, we know that and he's already proved it at Azanulbizar and in facing Smaug. But on a battlefield it doesn't matter how strong a character is, is only takes on slip, one unlucky stroke.
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Riven Delve
Tol Eressea
Oct 24 2014, 6:20pm
Post #6 of 24
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I hope to see a great deal of Elves
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(or at least, two of them) at Dol Guldur--although I hope that scene isn't a major part of the movie. And I won't mind if Thranduil is a lead character at all. But I do hope Legolas and Tauriel are just supporting characters.
I don't think we need to worry too much about Thorin being shown as weak--at least, not in terms of war prowess. Probably more in terms of moral strength or stability. 
“Tollers,” Lewis said to Tolkien, “there is too little of what we really like in stories. I am afraid we shall have to try and write some ourselves.”
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Avandel
Half-elven
Oct 24 2014, 6:20pm
Post #7 of 24
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And it's NEVER been a "fair fight" one to one with Azog - think AUJ kind of makes the point, really, that Azog is able to send dwarves scattering like pinballs. Thorin is like 5' 3" and Azog is what, 7-8' and possibly mounted on a warg so large it's as tall as Thorin at the shoulder and able to take most of Thorin into its jaws.
Bolg looks equally large - after all, these are killing machines who were able to wipe out Beorn's people as well. That's all they do - nasty things that don't seem to feel pain much either if they are running around with imbedded metal plates and cut themselves up for fun. It's not like these are bar fights between a couple of guys who have had too many or a fight breaking out between a couple of players on a field. These can't possibly BE "fair fights" unless Thorin gets a light saber or something.
IMO wasn't even a "fair fight" between Aragon and the Uruk-hai. Anyway for me that's kind of the point with these DWARVES, especially the line of Durin - they will go charge anyway, even if it's suicidal. Can't get more epic than that. 
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Avandel
Half-elven
Oct 24 2014, 6:44pm
Post #8 of 24
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More dwarves! more dwarves! *grins*
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*grumbles* is this some kind of "manly" thought with some, that to be thought of as "strong" you have to win EVERY fight? I'm not a big sports fan but I have watched those that are get pretty mad when their team loses - maybe it's like that. *Grins* then guess Gandalf has a problem too, he keeps getting delayed  . And even succumbing to dragon sickness - Thorin knew that, and went on anyway, even knowing the potential cost. Just love this character!
But I do hope Legolas and Tauriel are just supporting characters.
As do I, tho I know their fans will feel differently (but I figure Legolas already is pretty well represented in LOTR screen time wise). But think Dormouse made an excellent point in an earlier thread - however people feel about Tauriel, if she loses her life in BOFA that event would ripple into the canon events. Hadn't thought about it but other boards are commenting on potential issue if Tauriel should die - so I am really hoping she lives, actually, after thinking about what her death would be like in BOFA and with the emphasis that seems to have been put on this character re the PR so far. Tho I still wonder if re the PR it's just "feeding the fans" with non-spoilery stuff and (hope) there is more juicy PR as the film gets closer - not too spoilery tho!
Hó , Það sé ég föður minn
Hó , Það sé ég móður mína, og Hó, Það sé ég bræður mínir og systur mínar
Hó , Það sé ég mitt fólk aftur í byrjun
Hó, gera Þeir kalla til mín, og bjóða mér að taka minn stað meðal þeirra í sölum Valhallar
Hvar hugrakkir mun lifa að eilífu
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MorgolKing
Rivendell
Oct 24 2014, 7:00pm
Post #9 of 24
(835 views)
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I don't want to watch teenage mutant ninja elves!
I really hope the Elves don't steal the show. As in, they'd better not kill Azog or Bolg. They've already taken way too much of the spotlight from the Dwarves. No more, please. Also I don't want Bolg, the one who lost a fight to an Elf, to kill Thorin. That would make Thorin look way too weak. Does anyone agree?
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dubulous
Rohan
Oct 24 2014, 8:14pm
Post #10 of 24
(805 views)
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Yeah, depends on the elves for me
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I can't wait to see Galadriel and Elrond in Dol Guldur, and Thranduil is fine, but Legolas and Tauriel are just superfluous to the story and seem to be taking up valuable screentime that could be employed much better (or at least they were in DoS and I can't see them suddenly getting more intersting in BotFA when they add nothing to the story).
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NecromancerRising
Gondor
Oct 24 2014, 8:17pm
Post #11 of 24
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Elrond and Galadriel in Dol Guldur is the scene i am looking forward to the most.Thranduil too and last but not least the resolution of Tauriel's arc,a fine and very well-written character.
