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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Have we seen this? Dol Guldur Ambush Lego Set with Beorn

duats
Grey Havens

Nov 6 2013, 7:56am

Post #1 of 18 (852 views)
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Have we seen this? Dol Guldur Ambush Lego Set with Beorn Can't Post

http://www.beastsofwar.com/...ol-Guldur-Ambush.jpg


(This post was edited by duats on Nov 6 2013, 7:57am)


Arannir
Valinor


Nov 6 2013, 8:08am

Post #2 of 18 (423 views)
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Yap :) [In reply to] Can't Post

 


“All good stories deserve embellishment."

Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.


Mithfânion
Rivendell

Nov 6 2013, 10:07am

Post #3 of 18 (380 views)
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Yes [In reply to] Can't Post

But we're no closer to establishing at what point such a scene would take place.

It could be a flashback, but would a flashback really be worth its own lego set?

It could be a more significant scene during the current timeline of DOS. That's what I am hoping for.


chris10112
Bree

Nov 6 2013, 12:12pm

Post #4 of 18 (369 views)
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A flashback at Beorn's house [In reply to] Can't Post

In which he describes his escape from Dol Guldur and his sighting of a Necromancer, which provokes Gandalf to leave the company and go to Dol Guldur with Radagast.

Makes sense, considering the positioning of "A Necromancer" on the OST.


BornOutOfTheWest
Rivendell


Nov 6 2013, 1:43pm

Post #5 of 18 (328 views)
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My theory .... [In reply to] Can't Post

on the whole "Beorn/necromancer subplot" is as follows. PJ and Co is introducing a history between Beorn and Bolg/Azog due to his involvement in BOFA. If Beorn is going to be the one to kill Bolg then there needs to be some "history" between the two characters - in this case, Bolg and the orcs are responsible for the killing of the Beornings. I think this is a good change to the book, since now one of the main antagonists in the story will have some backstory with his killer rather than before in the novel.


Arannir
Valinor


Nov 6 2013, 1:54pm

Post #6 of 18 (290 views)
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Think very much the same. [In reply to] Can't Post

 


“All good stories deserve embellishment."

Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.


dave_lf
Gondor

Nov 6 2013, 1:55pm

Post #7 of 18 (296 views)
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I hadn't seen it before [In reply to] Can't Post

so thanks for posting. Maybe Beorn is on his way back from breaking out of Dol Guldur when he discovers dwarves on his property, and that's why he goes berserk?

10 points to the writers for pure courage if they have him say "somebody's been sitting in my chair!"


NoelGallagher
Rohan


Nov 6 2013, 3:22pm

Post #8 of 18 (258 views)
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dont forget [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
In which he describes his escape from Dol Guldur and his sighting of a Necromancer, which provokes Gandalf to leave the company and go to Dol Guldur with Radagast.

Makes sense, considering the positioning of "A Necromancer" on the OST.


That they are heading to the High Fells first (but forget about geographics :-D )before they travel to Dol Guldur.


Hamfast of Gamwich
Rivendell


Nov 6 2013, 6:37pm

Post #9 of 18 (194 views)
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This set is an expansion set for the one with Gandalf and Radagast in Dol Guldur [In reply to] Can't Post

...so I imagine that Beorn will be joining them there later in the film.

Though I also expect there to be some Beorn backstory linked to Bolg (who has bear paws on his shoulders) and probably Dol Guldur.

"Durin's Heir you may be, but even with one eye you should see clearer. If this is victory, then our hands are too small to hold it. We will not enter Khazad-dum. You will not enter Khazad-dum. Beyond the shadow of the gate it waits for you still: Durin’s Bane. The world must change and some other power than ours must come before Durin’s Folk walk again in Moria.”


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Nov 6 2013, 6:54pm

Post #10 of 18 (188 views)
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Man if they have Beorn able to escape Dol Guldur on his own, but not Gandalf [In reply to] Can't Post

MadMadMadMad

In Reply To
In which he describes his escape from Dol Guldur and his sighting of a Necromancer, which provokes Gandalf to leave the company and go to Dol Guldur with Radagast.

Makes sense, considering the positioning of "A Necromancer" on the OST.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Nov 6 2013, 6:55pm

Post #11 of 18 (179 views)
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LMAO!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

LaughLaughLaugh

In Reply To
so thanks for posting. Maybe Beorn is on his way back from breaking out of Dol Guldur when he discovers dwarves on his property, and that's why he goes berserk?

10 points to the writers for pure courage if they have him say "somebody's been sitting in my chair!"


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Nov 6 2013, 7:20pm

Post #12 of 18 (164 views)
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Beorn at Dol Guldur [In reply to] Can't Post

This is perhaps one of the larger deviations from canon, since we have no reason to think that Beorn was ever at Dol Guldur. The implication (in my opinion) is that Beorn follows Gandalf and Radagast to Dol Guldur. Perhaps his involvement allows Gandalf to free himself and escape.

