Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
I understand your meaning, yet I don't think there is enough to support it, and a number of reasons to believe the contrary.

AinurOlorin
Half-elven


May 6 2013, 12:38am


Views: 38
Shortcut
I understand your meaning, yet I don't think there is enough to support it, and a number of reasons to believe the contrary. [In reply to] Can't Post

Gandalf might be said to be, like Bombadil though in a different way, something of a law onto himself, and certainly a special case.

The type of resentment you are describing towards the Noldor would not have been so assuaged by Gandalf's aid in battle against the orcs, that he would have given the Wizard the glowing, reverent words and an essentially adoring welcome to visit often. If he really thought of the Wizard as a mere tool of Galadriel and her kin, his praise would have been far more reserved. Polite, but not warm, and not embracing. Certainly he would not have gone on to submit to the requests of the Wizard even to the inconvenience and peril of his own people. Battle valour and aid, even amazing aid, from eighty years prior and dark times would not have prompted him to adhere to the wishes of the Wizard with such a burdensome request, if he viewed him antagonistically as an extention of the arms of The Noldor. Again, the vanity and curiosity of the king would have been the very things that would have compelled him to welcome this strange being from Across The Sea, welcomed reverently by Cirdan (no Noldor intruder he) even before Galadriel. He would have wondered about the Wizards just like other Elves did, and would have wanted to be able to say that they came and held audience with him, just as they did with the likes of Galadriel and Elrond.

And here the Wizards oft humble approach would have served him well. If he had come bearing some sign of The Lady of Lorilindorinan and accompanied by her followers, then one can well imagine Thranduil petulantly refusing him entry. But it is dubious that he would have approached thus. Let us not underestimate the cleverness of The Gray Pilgrim. If there were anyone who could find a way to get himself admitted to see people he was interested in meeting with, whether they willed it or no, it was Gandalf The Gray. The likelihood that his paths never crossed with Thranduil prior to the events of The Hobbit is flabbergastingly improbable. Even his presence with The Elves at the battle, as opposed to with Men, hints at pre-existing ties.

In Reply To
I just don't see this the way that you do and it doesn't look like either of us is going to convince the other of our opinions. I still believe that Gandalf's association with the Noldor would have mede him unwelcome in Thranduil's Court before the events of TA 2941. Not that I couldn't be mistaken.

elean32 wrote:

Quote

In LOTR, book and movie, Legolas seems to know Gandalf pretty well. He can only really have known him from Gandalf visiting the Woodland Realm. Ok, some of these visits could have been after the events of The Hobbit, but I doubt that Gandalf was able to spend much time there during this period. I therefore think it v likely he had visited Thranduil before this



I see what you are driving at, but I feel that Gandalf's post-BoFA experiences with the Woodland Realm are enough to account for his acquaintance with Legolas. In particular, Gandalf and Bilbo traveled with Thranduil and his army on their journey back to the Shire until they reached the borders of Mirkwood, Later, there is the capture and questioning of Gollum. It is easy to suppose that Gandalf made some visits in-between as well. He did tend to get around.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

(This post was edited by AinurOlorin on May 6 2013, 12:42am)

Subject User Time
Discussion of old news concerning Gandalf and Radagast (possible spoilers) Radagast-Aiwendil Send a private message to Radagast-Aiwendil May 1 2013, 6:25pm
    I know I've mentioned that quote in the past... Eleniel Send a private message to Eleniel May 1 2013, 6:44pm
        I don't think so. I think, Gandalf will do battle against overwhelming odds ALONE in Dol Guldur AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 2 2013, 2:40am
    I couldn't remember the quote, so had to pull out Empire. DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB May 1 2013, 7:14pm
        So we have Gandalf Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë May 1 2013, 7:49pm
            You and me both, bro. Ziggy Stardust Send a private message to Ziggy Stardust May 2 2013, 12:57am
                Gandalf and Radagast Salmacis81 Send a private message to Salmacis81 May 2 2013, 3:09am
                    Now that you mention it Ziggy Stardust Send a private message to Ziggy Stardust May 2 2013, 5:55pm
            Has this "Galadriel carrying Gandalf" business really been confirmed? Salmacis81 Send a private message to Salmacis81 May 2 2013, 2:13am
            I find the latter much more worrying, because I think it will be much more literal. I think the "saving" AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 2 2013, 3:03am
                A fine line Elessar Send a private message to Elessar May 2 2013, 12:54pm
        If Gandalf is late to the Battle of Five Armies Radagast-Aiwendil Send a private message to Radagast-Aiwendil May 1 2013, 8:42pm
            I would HATE that. I really hope to see Gandalf's interaction with Thranduil for at least two reasons. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 2 2013, 2:53am
                We shouldn't see Gandalf with Thranduil until the siege of Erebor Otaku-sempai Send a private message to Otaku-sempai May 2 2013, 4:03am
                    He doesn't deal with the council as a whole, but he certainly is friends with Gandalf. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 2 2013, 4:20am
                        Tolkien records no such conversation in 'The Hobbit' Otaku-sempai Send a private message to Otaku-sempai May 2 2013, 1:48pm
                            I didn't say there is such a conversation detailed HOWEVER, Gandalf IS in the camp, AND AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 3 2013, 6:37am
                                You may assume, however it is NOT inferred. Otaku-sempai Send a private message to Otaku-sempai May 3 2013, 12:54pm
                                    It is inferred. This is why, AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 3 2013, 7:21pm
                                        We shall have to agree to disagree Otaku-sempai Send a private message to Otaku-sempai May 4 2013, 6:16am
                                            Forgive me. I meant of course that it is implied, and from the implication it can be inferred. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 4 2013, 12:26pm
                                                Again, we'll just have to agree to disagree... Otaku-sempai Send a private message to Otaku-sempai May 4 2013, 1:57pm
                                                    I understand your meaning, yet I don't think there is enough to support it, and a number of reasons to believe the contrary. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 6 2013, 12:38am
                                        Another consideration.... elaen32 Send a private message to elaen32 May 4 2013, 7:30am
                                            Agreed. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin May 4 2013, 12:27pm
            I agree imin Send a private message to imin May 2 2013, 11:31am
    Huh MaeBeth Send a private message to MaeBeth May 3 2013, 6:47pm

 
 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.