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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Galadriel's Eyes - Multipoint Light Reflection Missing?

JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Apr 7 2013, 4:42am

Post #1 of 22 (1921 views)
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Galadriel's Eyes - Multipoint Light Reflection Missing? Can't Post

The Lord of the Rings commentary made a pretty big deal about how they contributed to Galadriel's ethereal look by using a special lighting rig so that her eyes would reflect multiple points of light instead of just one. I think it was a wreath-like structure with many lights. They used it just for her.

I watched very closely in The Hobbit for the same effect, for surely they would remember such an important detail that made the commentary, especially with mostly the same crew working on The Hobbit as worked on The Lord of the Rings. But I did not notice anything special in her eyes. It could be that the camera was never close enough to tell, or the angles were wrong. I don't remember, but I was certainly waiting for it and never saw it.

Did anyone notice whether or not they remembered to use the same effect?


deskp
Lorien


Apr 7 2013, 5:18am

Post #2 of 22 (1525 views)
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didn't see it either [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah i looked for it but couldnt see it.

If I remember crrectly thye used like a bunch of christmas lights in lotr.

It's not a big deal but fans who know how things were before will obviously miss it.

Maybe they were like "we'll add it in post" but then that never happened.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Apr 7 2013, 6:05am

Post #3 of 22 (1523 views)
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It is considered impolite for Elves to attempt to dazzle Ainur-Angelic Spirits with glamour. [In reply to] Can't Post

And, or, it is an enchantment that only effects lesser beings.

In Reply To
The Lord of the Rings commentary made a pretty big deal about how they contributed to Galadriel's ethereal look by using a special lighting rig so that her eyes would reflect multiple points of light instead of just one. I think it was a wreath-like structure with many lights. They used it just for her.

I watched very closely in The Hobbit for the same effect, for surely they would remember such an important detail that made the commentary, especially with mostly the same crew working on The Hobbit as worked on The Lord of the Rings. But I did not notice anything special in her eyes. It could be that the camera was never close enough to tell, or the angles were wrong. I don't remember, but I was certainly waiting for it and never saw it.

Did anyone notice whether or not they remembered to use the same effect?


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


DwellerInDale
Rohan


Apr 7 2013, 9:46am

Post #4 of 22 (1471 views)
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More appropriate for the scene and setting [In reply to] Can't Post

In the White Council scene, Galadriel's interactions with Gandalf are played more as communication
between equals; thus I think the "ethereal" look with the multipoint reflections from FOTR would not
have been as appropriate. I thought that the final seconds of the scene (see attached screencap) were
especially intimate and that Cate really nailed it.

Don't mess with my favorite female elf.

Attachments: Galadriel4.jpg (41.2 KB)


dubulous
Rohan

Apr 7 2013, 10:23am

Post #5 of 22 (1462 views)
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I wish they hadn't left it out [In reply to] Can't Post

It's just bad continuity to leave it out really. The depth of her eyes is not supposed to be a manifestation of weather she's equal to or higher in power to who she's talking to, it's part of her physical appearance and the only feature on her face signaling how old she actually is (nothing to do with her relative power).


Owain
Tol Eressea


Apr 7 2013, 3:40pm

Post #6 of 22 (1417 views)
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If you watch closely in The Lord of the Rings... [In reply to] Can't Post

Her eyes are only like that at night in Lothlorien.

They are not like that in the daytime as she bids the fellowship farewell.

This was as much an environmental choice as it was a character story choice.

Rivendell, the story, and the character didn't warrant the same use of lighting. She did however glide/move the same way.

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Apr 7 2013, 5:29pm

Post #7 of 22 (1367 views)
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Warrant [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Rivendell, the story, and the character didn't warrant the same use of lighting.


Says you. I'm guessing that they just forgot, or didn't care as much this time around, unless you have a close inside source to say otherwise. Tongue


Finrod
Rohan


Apr 7 2013, 5:32pm

Post #8 of 22 (1348 views)
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“And light of Trees was in her hair, and in her visage glittering” [In reply to] Can't Post


The holy light reflected in Galadriel’s eyes is a sign of her high birth in Aman under the light unstained of the White Tree and the Golden in flower:
Even among the Eldar she was accounted beautiful, and her hair was held a marvel unmatched. It was golden like the hair of her father and of her foremother Indis, but richer and more radiant, for its gold was touched by some memory of the starlike silver of her mother; and the Eldar said that the light of the Two Trees, Laurelin and Telperion, had been snared in her tresses. Many thought that this saying first gave to Fëanor the thought of imprisoning and blending the light of the Trees that later took shape in his hands as the Silmarils. For Fëanor beheld the hair of Galadriel with wonder and delight.


