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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Reading Room:
Will we see anything new from Tolkien?

Carnivoran
The Shire

May 23 2013, 1:02am

Post #1 of 16 (429 views)
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Will we see anything new from Tolkien? Can't Post

Hello,

I have just started reading The Children of Hurin again, and I wondering what the future has in store for Tolkien in terms of new books or (most importantly) new information.

Will we ever see other stories of the Silmarillion fleshed out?

I noticed that Christopher still went with the original genealogy he described in the published Silmarillion, with Orodreth as a brother to Finrod. I am sort of surprised he did not take this opportunity to set the record straight based off of the HoM-E information.

Would it be possible for the Silmarillion to be published as a new edition with some of the corrections seen in HoM-E?

Also, I was curious if there is still unpublished information related to the "Middle-Earth" Universe (for a lack of better wording). Did HoM-E cover it all?

Finally, I am curious if anyone has read History of the Hobbit. Is it worth adding to the collection?

Thank you for your time and knowledge!


CuriousG
Valinor


May 23 2013, 12:50pm

Post #2 of 16 (245 views)
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No knowledge, but [In reply to] Can't Post

If the HOME series can sell, then so could a revised, improved, and expanded Silmarillion. I would camp overnight at a bookstore to buy it (well, almost). There's no word of it that I know of, however.


Darkstone
Immortal


May 23 2013, 2:20pm

Post #3 of 16 (251 views)
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Take your pick [In reply to] Can't Post

http://tolkiengateway.net/...otes.2C_and_Lectures

******************************************
I met a Balrog on the stair.
He had some wings that weren't there.
They weren't there again today.
I wish he would just fly away.


Ardamírë
Valinor


May 23 2013, 2:50pm

Post #4 of 16 (245 views)
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The History of the Hobbit [In reply to] Can't Post

I've read it many years ago. I'd say it's just as interesting as HoME, and certainly something to read through if you liked the rest of HoME.

As for unpublished Middle-earth stuff, I know that Christopher alludes to a longer prose version of Beren and Luthien, though it was left unfinished like so many other tales. I'd still love to read it someday.

"...not till now have I understood the tale of your people and their fall.
As wicked fools I scorned them, but I pity them at last.
For if this is indeed, as the Eldar say, the gift of the One to Men,
it is bitter to receive." -Arwen Undómiel




Elthir
Gondor

May 23 2013, 3:29pm

Post #5 of 16 (239 views)
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Orodreth and Waldman [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
I noticed that Christopher still went with the original genealogy he described in the published Silmarillion, with Orodreth as a brother to Finrod. I am sort of surprised he did not take this opportunity to set the record straight based off of the HoM-E information.




I think he wanted to be consistent with the constructed Silmarillion on this point. And The Children of Hurin itself does not contain every 'latest' [if known] idea Tolkien was musing about [the fuller history of the Helm of Hador for example].

I do note this in the family trees however -- no Gil-galad in the Children of Hurin version Smile


I'm pretty sure the long prose version of the Luthien and Beren tale was abandoned rather early, if I recall correctly with the revelation of Beren to Thingol by Daeron. The same [abandoned too early] with the long prose Fall of Gondolin. The indication [so far] is that none of the Great Tales will be seeing the same sort of treatment as the long prose Children of Hurin, as there simply isn't enough of the updated, later versions to work with.

I blame Milton Waldman Wink


(This post was edited by Elthir on May 23 2013, 3:33pm)


Elthir
Gondor

May 23 2013, 3:49pm

Post #6 of 16 (226 views)
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linguistic stuff [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Also, I was curious if there is still unpublished information related to the "Middle-Earth" Universe (for a lack of better wording). Did HoM-E cover it all?




There is certainly more linguistic stuff awaiting publication, which can include fascinating details that are not specifically linguistic in nature.

I'm not sure all the texts relating to Middle-earth have been published, as Christopher Tolkien's personal History of the Silmarillion is longer than The History of Middle-Earth, as it concerns the Elder days. In any case, for further material about languages and writing systems see the publications Parma Eldalamberon and Vinyar Tengwar.

The fairly recent Eldarin Hands and Fingers... I forget the exact full title... is interesting for example [new background on the Elf Pengolodh is found there too]; and Vinyar Tengwar also published Osanwe-kenta, for instance; although that has been available for a while now.


(This post was edited by Elthir on May 23 2013, 3:51pm)


vexx801
Rivendell


May 24 2013, 12:35am

Post #7 of 16 (194 views)
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Hmm. [In reply to] Can't Post

"I have just started reading The Children of Hurin again, and I wondering what the future has in store for Tolkien in terms of new books or (most importantly) new information. "
I just finished reading The Children of Hurin yesterday, myself! I rather enjoyed it, and I finally read through the version in Unfinished Tales as well.

"Will we ever see other stories of the Silmarillion f
fleshed out?"
That, I do not know. But I would love to read a longer version of the History/Fall of Gondolin as well as the tale of Beren and Luthien. I'm about to start the 12-volume HoME series tonight actually, so maybe that will whet my appetite.

"Would it be possible for the Silmarillion to be published as a new edition with some of the corrections seen in HoM-E?"
I am sure it would be, and I would love to see it done!

"Also, I was curious if there is still unpublished information related to the "Middle-Earth" Universe (for a lack of better wording). Did HoM-E cover it all?"
I would say that HoME did not cover it all. You noted The History of The Hobbit - that was outside of Christopher Tolkien's editing, and it was unpublished material until Rateliff put it all together and published it. That's one example of course, but there are certain still some things that have yet to be published - the link to Tolkien Gateway demonstrates that.

