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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
"The last of our kin..." scene
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FoFo64
Rivendell


Feb 7 2014, 2:10pm

Post #26 of 32 (132 views)
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Nice logic! [In reply to] Can't Post

Oooooooooo, this answer makes a lot of sense! I actually always thought maybe it had something to do with the hot presence of Smaug on the air of Erebor. And with what you're saying about Moria having springs, which it undoubtedly does, considering the well Pippin knocks the bucket into, it makes a lot of sense that perhaps the difference in air quality contributed to the mummification of the Erebor dwarves versus the Moria ones. This'll let me enjoy this scene a lot more now! lol Thank you Elizabeth, yay science!


In Reply To
If Moria is moist (which it probably is, with that open well and probably subterranean springs) flesh would decay. If the atmosphere in the cavern where the Dwarf bodies are is dry, they'd mummify.


'It is a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt over so small a thing...such a little thing...' Boromir; Fellowship of the Ring Film

(This post was edited by FoFo64 on Feb 7 2014, 2:10pm)


Elanor of Rohan
Lorien


Feb 7 2014, 2:13pm

Post #27 of 32 (130 views)
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Moria and Dwarrodelf [In reply to] Can't Post

had been the heart of the Dwarven Kingdoms since the beginning of time. Balin fought, and of course survived, the terrible Battle of Azanulbizar in front of its gates. The fact that, after all those terrible tragedies, he wanted to go back to Moria could represent a kind of tribute to Durin's line: "I could not see you on the throne of Erebor but I could reconquer Dwarrowdelf to honour your memory and the memory of your beloved nephews and heirs."
Moreover, Balin was both a member of the Royal family and had always had an important role as far as politics were concerned (it's interesting that Ken Stott calls him a "consigliere", an Italian word meaning advisor, possibly referring to Italian Renaissance politics).
So, probably he was the only survivor of the BO5A to have the political stature to attempt such a mission. His brother Dwalin was a warrior and he wanted to enjoy a well-earned rest. As you all know, they had two cousins (their father Fundin had a brother, Gror, who was Gloin and Oin's father, Crazy): Gloin had a family of his own so of course he didn't want to leave his wife and son, while Oin was alone so he could have been a suitable member of this mission.
The other Dwarves did not have such strong ties with Thorin's family and it is highly likely that they didn't feel the need to leave on this almost impossible mission: an exception could well have been made in the case of Ori who, at a more mature age, could have felt the urge to live a new adventure being fully aware of its deepest meaning.

By the way... I don't like the look of the actor (Billy Connolly) who will be playing Dain: I thought they would choose an actor that would resemble more ....erm the kind of Dwarf hero we have got used to Angelic

So, in conclusion, every time I will watch the scene of Balin's tomb endless shivers will be running down my spine...Evil


(This post was edited by Elanor of Rohan on Feb 7 2014, 2:18pm)


Avandel
Valinor

Feb 7 2014, 4:40pm

Post #28 of 32 (111 views)
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casting Bill Connolly [In reply to] Can't Post

You make some great points! But I was never that concerned about tying the Hobbit and LOTR together - doubt I will ever watch all six movies back to back, only three at a time - tho it was nice the filmmakers thought along those lines.

Someone had once reassured me about Bill Connolly, in that I'd read he'd made IMO rude comments about Hobbit movie fans "it's just a movie" and I got the impression he was a jerk. Once again this was a performer I know little about. Also thought that PJ would have cast a real bruiser of an actor, someone like Graham McTavish - why cast a "comedian" in a part like that?

But evidently he's really well thought of as a performer, (haven't checked out YouTube yet), and he doesn't seem like a wimpy guy. If he's a good comedian to me that means he has intelligence too, because the best comedians do - and think Dain has to be both a fighter and intelligent as well.
Dain is a character that's going to get enormous scrutiny, fan of Thorin or not, no-one's going to be happy if the leader of the Iron Hill dwarves is flat, boring, and simply not believable in the part. That in AUJ, Dwalin would specifically ask after someone who is laughable as a war leader.

So I'm gonna assume like Stephen Fry as the Master of Laketown, BC is simply brilliant as Dain, and figure the geniuses at WETA are going to turn BC into the baddest of the badass dwarves.
I can't believes that PJ, whose casting has been beyond brilliant for the dwarves IMO, would slip up for casting such an important figure - one there will be emotion attached to by default.

PS. Sadly I believe I read after the Hobbit wrapped filming, BC was diagnosed w. cancer, so I hope his treatment has gone well.


Avandel
Valinor

Feb 7 2014, 4:46pm

Post #29 of 32 (104 views)
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air at higher elevations is very dry, also caves can be dry [In reply to] Can't Post

along w. other posts, yes, organic material in dry conditions will often just become dessicated. And the area around Erebor - plus they went up - looks like it's pretty dryish except for mountain streams.


Kilidoescartwheels
Gondor

Feb 8 2014, 3:16am

Post #30 of 32 (60 views)
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Hmmm, good point [In reply to] Can't Post

Never thought about it before.

In Reply To

For me, it was better that I hadn't seen Balin depicted. Because now I don't believe the Balin I "know" would have ever been interested in being Lord of Moria, and I can't see the Oin I know doing anything like that either. Ori perhaps might have left Erebor to record events.

Plus of course in LOTR to me Gandalf seems kind of cavalier at finding the tomb, when these were his traveling companions. I know what PJ & co. were trying to do, but now I'm not feeling it - I'll never look at that scene and feel Balin is there.



Kilidoescartwheels
Gondor

Feb 8 2014, 3:24am

Post #31 of 32 (70 views)
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The bodies on the floor [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
What did you think about this scene? I liked it a lot, (and the music is fantastic). I suppose that if the battle of the furnaces part would have been cut, this one would have been too.


Well it came after Thorin's pulling the sword on Bilbo, and I think the scene helped pull him back to the original mission, which was to kill the Dragon and take back Erebor. Too bad it won't last.


Anduinel
The Shire


Feb 10 2014, 6:49am

Post #32 of 32 (28 views)
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Great scene [In reply to] Can't Post

I really liked the scene for two reasons:

1) It quietly enhances just how apocalyptic Smaug's coming was for the Dwarves. He was so intimidating that this group would rather die by inches in a side cavern than take a chance at running for it.

2) It makes Thorin & Company's ability to elude Smaug during the final chase scene a bit more believable when I know that Smaug didn't actually catch and kill every Dwarf in the mountain, even the ones that were trapped in there with him.

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