"You cannot find peace by avoiding life"
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Noria
Gondor
Oct 24 2014, 8:17pm
Post #12 of 24
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Whether we want it or not, I’d be very surprised if we don’t see quite a bit more of the Mirkwood Elves in TBOTFA
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It has to happen. DoS set up a number of story strands involving the Elves that have to be resolved for the story as a whole to be complete. The Siege of Erebor will be where this stuff pays off, I imagine.
Neither is it likely that PJ, being who he is, will pass up the opportunity to have Legolas perform more fantastic feats when the opportunity arises. Thranduil and Tauriel too.
While I could easily enjoy these movies without more Legolas stunts, I would be disappointed if the themes introduced with the Elves were not brought to fruition. Plus I really like Thranduil, Legolas and Tauriel.
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Bladerunner
Gondor
Oct 24 2014, 11:43pm
Post #13 of 24
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I'm hoping the dwarves don't get knocked off of their feet so easily while fighting Orcs....
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..like as was shown during the Battle of Azanulbizar and the Thorin and Azog confrontation during the "Out of the Frying Pan and Into the Fire" scenes.
I envision dwarves as being very dense and stout with low centers of gravity and employing leverage into their fighting technique, but yet these films continues to show them getting easily knocked off of their feet during pitched battles with orcs.
One time they seemed to hold their own was against the weaker Goblin-town goblins.
Perhaps Thorin will be shown finally holding his ground at least for a few strikes during his battle with either Azog or Bolg....
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mae govannen
Tol Eressea
Oct 25 2014, 7:23am
Post #14 of 24
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Seconding you on all points...//
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'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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mae govannen
Tol Eressea
Oct 25 2014, 7:26am
Post #15 of 24
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'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)
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NecromancerRising
Gondor
Oct 25 2014, 8:15am
Post #16 of 24
(666 views)
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to see Jacskon passing up that opportunity this time, to be honest,Noria
"You cannot find peace by avoiding life"
(This post was edited by NecromancerRising on Oct 25 2014, 8:19am)
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Scorchster
Rivendell
Oct 25 2014, 11:35am
Post #17 of 24
(657 views)
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Whilst I understand your concerns about the Elves stealing the show, I'd actually prefer to see more Elves, Dwarves, everything and everyone.
It is, after all, our last time with all these characters. I really hope all their plot threads are concluded adequately - so I'm hoping PJ gives them all enough screentime to adequately resolve everything.
I'd hate to see all that character development for the elves (especially Thranduil) go to naught - I definitely don't want those threads to be sidelined.
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Noria
Gondor
Oct 25 2014, 1:28pm
Post #18 of 24
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PJ could skip Legolas’ stunts as far as I am concerned too though I don't hate them. They amuse me slightly and I enjoy the execution.
But PJ won’t skip them. As far as I can tell from the reaction from when I saw DoS in a theatre, the audience likes them. Bombur and his flying barrel also.
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NecromancerRising
Gondor
Oct 25 2014, 1:47pm
Post #19 of 24
(614 views)
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Oh i enjoyed his excellent choreography
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in DOS barrels too.But at this point,i think i have seen enough of his undoubtedly great skill in fighting.
"You cannot find peace by avoiding life"
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Girdle of Melian
Lorien
Oct 25 2014, 6:14pm
Post #20 of 24
(587 views)
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I really they hope they portray both Galadriel and Elrond as more capable in both lore and physical prowess than Thandruil and Legolas. I just really want to see the distinction between a Noldorin Elf that trained with the Valar and came from Aman and another one who has Maian descent.
I know people also hated Celeborn, but he can be redeemed in this movie in Dol Guldur!
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Arveldis
Rivendell
Oct 25 2014, 6:56pm
Post #21 of 24
(587 views)
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Although I would be remiss if I didn't mention that as a whole, I do like Elves. I was fascinated by them the first time I read LotR and still am. In The Hobbit, though, they're overused. There was a time when this story was about a Hobbit and thirteen Dwarves trying to reclaim their home, not two certain Elves running all over Rhovanion.
What really annoyed me last year was how they were marketed. It seemed like every piece of promo material had an elf in it. Tauriel's and Legolas' faces were plastered on pretty much everything. Thranduil, though, was shoved to the back. By the time the movie came out, I was burned out on Elves. I had gotten two characters that I really didn't care for shoved down my throat for months. It was devastating to me that Mirkwood, a place I had really looked forward to viewing, was sullied by the appearances of two characters that, at that point, I couldn't stand.
