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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
"This is not our fight/This is our fight" - A probably pointless analysis

Arandir
Gondor


Jun 13 2013, 10:19am

Post #1 of 17 (1070 views)
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"This is not our fight/This is our fight" - A probably pointless analysis Can't Post

As the heading states, this may be nothing more than misguided perception but here's my take on the short dialogue between Tauriel and Legolas (according to the trailer).

As both Elves look towards Laketown in the distance, Legolas states "This is not our fight" and seems to be referring to their involvement with the dwarves' quest (or else, Azog's relentless pursuing of Thorin). Whatever the reason, Legolas does not want to get involved and his emphasis seems to include the elves of Mirkwood and those under his father's realm.

Tauriel's response is ambiguous: "This is our fight" with a clear emphasis on "our", which makes me wonder - whose that? If she's also referring to themselves and the elves of Mirkwood, why not pronounce the line as "This is our fight" to go in line with Legolas' previous answer?Crazy

So, do you think there's something more to that line than meets the eye (or ear in this case) or is it just a mispronounced sentence? Or is it nothing at all and, as just stated, I'm looking too deep into things? Laugh

'The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey' Review


DwellerInDale
Rohan


Jun 13 2013, 10:40am

Post #2 of 17 (577 views)
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I'm a bit confused... [In reply to] Can't Post

...because I've watched the scene many times by now, and I've always heard, "It IS our fight". I think her meaning is fairly straightforward: Legolas = "Don't get involved" (Orcs vs Dwarves and their quest), Tauriel = "Yes, we should get involved".

Don't mess with my favorite female elf.







dormouse
Half-elven


Jun 13 2013, 10:58am

Post #3 of 17 (516 views)
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Same here... [In reply to] Can't Post

I just watched again to be sure, and I hear the emphasis on IS, not on OUR, as you say.


Arannir
Valinor


Jun 13 2013, 11:41am

Post #4 of 17 (493 views)
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Loved that part. [In reply to] Can't Post

I said it before and will again: I have the feeling they give the "powerful" of Middle-earth quite a bit of "appeasement politics" in this trilogy - and I love that idea.

Knowing that you have to deal with Evil and that it is dangerously close to rise to an extreme level of power - but at the same time being afraid that actually acting might worsen the situation.

I like that this is also transferred to the "lower" levels (although the potential heir of an Elf kingdom is not really low) via this dialogue.

It makes sense that Tauriel as a "lesser" Elf has the capacity to see more in those dwarves, having more of an understanding for their quest and see the real danger in the rising darkness, not the Free Peoples, while Legolas (and father) are more occupied with the ancient feuds between the races.



A dragon is no idle fancy. Whatever may be his origins, in fact or invention, the dragon in legend is a potent creation of mens imagination, richer in significance than his barrow is in gold. J.R.R. Tolkien

Words of wisdom that should be remembered - both by critics, purists and anyone in between.


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Jun 13 2013, 3:15pm

Post #5 of 17 (364 views)
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She-Elf chat [In reply to] Can't Post

Phylipa Boyens inventions, in the truest spirit of Tolkien, have wonderfull dialogue, it evens shoulders the professor's.

Tolkien who?

Legolas probably means the dwarves quest.

Vous commencez m'ennuyer avec le port!!!


Escapist
Gondor


Jun 13 2013, 3:32pm

Post #6 of 17 (361 views)
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I really think this dialogue hits the spot. [In reply to] Can't Post

Short and to the point, and very spot-on. Legolas and Thranduil share the historical legacy of the Sindar of Doriath who were classic isolationists in their attitude back then and continued that approach as leaders of the Mirkwood elves - so it totally fits that this is Legolas' initial reaction alongside his father. But something does change this age-old position held by the Sindar Lords, and it could easily be related to arguments coming from the green elves they rule who could reasonably be more sympathetic toward other creatures in pain or need (or even simply more vicious in their resistance of evil) - and no one could possibly be more likely to take the isolationist stance in a debate about it than the Sindar unless they were so isolationist as to not even come to the table in the first place and possibly not even be known to exist.

It is so short and minimal for what it expresses that I have a hard time finding it to be cliche or cringe-worthy. If that simple and core pointed dialogue makes a person cringe then that person probably spends a lot of time with a scrunched up face ...

I do think the "our" is talking about the people that both Legolas and Tauriel have positions of leadership over - specifically military leadership which is highly related to fighting.

No, the dialogue is not highly ornate or complex - but it is to the point and makes a bulls-eye on the target of the motivations and role of the elves in this story. Awesome!


stoutfiles
Rohan


Jun 13 2013, 5:52pm

Post #7 of 17 (291 views)
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It's a secret metaphor [In reply to] Can't Post

Legolas = Tolkien. "We shouldn't get involved. By rights, we shouldn't even be here!"
Tauriel = Hollywood. "We have to fight, and we have to look cool doing it. Also, I must find someone to fall in love with."


easterlingchief1
Rivendell


Jun 13 2013, 6:16pm

Post #8 of 17 (270 views)
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What if the fight in question is the battle against the Necromancer? [In reply to] Can't Post

At that point in the story, there hasn't been any build up to the Battle of Five Armies. It does look like Gandalf and Radagast are going to start something in Dol Guldur. Also, it's implied by the trailer that the Elves or Mirkwood are begin harried by Orcs, some one which we can infer serve the Necromancer. Maybe the conflict Tauriel and Legolas are mulling over is the impending war with the unveiled Dark Lord?