…all eyes looked upon the ring; for he held it now aloft, and the green jewels gleamed there that the Noldor had devised in Valinor. For this ring was like to twin serpents, whose eyes were emeralds, and their heads met beneath a crown of golden flowers, that the one upheld and the other devoured; that was the badge of Finarfin and his house.
The Silmarillion, pp 150-151
while Felagund laughs beneath the trees
in Valinor and comes no more
to this grey world of tears and war.
The Lays of Beleriand, p 311




Owain
Tol Eressea


Apr 7 2013, 5:32pm

Post #9 of 22 (1370 views)
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What's you're point... [In reply to] Can't Post

That you're guess is as good as mine?

Haha! Ok.

Wink

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Apr 7 2013, 5:51pm

Post #10 of 22 (1350 views)
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Best point ever, Owain! [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
What's your point? That you're guess is as good as mine?


If the only people who were 'allowed' to voice their opinions here were those who had reliable inside sources, pretty much no one would be allowed to say anything. LaughLaugh

Of course, the irony that those who *do* have reliable inside sources *really* aren't allowed to say anything, isn't lost on me
. So, I guess that means all of us will just have to muddle along with our guesses. One thing is certain; we're definitely allowed to enjoy discussing them, especially when good senses of humor prevail!



Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





(This post was edited by Altaira on Apr 7 2013, 5:53pm)


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Apr 7 2013, 7:24pm

Post #11 of 22 (1316 views)
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Peter Jackson : [In reply to] Can't Post

" Consistency is for suckers"

Vous commencez à m'ennuyer avec le port!!!

(This post was edited by Lusitano on Apr 7 2013, 7:25pm)


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Apr 7 2013, 9:56pm

Post #12 of 22 (1288 views)
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The Point [In reply to] Can't Post

No. That your guess is as good as mine. But I did not try to represent the production with a definitive claim.

And Altaira, "Best point ever?" Really? For some reason you appear to enjoy stalking my posts by proxy. Not a complaint - just an observation.


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Apr 7 2013, 10:02pm)


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Apr 7 2013, 10:09pm

Post #13 of 22 (1270 views)
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“And light of Trees was in her hair, and in her visage glittering” [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Findrod: The holy light reflected in Galadriel’s eyes is a sign of her high birth in Aman under the light unstained of the White Tree and the Golden in flower:
Even among the Eldar she was accounted beautiful, and her hair was held a marvel unmatched. It was golden like the hair of her father and of her foremother Indis, but richer and more radiant, for its gold was touched by some memory of the starlike silver of her mother; and the Eldar said that the light of the Two Trees, Laurelin and Telperion, had been snared in her tresses. Many thought that this saying first gave to Fëanor the thought of imprisoning and blending the light of the Trees that later took shape in his hands as the Silmarils. For Fëanor beheld the hair of Galadriel with wonder and delight.


Best point of the thread, being that her appearance is intrinsic and not subject to any external influence.

Tongue


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Apr 7 2013, 10:11pm)


Owain
Tol Eressea


Apr 7 2013, 10:34pm

Post #14 of 22 (1265 views)
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I'm not making any definitive claims... [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm just thinking about what you have stated and pointing out observations from the same set of movies you've watched.

You are asserting that they forgot to light her the same way.

I'm simply making the observation that Galadriel wasn't even lit the same way in the original LOTR movies.

Case in point.

No ethereal eye glow here. (This is a shot from ROTK)

http://images.wikia.com/...Galadriel_-_ROTK.png

No ethereal eye glow here either. (This is also a shot from ROTK.)

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/...l-Cate+Blanchett.jpg

Ah here is the eye glow of which you speak.

http://arwen-undomiel.com/...adriel_blue_eyes.jpg

The only place they look like this in the original movies is in Lothlorien at night... so methinks that was intentional.

I'm not speaking for the production, just thinking out loud.

Isn't that what a message board is for? I didn't start this thread, you did. If you don't like people responding to your posts, then maybe you shouldn't introduce topics for conversation?

Just a thought. Smile

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."


IdrilofGondolin
Rohan

Apr 7 2013, 10:56pm

Post #15 of 22 (1260 views)
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Wow! [In reply to] Can't Post

This discussion is interesting. I've seen FOTR dozens of times and never noticed the gleam in Galadriel's eyes. I did notice that her eyes were hooded in the scene where she and Celeborn greet the Fellowship, but that is about it. I suppose I was too busy looking at her costume, which fascinated me. But then I am a costume geek.

On another continuity/consistency note: Why can't they remember to light up Glamdring? They didn't do it in LOTR and they didn't do it here. Orcrist could have used a little blue flame action too.


