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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
hows this for dos ending?

boldog
Rohan


Apr 21 2013, 9:18am

Post #1 of 21 (991 views)
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hows this for dos ending? Can't Post

Okay this is how I believe dos should end.
Smaug is defeated and the company is given word of it by roac. After this it will go into a montage of events, where the news that smaug is defeated spreads around middle earth. I can see it being like the lighting of the beaconsin rotk, with people from around middle earth saying " smaug is dead". We will probably get cameos of places seen in the lotr trilogy, like Rohan and gondor. It will then slow down and go to a dark place. An orc will all of a sudden be seen running down in haste, yelling something like, " the dragon of erebor is defeated. The dwarves have.been successful. All the orcs are then aroused and azog comes forth with his son bolg and tells the orcs and goblins of goblin town, that they will get their revenge on the dwarves, and that their prize will be riches beyond recogning. All the orcs yell in honour of azog, as he and bolg jump onto their wargs, and start to ride off ready for war. The credits will then show.
What are your thoughts, is this good? Could it at least be a reasonable seen if not an ending?


"fingolfin looked up in grief to see what evil morgoth had done to maedhros"


NoelGallagher
Rohan

Apr 21 2013, 9:31am

Post #2 of 21 (545 views)
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not going much into detail [In reply to] Can't Post

But at least i really cant imagine Smaug dying in DoS as he is the best kept secret of PJ.


Joe20
Lorien


Apr 21 2013, 9:31am

Post #3 of 21 (551 views)
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That's actually a great idea. [In reply to] Can't Post

I really like the lighting of the beacons style montage. And seeing Gondor etc again would be great.

But I think that Smaug is too big of a draw card to kill off in the second movie. Those unfamiliar with the book, i think, may not be as motivated to see the third instalment of the trilogy if the main antagonist is already dead.

So I still think that DOS will end with Smaug flying off to Laketown. But that doesn't mean we couldn't see a montage of the news spreading in the third film. I really think that would be great.


Shagrat
Gondor

Apr 21 2013, 11:21am

Post #4 of 21 (485 views)
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Seems best [In reply to] Can't Post

I can definitely see it closing with shots of the Dwarves marching from the Iron Hills, Elves from Mirkwood, and the Orcs from Mount Gundabad, Goblintown and perhaps even Moria (I'd love to see Moria Orcs again). I suspect we'll definitely see this near the close of the film.

I wonder if the news might be communicated by different flying creatures. Perhaps a thrust or raven for the Dwarves, bats for the Orcs, and perhaps a falcon for the Elves?


ShireHorse
Rohan

Apr 21 2013, 12:42pm

Post #5 of 21 (417 views)
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I like everyone's ideas here. [In reply to] Can't Post

But I would agree with Joe that it would be foolish of PJ to kill off Smaug in the DoS because I can also foresee many cinemagoers thinking that it was all over and not bothering to return for the third movie.

If you want a climax to the second film then I think you've got a choice of several: the Battle of Dol Guldur (which I think must take place here otherwise you have two battles in T&BA); the dwarves being attacked by Smaug outside the door and then his disappearance off in the direction of Lake Town; the dwarves finally entering their kingdom only to find no sign of Smaug and wondering where he is - and then a shot of smoke coming from Lake Town.

I really like the idea of a montage, where news of Smaug's death is carried to various parties by birds and bats. Great armies on the move towards the Lonely Mountain would provide some fearsome aerial shots. But, I think this should be part of the third film.


Thorins_apprentice
Rohan


Apr 21 2013, 12:51pm

Post #6 of 21 (429 views)
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"The Dwarves marching from the iron hills." [In reply to] Can't Post

YES! I can't wait for this beautiful moment to be captured on screen.I just hope they're not on boars, it loses it's badass touch.I can't wait to see 500, REAL, ICONIC Dwarves marching and running to the aid of our beloved, Thorin Oakenshield.It shows who the true monumental race of Middleearth truly is.
No more pretty boy Dwarves please, Gimli said it best "I want a legion of Dwarves armed and filthy." Evil
This means forked beards, Intricate braiding styles ,stocky bodied, hard, determined warriors.These are the Dwarven militia they should have a savage,fundamental nature about them.I hope they include the line they speak to Bard " We are sent from Dain son of Nain.We are hastening to our kinsmen in the mountain since we learn that the kingdom of old is renewed.But who are you that sit in the plain as foes before defended walls"? Which of course means make way or we will fight you.So impertinent and unrelenting and that's what i love about Dwarves(Not cleo, model look alikes lol) WOOT WOOT>!Cool

We are more connected than ever before, more able to spread our ideas and beliefs, our anger and fears. As we exercise the right to advocate our views, and as we animate our supporters, we must all assume responsibility for our words and actions before they enter a vast echo chamber and reach those both serious and delirious, connected and unhinged.