FrogmortonJustice65
Rivendell


Jun 13 2013, 6:18pm

Post #9 of 17 (280 views)
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I found that exchange in the trailer strange. [In reply to] Can't Post

I haven't read the Hobbit in a while, but purely based on the book it really isn't *their* fight. Bilbo's quest is different from Frodo's; Thorin and co. (in the book) are simply trying to reclaim some treasure and their homeland as opposed to preventing the triumph of Sauron. Dialogue such as this seems to be an attempt to make Bilbo/Thorin's quest seem more *crucial* to the fate of Middle Earth itself than it is in the source material.

Unless you interpret Tauriel to be saying "this is our fight" in the sense that the elves need to be involved in the quest so as to land some treasure (and the Arkenstone?) when all is said and done.

Or maybe Tauriel believes they should become involved in the fight against Azog to protect their kingdom; it's hard to say at this point.

I don't necessarily mind this shift in tone; but is a shift in tone nonetheless. PJ has made a calculated effort to link Thorin's quest to larger ongoings in Middle Earth; we'll see how it turns out.

 photo cbccab4e-f61e-4be5-aaa1-20e302430c7c.jpg


Thranduil05
The Shire


Jun 13 2013, 6:27pm

Post #10 of 17 (276 views)
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Maybe... [In reply to] Can't Post

We've all seen the clip in the trailer where Legolas slides towards Thorin and the dwarves and draws his bow... "Do not think I won't kill you, dwarf!" We know that at this point Legolas isn't particularly fond of the dwarves, as the dwarves aren't of the elves. This is why I think Legolas isn't keen to involve the elves in the dwarves fight, if the fight between the orcs and the dwarves is to what they're referring.

Tauriel on the other hand, seems quite tame in comparison to Legolas and more compassionate. Maybe she is open to the idea of helping the dwarves?

Just speculation!


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Jun 13 2013, 7:42pm

Post #11 of 17 (215 views)
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Catching! [In reply to] Can't Post

Post of the day.Laugh


Have a glass of ...whatever it is you enjoy drinking the most, on me.

I wonder if Tauriel is Boyens version of herself in Middle Earh, her fantasy...She is red headed right?

Vous commencez m'ennuyer avec le port!!!


Elessar
Valinor


Jun 13 2013, 8:07pm

Post #12 of 17 (222 views)
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A lot of overthinking going on [In reply to] Can't Post

I think there is a lot being made here out of not a lot going on. I liked that sequence from the trailer quite a bit and what I took from it was Legolas doesn't want to get involved (like Thranduil walked away) and let whatever happens with the Dwarves/Smaug happen. I thought the line was fine and took from it she was telling him that no this is our fight meaning we need to get involved because there is a Dragon at hand (that Middle-earth is important and so is what happens within it). If anything I think it helps show why Legolas will join The Fellowship that the fate of Middle-earth is important.



Skaan
Lorien


Jun 13 2013, 8:43pm

Post #13 of 17 (208 views)
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Something important to keep in mind [In reply to] Can't Post

The dialogue in that scene seemed to be cut and edited a bit. The trailer makes it look like Legolas says "This isn't our fight" and Tauriel immediatly responds with "It is our fight". But in the actual film, it's most likely that there will be lots of other dialogue before Tauriel responds with "It is our fight".


hobbitylass
Bree


Jun 13 2013, 10:51pm

Post #14 of 17 (158 views)
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Or maybe, the fight of the dwarves against the orcs [In reply to] Can't Post

We know there is a scene that shows an orc captured and questioned by the elves.

They could be talking about fighting orcs here - Legolas saying that it's the dwarves' problem, and Tauriel saying that the orcs are their problem too.

I think the "evil" being referred to in the trailer is not just the dragon (and the necromancer), but also the orcs, especially because of Azog jumping into view when it says "in time all foul things come forth".


marillaraina
Rohan


Jun 14 2013, 1:35am

Post #15 of 17 (139 views)
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Speaking of that line [In reply to] Can't Post

" "in time all foul things come forth"."

Anyone else think Thranduil was throwing serious shade at Thorin there, equating him and the dwarves with "foul things coming forth in time"? Burn!


easterlingchief1
Rivendell


Jun 14 2013, 3:25am

Post #16 of 17 (111 views)
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I'm inclined to agree except the part about Azog [In reply to] Can't Post

I doubt Azog's the "great evil" the trailer's referring to. Sure he's an orc chieftain, and a powerful one at that, but when you put him up against smaug or Sauron/The Necromancer, he's pretty insignificant. In he the hierarchy of evil, he's a foot soldier compared to the Dark Lord or Mordor and a gnat compared to a dragon.

What I'm getting at is it would be very weird (and very poorly judged) if Azog became anything more than the miniboss thorin clashes with. He's Lurtz from Fellowship/Gothmog from ROTK except he survived beyond the end of the film.


hobbitylass
Bree


Jun 14 2013, 2:34pm

Post #17 of 17 (74 views)
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I agree, he's "an" evil, not "the" evil [In reply to] Can't Post

Definitely, Azog is at the bottom of the heap compared to the others!

 
 

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