"Finally, I am curious if anyone has read History of the Hobbit. Is it worth adding to the collection?"
I have yet to personally read it, but I actually ordered it last Saturday. My copy of the two-volume HotH as well as the Annotated Hobbit that I bought are supposed to be in soon (tomorrow at the earliest) and I can't wait to read them - History of Middle Earth, History of the Hobbit - looks like I'm in for an enjoyable summer.


Malveth
Rivendell

May 24 2013, 12:40pm

Post #8 of 16 (186 views)
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2 I KNow Of [In reply to] Can't Post

1. Beowulf prose translation

2. King of the Green Dozens: A sequel to Farmer Giles, I believe.

There are also unpublished letters.

I predict that the major tales from The Silm. will eventually get the COH treatment.


Elthir
Gondor

May 28 2013, 12:37pm

Post #9 of 16 (126 views)
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the treatment [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
I predict that the major tales from The Silm. will eventually get the COH treatment.




Hmm, but by whom? Someone already did a long prose The Fall of Gondolin, but he wasn't named Tolkien.


I think Christopher Tolkien has been clear enough that he won't engage in these projects. Do you think Adam Tolkien will, for example; or that the rights to produce these things will be sold any time soon, so that some other writer can produce them?

Although I guess 'eventually' could be a long time from now in any case Wink


Malveth
Rivendell

May 28 2013, 1:21pm

Post #10 of 16 (133 views)
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Yeah... [In reply to] Can't Post

I do believe that other Tolkiens will eventually break down & do them if Chris doesn't. It's pretty inevitable. I'll go as far as to blaspheme and say that Chris ought to have simply made those books, writing anything that was needed himself to flesh them out, back in the 70's instead of futzing around with a mock Silmarillion. Why? So no one else could do it in the future. But one day I am sure the publishers will find a way of persuading the family to allow it to happen. I'm not sure that would please me, I just accept that it will one day happen.


wildespace
The Shire

Jun 5 2013, 9:31am

Post #11 of 16 (107 views)
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Plenty of stuff to publish [In reply to] Can't Post

There is a wealth of material in HoME that could be published in a cleaned-up and reassembled form (and without the incessant commentaries by Christopher), such as The Book of Lost Tales or the Lay of Leithan. The Book of Lost Tales, for example, although different to the Silmarillion and not considered canonical, contains a wealth of information not in the published Silmarillion, not to mention the rich story-telling, immersive atmosphere, and the emotional connection it allows you to make with the charcters. I had my breath taken away when reading the Fall of Gondolin.

Like others said, the Silmarillion could be updated and improved. LotR has an unpublished epilogue, where Sam answers his kids' questions about the events of LotR. The Lay of Leithian, referred to in the published Silmarillion a couple of times, is a very beautiful and epic long poem, unfortunately not finished. But if the unfinished Fall of Arthur could be published, so can the Lay of Leithian.

The HoME volumes are a fairly obscure series of books, and I think most casual fans will be scared away by the sheer volume and the tedious academic approach in it, as well as distracted by the constant notes and commentaries by Christopher. Which is why I compiled The Book of Lost Tales (with some minor changes to make them seamless) in a blog: http://tolkienbookoflosttales.blogspot.co.uk/


CuriousG
Valinor


Jun 5 2013, 2:40pm

Post #12 of 16 (88 views)
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Great blog [In reply to] Can't Post

And welcome to the Reading Room, Wildespace! I would dearly love to see a "new, improved" Silmarillion someday that included the best parts that were left out, and who cares if that made it two volumes (or gasp! a trilogy). I hope that with the publication of the Fall of Arthur and also the Children of Hurin, someone will see that they could both do a great service to the Tolkien reader community and make a tidy profit.

Please feel free to join all our discussions here. The more, the merrier.


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jun 5 2013, 3:39pm

Post #13 of 16 (89 views)
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The Fall of Gondolin [In reply to] Can't Post

There is easily enough written material to compose a long version of The Fall of Gondolin. After The Children of Hurin, it seems to me to be the most obvious next step.

If not just a standalone Gondolin book, Christopher could easily compile The Wanderings of Hurin, the old Nauglafring (though updated with Tolkien's latest thoughts), and Gondolin into a three-part book.

Aside from that, an expanded Silmarillion would be great! Put in the lost tale of Miriel, please!

"...not till now have I understood the tale of your people and their fall.
As wicked fools I scorned them, but I pity them at last.
For if this is indeed, as the Eldar say, the gift of the One to Men,
it is bitter to receive." -Arwen Undómiel




Ardamírë
Valinor


Jun 5 2013, 3:41pm

Post #14 of 16 (98 views)
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The Fall of Gondolin [In reply to] Can't Post

Last I heard, someone had done their own editing of this story and gave it to Priscilla Tolkien?? Something like that. Surely Christopher could do the same and publish it for us masses.

"...not till now have I understood the tale of your people and their fall.
As wicked fools I scorned them, but I pity them at last.
For if this is indeed, as the Eldar say, the gift of the One to Men,
it is bitter to receive." -Arwen Undómiel




wildespace
The Shire

Jun 5 2013, 9:21pm

Post #15 of 16 (83 views)
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It was a private printing [In reply to] Can't Post

of only 50 copies, without the approval of the Estate. Although 1 copy was donated to Priscilla, others were sold for thousands of pounds (or dollars). http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/...s/taleofgondolin.htm

I think the most decent thing the author could have done by now is to make the text available for free.



Ardamírë
Valinor


Jun 6 2013, 12:34am

Post #16 of 16 (96 views)
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I made my own [In reply to] Can't Post

So I don't really care, though I'd still love to see an official version made like The Children of Húrin. It would be a delight to put on my shelf.

"...not till now have I understood the tale of your people and their fall.
As wicked fools I scorned them, but I pity them at last.
For if this is indeed, as the Eldar say, the gift of the One to Men,
it is bitter to receive." -Arwen Undómiel



 
 

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