(This post was edited by Thorins_apprentice on Apr 21 2013, 12:58pm)


Radagast-Aiwendil
Gondor


Apr 21 2013, 2:33pm

Post #7 of 21 (385 views)
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I think the filmmakers face problems in any event [In reply to] Can't Post

If Smaug dies in DoS then many unfamiliar with the book may have less motivation to see TabA. Theoretically they would need to kill him off near the beginning of TabA to avoid that, as the dragon is only one of the later problems faced by the characters. However that would also prove to be a risk as non-book readers would be questioning why the main antagonist is dead with 2/3 of the film to go. Of course PJ could get around that by changing the story and keeping Smaug alive until the Battle of Five Armies, but that would infuriate the purists.

It's going to be very interesting seeing how PJ & Co dig themselves out of this hole, and whether or not they can.

"True courage is about knowing not when to take a life, but when to spare one."


QuackingTroll
Valinor


Apr 21 2013, 3:22pm

Post #8 of 21 (341 views)
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Not like "Lighting of the Beacons", think more along the lines of "Sam's speech" [In reply to] Can't Post

At the end of TTT Sam does that speech about stories, while we see the Isengard and Helm's Deep Victories.

I think we'll see the same thing in DoS. Someone, maybe Balin, will give us a big speech about the Dragon's defeat and the reclaiming of Erebor while we see the montage of everyone hearing the newsSmile It'll probably end with a reference to Bo5A.

"The Battle for Erebor is over, the Battle for the Gold is about to begin" - Okay, not that.


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Apr 21 2013, 5:08pm

Post #9 of 21 (281 views)
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I think that the film has end a little sooner than that. [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't even think that it is a given that Smaug will fall as the climax of DoS (although it is a strong probability). TaBA needs a build-up to the Battle of Five Armies. The news of Smaug's Demise will probably figure early into that film. In fact, I think it is likely that DoS will end with Bilbo and the Dwarves sitting in the dark, wondering if the dragon will return and send a river of flame flowing up the tunnel from his lair.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


LordotRings93
Rohan


Apr 21 2013, 6:28pm

Post #10 of 21 (266 views)
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I don't think Smaug will be killed off [In reply to] Can't Post

Not until the third film. The third film will most likely pick up right when Smaug attacks Lake-town, so DoS will probably end with Smaug leaving the LM to attack, and the final shot can be of Smaug flying straight towards the screen, and with a deafening roar blasts fire. It'd be a nice tease of things to come, like Smaug's eye opening.

Lover of Medieval Fantasy
"I know what I must do. It's just... I'm afraid to do it."


Smeagol Bagginsess
Rivendell


Apr 21 2013, 6:46pm

Post #11 of 21 (278 views)
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Smaug *spoilers* [In reply to] Can't Post

will not die in DOS. Betcha!

I am the Grandson of Samwise Gamgee. My grandpa loved Frodo uncle and Frodo uncle loved his pet, Smeagol. So I am named Smeagol Bagginsess! Ain't I cute?

(This post was edited by entmaiden on Apr 22 2013, 7:33pm)


Spaldron
Rivendell


Apr 21 2013, 6:50pm

Post #12 of 21 (264 views)
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This... [In reply to] Can't Post

...but instead of Smaug flying towards the screen we'll see him flying off into the distance towards Laketown as the screen fades out. TABA could open with some flashback sequence maybe showing the story of Smaug just as ROTK did with Gollum. Then we'll be thrown right into the desolation of Laketown.

"A single dream is more powerful than a thousand realities."


totoro
Lorien

Apr 21 2013, 7:16pm

Post #13 of 21 (260 views)
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I believe Smaug was the draw for the second film [In reply to] Can't Post

Initially, the second film was also the last film. Cumbersmaug said we would see Smaug's eye open at the end of the first film back when he thought there were only two. That was supposed to make you want to come see the second and last film. They kept the same ending to draw you to the middle film in what is now a Hobbit trilogy. Middle films tend to do worse than first films and last tend to do better. I think LotR was an exception because PJ was bringing the books to mainstream audiences who warmed to LotR because FotR was so good. DoS without Smaug was destined to be the red-headed step child of the trilogy, but I think the build-up to Smaug will make it competitive. I am not convinced you actually need Smaug to draw audiences to the last of three. Popular trilogies (or finite series in general) end with a box office bang.

I envisioned the montage a long time back while hoping for a "proper ending" for DoS. Eyes are drawn to the lonely peak and muttering begins. Armies start moving and politicians start talking. Somehow the Necromancer speaks to the fourth wall to let us know that the death of Smaug can be turned to his advantage. That's a good ending and the Necromancer is now the draw for TaBA. I think people are underestimating the intelligence of mainstream audiences by suggesting they will think the trilogy ends at movie two with the death of Smaug. .