Thranduil, on the other hand, was like a breath of fresh air. He was different and unexpected: feral, regal, and he brought what I like to call "lethal grace" to the screen. I was blown away by LP's performance. But he got far less screen time than an invented character.
I've come to acknowledge that, whether I like it or not, the Elves are here to stay. PJ's introduced a story line and he has to resolve it. I know that the Elves have a big part to play in the next movie, and I am anxious to see how things play out. But I really wish that Legolas and Tauriel would be toned down from DoS (and I know that the chances of that happening are very slim) and that we could get back to the story. I've never been a big fan of Tauriel -- I'm probably going to get major backlash here -- and I just hope that she is a) promoted less and b) has a very small part to play. I also hope that the "love triangle" will just turn out to be a bad dream. It was a lousy directing decision in my opinion, and definitely substandard.
That said, I cannot wait to see some of the other Elves in the film, like Galadriel, Elrond, and Thranduil. I'm sure the battle at Dul Guldur will be spectacular and that LP will deliver another stunning performance.
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Lurker in the Mirk
Valinor
Oct 27 2014, 2:29am
Post #22 of 24
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Very cool to see positive views in this thread all round, but Noria
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just got to say, while really happy to see support for Thranduil, I'm mildly surprised to see him in this list of yours
Plus I really like Thranduil, Legolas and Tauriel.
"I'll say dark and gritty, which, with the Elvenking, translates as Hot and Sexy.  " - vanima ephel
I fancy myself an ME BFF (Book/Film Fan)
Thranduil Appreciation
Tis true: more appreciation threads for Thranduil exist than ME movies. Threadcount: XX
I | II | III | IV | V | VI | VII | VIII | IX | X | XI | XII | XIII | XIV | XV | XVI | XVII | XVIII | XIX
Thrall Wars!: What business do Elves, Dwarves or Men(?) have with drooling thralls, yea, with smartphones in tow, unto the slopes of Erebor? ... oh, yes, the Hobbit's lingering in some shadows, ever ready to swoop to the hairy rescue. Take cover if you dare! Teh partsies: Prologue (aka the 'tater-mash of whatever came before), two, three, three-appendix: An Unexpected Flashback, four, five (new, posted 20 August)
"BoFA"= The Battle || "BotFA"/"tBotFA" = The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies
=======
 Middle-earth dispatches out of the lurkmirk
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Noria
Gondor
Oct 27 2014, 1:03pm
Post #23 of 24
(516 views)
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Lurker, I think that Thranduil is a great character.
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He's fascinating, enigmatic, complex and lovely to look at. The writers and Lee Pace have produced a wonderful Elf King who enhances the movie.
But Thranduil is also a jerk IMO and all the tragic back story and flowing hair does not mitigate that as far as I am concerned. I just don't do the misunderstood bad boy thing.
I would say exactly the same thing but to a lesser degree about Thorin.
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Lurker in the Mirk
Valinor
Oct 28 2014, 2:45am
Post #24 of 24
(509 views)
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He's fascinating, enigmatic, complex and lovely to look at. The writers and Lee Pace have produced a wonderful Elf King who enhances the movie. can't argue with this at all
I just don't do the misunderstood bad boy thing. just imo, the misunderstood part in the movies feels more a construct of the movie-makers, but what do i know
I would say exactly the same thing but to a lesser degree about Thorin. no smartmouthing but I really like your equal-opportunity... judgment for want of a better phrase Though I would challenge the degree of these 2's jerkhood. Despite the inequalities in all other aspects, imo, I'd say they've got parity in this department.
"I'll say dark and gritty, which, with the Elvenking, translates as Hot and Sexy. " - vanima ephel
I fancy myself an ME BFF (Book/Film Fan)
Thranduil Appreciation
Tis true: more appreciation threads for Thranduil exist than ME movies. Threadcount: XXI
I | II | III | IV | V | VI | VII | VIII | IX | X | XI | XII | XIII | XIV | XV | XVI | XVII | XVIII | XIX | XX
Thrall Wars!: What business do Elves, Dwarves or Men(?) have with drooling thralls, yea, with smartphones in tow, unto the slopes of Erebor? ... oh, yes, the Hobbit's lingering in some shadows, ever ready to swoop to the hairy rescue. Take cover if you dare! Teh partsies: Prologue (aka the 'tater-mash of whatever came before), two, three, three-appendix: An Unexpected Flashback, four, five (new, posted 20 August)
"BoFA"= The Battle || "BotFA"/"tBotFA" = The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies
=======
Middle-earth dispatches out of the lurkmirk
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