I am still convinced that Gandalf's visit to the High Fells happened between when Bilbo and the Dwarves left Rivendell and when the company was captured by the goblins. We will see that in flashback, perhaps before the party arrives at Beorn's compound.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


Arannir
Valinor


Nov 6 2013, 8:23pm

Post #13 of 18 (137 views)
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Don't get angry already... [In reply to] Can't Post

... all is not lost :)

I will certainly think of you while watching those scenes and cheer with you when it is handeled with tact :)


“All good stories deserve embellishment."

Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Nov 6 2013, 9:05pm

Post #14 of 18 (117 views)
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Ugh! I hope you are right, Aranir. I iniitially wrote off some of the speculation [In reply to] Can't Post

about his capture. "There is no need for that, it strays from cannon and diminishes him etc. etc. etc. ,there is no evidence of..." Now... I don't know. It doesn't look good. But I will try to hold out hope Unsure

In Reply To
... all is not lost :)

I will certainly think of you while watching those scenes and cheer with you when it is handeled with tact :)


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Arannir
Valinor


Nov 6 2013, 9:29pm

Post #15 of 18 (103 views)
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I keep up the hope... [In reply to] Can't Post

... as there is still the potential for a great moment in this. Bringing Gandalf to his absolute low and then let him take the last chance and show his powers under extreme need such as with the Balrog would be great.

I hope they work towards a moment like this. We might have to wait for it until TABA though.


“All good stories deserve embellishment."

Praise is subjective. And so is criticism.

(This post was edited by Arannir on Nov 6 2013, 9:30pm)


Mithfânion
Rivendell

Nov 6 2013, 9:45pm

Post #16 of 18 (101 views)
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... [In reply to] Can't Post

     


Quote


on the whole "Beorn/necromancer subplot" is as follows. PJ and Co is introducing a history between Beorn and Bolg/Azog due to his involvement in BOFA. If Beorn is going to be the one to kill Bolg then there needs to be some "history" between the two characters - in this case, Bolg and the orcs are responsible for the killing of the Beornings. I think this is a good change to the book, since now one of the main antagonists in the story will have some backstory with his killer rather than before in the novel.








But the thing is that it seems Bolg is not at Dol Guldur, he seems to part of Azog's hunting party.
The VLOG situates him outside of Thranduil's Halls even. He is not in the Dol Guldur lego set, whereas Azog is.

So it doesn't seem as if there is a set up between Beorn and Bolg. Maybe between Beorn and Azog.
But that is somewhat confusing storytelling as Azog is already set up as Thorin's main adversary.

I agree btw with Hamfist's post above, in that the Beorn at Dol Guldur ambush set is an expansion set of the Gandalf and Radagast one.
That suggests that it happens simultaneously and is in fact *not* a flashback. But it's not conclusive.






Quote

This is perhaps one of the larger deviations from canon, since we have no reason to think that Beorn was ever at Dol Guldur. The implication (in my opinion) is that Beorn follows Gandalf and Radagast to Dol Guldur. Perhaps his involvement allows Gandalf to free himself and escape.

I am still convinced that Gandalf's visit to the High Fells happened between when Bilbo and the Dwarves left Rivendell and when the company was captured by the goblins. We will see that in flashback, perhaps before the party arrives at Beorn's compound




Well I agree. The High Fells occurred when Thorin and the others left Rivendell, we knows this from the WETA Chronicles book. It would seem very strange to have it happening real time whilst the dwarves are in Mirkwood.
Moreso, you would then need to have Gandalf in Radagast first in The High Fells, and then very soon afterwards you have them in Dol Guldur. It's all inconclusive, but it seems most likely that the High Fells would be a flashback. But then again I doubt that really works and makes sense either. Why do a flashback? We know it was supposed to be in film 1, that is the main reason to think it will be a flashback. But they may just move the scene, I don't know.


(This post was edited by Mithfânion on Nov 6 2013, 9:49pm)


MechaGodzilla
Rivendell

Nov 7 2013, 3:16am

Post #17 of 18 (68 views)
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This one is quite interesting [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

Quote
But the thing is that it seems Bolg is not at Dol Guldur, he seems to part of Azog's hunting party.
The VLOG situates him outside of Thranduil's Halls even. He is not in the Dol Guldur lego set, whereas Azog is.

So it doesn't seem as if there is a set up between Beorn and Bolg. Maybe between Beorn and Azog.
But that is somewhat confusing storytelling as Azog is already set up as Thorin's main adversary.


And something I've noticed as well. Remember how everything used to point towards Bolg being in Dol Guldur? My guess is that, for whatever reason, Bolg and Azog's roles are being switched around, which could also explain Bolg suddenly being CGI; it might've simply been out of necessity. What that means for either character, well, that remains to be seen.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Nov 7 2013, 6:00am

Post #18 of 18 (50 views)
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Doesn't work if they wait until film 3, as whatever he does then will be part of the whole Council dynamic, and might be overshadowed by others. [In reply to] Can't Post

He needs to put forth that last strength in need here and get the hell out of Dol Guldur.

In Reply To
... as there is still the potential for a great moment in this. Bringing Gandalf to his absolute low and then let him take the last chance and show his powers under extreme need such as with the Balrog would be great.

I hope they work towards a moment like this. We might have to wait for it until TABA though.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

 
 

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