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Apr 8 2013, 3:02am

Post #16 of 22 (1230 views)
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"Warranted" and Definitive Claims [In reply to] Can't Post

Ok. It's the word "warranted" that I took as rather authoritative. It's a strong word that I would associate only to the thoughts of the creators. You could say you suspect they didn't feel it was warranted for the character. But I would still disagree, and Finrod's post is the best explanation of why it is intrinsic to Galadriel. If they did it even once in production and kept it in the release, it was obviously warranted.

The third JPG (with the effect) wasn't available to me; the hotlink is disabled. But if you go to the site, it's easy to find. There are an interesting set of pictures. Most of them would not be revealing because of the pose or the lighting, so I wouldn't say it's conclusive that the effect should be limited to the night shot at Lothlórien. But, in real life, I imagine that was true and that it would be very difficult to achieve in daylight without CGI. In comparison, I'd wager the practical Christmas light effect was essentially free compared with trying to do it in CGI - and that's why they were able to try it. So I would think it wouldn't be done otherwise for practical reasons, but not because it's unwarranted for Galadriel. They didn't fix the glow on Gandalf's sword, but not because that was unwarranted either. It glowed in the book.


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Apr 8 2013, 3:08am)


Owain
Tol Eressea


Apr 8 2013, 3:33am

Post #17 of 22 (1219 views)
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I think it's rather safe to assume that... [In reply to] Can't Post

the overwhelming majority of members on these boards are not apart of the movie productions and any stance we take on opinions we utter doesn't need to be prefaced with "I suspect".


Quote
You could say you suspect they didn't feel it was warranted for the character.


It's a fan site filled with speculation, no?

And your defending your own opinions with a healthy dose of "authority" so it's a two way street.

Here's another link to Galadriel's eyes with the effect you are referencing as it appeared in FOTR.

http://jonbateswrites.files.wordpress.com/...1/galadriel-eyes.png

The shot's I've posted are pretty clear. There is a distinct difference in them.

Ultimately, for me, I am not bothered by either the presence or absence of the twinkling Christmas lights in Cate Blanchette's eyes. She radiates the description within Tolkien's work, from her presence and performance.

I'm sticking with the idea that environment was a big part of that particular lighting decision.

Smile

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."

(This post was edited by Owain on Apr 8 2013, 3:36am)


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Apr 8 2013, 4:35am

Post #18 of 22 (1210 views)
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Seriously?! [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Altaira, "Best point ever?" Really? For some reason you appear to enjoy stalking my posts by proxy. Not a complaint - just an observation.


Paranoid, a bit, are we?
LaughLaughLaughLaugh

'Stalking?" Seriously? I'd be most interested in any conclusive evidence. I think you'll find that I haven't posted in the same threads you have for a very, very long time and, if then, haven't even remotely replied anywhere close to your replies.

After examining the evidence, I'm afraid you'll be accusing me of purposely avoiding you.
Angelic


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





(This post was edited by Altaira on Apr 8 2013, 4:37am)


Arannir
Valinor

Apr 8 2013, 7:45am

Post #19 of 22 (1188 views)
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Since they did not do that for all galadriel scenes in LotR... [In reply to] Can't Post

... I do not really get why it should be in AUJ.

They used it in a scene in which both the "mind-reading" and the general design/lightning/staging of the scene allowed for the "sparkles" in her eyes.


Eleniel
Grey Havens


Apr 9 2013, 10:49am

Post #20 of 22 (1126 views)
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This is probably not exactly pertinentt... [In reply to] Can't Post

but I happened to notice this quote from Peter King in the latest Weta Chronicles, regarding Galadriel's look:




Quote



"Their effect was very subtle, but Galadriel actually wore contact lenses. Rather than completely recolour them, her lenses were designed to lighten and enhance Cate Blanchett's own pale blue eyes, making them feel even more
remarkable and beautiful, but still based within her natural colour range."



Anyone know if this was the case in LotR also?


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort






sauget.diblosio
Tol Eressea

Apr 10 2013, 6:56pm

Post #21 of 22 (1108 views)
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In the EE Appendices, [In reply to] Can't Post

they called it the GaladrieLight.


sueb1863
Rivendell


Apr 10 2013, 11:35pm

Post #22 of 22 (1107 views)
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It was OK with me [In reply to] Can't Post

I didn't mind that they left it out of AUJ. I never thought it was a very successful effect. It looked like exactly what it was - a ring of electric Christmas tree lights reflected in her eyes. They never really looked like they were supposed to be stars to me, and if I didn't know that that's what they were supposed to be, I would have just thought that they were filming lights reflected in her eyes.

 
 

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