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Apr 21 2013, 7:33pm

Post #14 of 21 (262 views)
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IMO DoS will most likely end with Smaug taking off for Esgaroth... [In reply to] Can't Post

Lake-town attack, build-up to BoFA/resolution of Necromancer plot, BoFA,and Back Again/epilogue/wrap-up saved for the third movie. That seems like little story for 2+ hours to me, but certainly less so should they cram almost everything into DoS.

BTW, I wonder if they might include some of the War in the North from the LotR timeline in BoFA, as it wasn't included in the trilogy...perhaps an army marching from the east and joining with the Orcs (it doesn't seem it'll be Goblins, at least not primarily)? Perhaps that idea's just as I do have a proclivity for those Easterlings, as one might guess...however, Erebor is fairly close to Rhun, comparatively speaking.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


IdrilofGondolin
Rohan

Apr 21 2013, 10:18pm

Post #15 of 21 (204 views)
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Needs to Be Somewhere [In reply to] Can't Post

It is a wonderful idea. Nice job!Smile


MouthofSauron
Tol Eressea


Apr 22 2013, 6:45am

Post #16 of 21 (159 views)
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if the Dol-Guldur attack is the finale of DOS but if not.. [In reply to] Can't Post

i don't see what could be the finale? if its not Dol-Guldur or the battle at Laketown than what? its going to be one or the other. I'm betting Smaug will be killed at the end of DOS, they set the stage for the Dol-Guldur battle and the BOT5A at the end of DOS....TABA like ROTK will have two large battles.


take me down to the woodland realm where the trees are green and the elf women are pretty....Oh will you please take me home!!

(This post was edited by MouthofSauron on Apr 22 2013, 6:46am)


MouthofSauron
Tol Eressea


Apr 22 2013, 6:48am

Post #17 of 21 (166 views)
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not if the Necromancer brings Smaug back from the grave in TABA [In reply to] Can't Post

 


take me down to the woodland realm where the trees are green and the elf women are pretty....Oh will you please take me home!!


boldog
Rohan


Apr 22 2013, 9:13am

Post #18 of 21 (140 views)
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easterlings! [In reply to] Can't Post

i like that thought captain salt.
i have also thought that before, that jackson might in fact merge the events of the war of the ring with the hobbit. the easterrlings could be another team in the bo5a, fighting alongside the orcs, and may have a relation with the dol guldur sauron story too. given this, i also believe that dol guldur will in fact be destroyed and the forest cleansed, because no mention of it is made in the rings movies, and it will be not very good to make all that hard work by the white council, all seem for nothing.

"fingolfin looked up in grief to see what evil morgoth had done to maedhros"


arithmancer
Grey Havens


Apr 22 2013, 12:53pm

Post #19 of 21 (142 views)
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Dol Guldur subplot? [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
However that would also prove to be a risk as non-book readers would be questioning why the main antagonist is dead with 2/3 of the film to go. Of course PJ could get around that by changing the story and keeping Smaug alive until the Battle of Five Armies, but that would infuriate the purists.


It seems to me that this is a lesser problem, as by that point the non-book reader is actually watching Movie 3. If Movie 3 is generally holding their attention, viewers will stick around. I also think the decision to add the Dol Guldur subplot to the films will help with this, as suspense/interest could be created by letting the viewers know an army of orcs/goblins/wargs is on its way to the Mountain before Gandalf shows up.


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Apr 22 2013, 5:25pm

Post #20 of 21 (117 views)
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BoFA needs to be the climax of TaBA [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
i don't see what could be the finale? if its not Dol-Guldur or the battle at Laketown than what? its going to be one or the other. I'm betting Smaug will be killed at the end of DOS, they set the stage for the Dol-Guldur battle and the BOT5A at the end of DOS....TABA like ROTK will have two large battles.



I don't think that there is any way around the idea that the Battle of Five Armies should be the climax of There and Back Again (not the end, though, there is far too much that still needs to be covered afterward, especially in the Extended Edition). That leaves the Council's assault on Dol Guldur or Smaug's attack on Lake-town. Tolkien places the Council's attack at about the same time as the company's escape from the Wood-elves and arrival at Esgaroth. Jackson will almost certainly move it back, but how far? I don't think that it should follow Smaug's attack, but if it becomes the climax of DoS then it takes the focus off of Smaug (and Bilbo).

I suppose that if the White Couincil moves against the Necromancer in the first act of TaBA then Gandalf willl still have time to turn back North in time to reach Lake-town and Erebor before the BoFA. It is justifiable because the films still have Gandalf searching for proof at the beginning of DoS to convince the Council that the Necromancer is Sauron and that he is an immediate threat that needs to be opposed.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


Radagast-Aiwendil
Gondor


Apr 22 2013, 7:54pm

Post #21 of 21 (132 views)
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I certainly hope not! [In reply to] Can't Post

That would be fan fiction at its worst as well as a *major* departure from the source material: indeed in terms of departures made by PJ it would be the biggest and most inexcusable yet. Shocked

"True courage is about knowing not when to take a life, but when to spare one."

 
 

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