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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
"Wranglers say 'Hobbit' animals died on unsafe farm"
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The Preciousss
Bree

Nov 20 2012, 3:49pm

Post #26 of 50 (337 views)
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I have totaly lost respect for PETA a long time ago... [In reply to] Can't Post

Here in Germany they try to push laws through that forbid the exotic animals as pet. They tend to approach politicans who are under pressure before elections and present facts and numbers that are totally invented by them. For example they frauded a statistic about poison accidents that said that 95% of all emergency calls to the poison emergency center were from pet snakes (around 3000 a year). When investigated, the emergency center responded that they were never asked by PETA and the statistic was totally wrong. I don't have the exact numbers, but it was more like: 5% bites from snakes which equaled about 20 a year. But at that time the damage was already done. A law that forbid's the keeping of poisonous animals was passed, the politicans didn't want to admid that they acted prematurely and the press ignored the facts. This law is now upheld in several states and forbids not only the keeping and breeding of poisonous snakes, but for example Poison Dart Frogs (which lose their poison in captivity as well ) some of which are nearly extinct in the wild and only survive through dedicated breeders.


There was also a big uprear in the USA, IIRC about PETA taking dogs and cats from asylums under the pretense of adopting them, only to euthanize them and dumping them in the trash. Here is the link( but only in German, trying to find one in english): http://www.oe24.at/welt/Zuerst-gerettet-und-dann-eingeschlaefert/784463


Kassandros
Rohan


Nov 20 2012, 3:54pm

Post #27 of 50 (327 views)
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Have there been any reports about how many cows, pigs, and chickens were slaughtered to feed the crew? [In reply to] Can't Post

Why are people so much more concerned about horses than about cows, pigs, and chickens? All of those creatures can be very affectionate and form close bonds with each other and with humans.

I'm not going to engage in a discussion of vegetarianism, but I must say it amuses me when people get so worked over dogs or horses but think nothing of the horrific conditions other animals are raised in so that they can have a burger or chicken nuggets at McDonald's.

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...


The Preciousss
Bree

Nov 20 2012, 4:03pm

Post #28 of 50 (280 views)
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Here is a the Link: [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.petakillsanimals.com/

I wonder that PETA still has followers...


DanielLB
Immortal


Nov 20 2012, 4:20pm

Post #29 of 50 (282 views)
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I've only just noticed! [In reply to] Can't Post

I thought double posting was impossible on the forum? I'll get admins to have a look.Crazy

Want Hobbit Movie News? Hobbit Headlines of the Week!



Tim
Tol Eressea


Nov 20 2012, 4:32pm

Post #30 of 50 (270 views)
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Why would there be? [In reply to] Can't Post

They all taste good.

-Tim came by. Tim! If you had heard only a quarter of what I have heard about him, and I have only heard very little of all there is to hear, you would be prepared for any sort of remarkable tale.


imin
Valinor


Nov 20 2012, 4:35pm

Post #31 of 50 (258 views)
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PETA - people eating tasty animals // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Nov 20 2012, 6:25pm

Post #32 of 50 (234 views)
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People like them make all animal protectors look bad [In reply to] Can't Post

It's the same with any good intention: some nutjobs ruin it by making the public believe everyone supporting it are idiots.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor


Nov 20 2012, 6:28pm

Post #33 of 50 (263 views)
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Imma just leave this here... [In reply to] Can't Post


=)

**********************************


NABOUF
Not a TORns*b!
Certified Curmudgeon
Knitting Knerd
NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011

(This post was edited by Eowyn of Penns Woods on Nov 20 2012, 6:32pm)


Ataahua
Superuser / Moderator


Nov 20 2012, 8:35pm

Post #34 of 50 (194 views)
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*copies, saves* :D / [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauronís master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Ataahua's stories


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Nov 20 2012, 9:00pm

Post #35 of 50 (181 views)
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Flawless victory. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Kassandros
Rohan


Nov 20 2012, 9:43pm

Post #36 of 50 (177 views)
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Victory over whom, exactly? // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...


ceppault
Bree


Nov 20 2012, 9:48pm

Post #37 of 50 (167 views)
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Timely fodder by PETA [In reply to] Can't Post

Appears a textbook case of what should occur when something unfortunate happens. A serious problem with the animals was identified. It was voluntarily brought up, and it was investigated by the appropriate authority on the matter. Measures were placed to keep it from happening again.

Not going to lose sleep over it.

Can't help but feel the deaths of the animals are being exploited for gain. That is what is sad.

Production Locations on Google Maps
The Hobbit
The Return of the King
The Two Towers
The Fellowship of the Ring

(This post was edited by ceppault on Nov 20 2012, 9:54pm)


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Nov 20 2012, 10:56pm

Post #38 of 50 (144 views)
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The rising argument. [In reply to] Can't Post

Some people have the gift to kill the building tension by doing something silly. If one participants stubbornly wishes to continue, s/he is left looking like someone beating the dead horse.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied

(This post was edited by Faenoriel on Nov 20 2012, 10:57pm)


Kassandros
Rohan


Nov 20 2012, 11:15pm

Post #39 of 50 (135 views)
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"beating the dead horse" - Wow. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...


Elenorflower
Gondor


Nov 21 2012, 12:36am

Post #40 of 50 (131 views)
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poor old PJ [In reply to] Can't Post

he really has to deal with a lot of sour grapes and nonsense. I am sure he pays people to make sure things like this dont happen? surely his team should nip these problems in the bud before they blow up.


squitzl
The Shire

Nov 21 2012, 2:33am

Post #41 of 50 (123 views)
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Poor old PJ perhaps... [In reply to] Can't Post

But the main problem PETA is addressing is that even though the AHA, who were hired to take care of the animals, failed at their job, the concerns raised and brought to the attention of the production company were subsequently ignored them and fired the few who had complained.

Whether or not this is true remains to be seen and until we have the full information we really need to not make any accusations or assumptions. (Not saying you were just making a general statement.)

A lot of it seems like wordplay. PJ saying the animals didn't die 'during filming' does not mean that they didn't die. But we shouldn't assume that they did die until a full investigation has been carried out.

I will be attending the premier so I'm bummed about the picketing as anyone would be. However if the allegations are true then people need to be aware. Big production companies need to be aware that having an audience depends on them making adequate considerations for the animals involved in the film.

Neglect of animal welfare is simply not okay.


(This post was edited by squitzl on Nov 21 2012, 2:37am)


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Nov 21 2012, 4:00pm

Post #42 of 50 (95 views)
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Yep. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Nov 21 2012, 4:05pm

Post #43 of 50 (100 views)
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If PETA really cared [In reply to] Can't Post

they would have brough this up when it happened, not now when they get the maxium media attention.

Also, isn't it just convienent how now there's no way to proof anything? Anyone can make accusations a year later, because the accused one cannot disprove something that happened so long ago. Undisproved = almost real = the suspect will forever remain guilty.

The fact that PETA has lied their little heart out in the past doesn't make them the more believable party here.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Elenorflower
Gondor


Nov 21 2012, 4:10pm

Post #44 of 50 (95 views)
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absolutely [In reply to] Can't Post

its not ok for animals to be harmed, thats obvious. But I am against the knee-jerk reaction of some people to blame PJ for things not under his direct control. He is a film director, and is there to do a vastly difficult job with HUGE logistical problems, he has enough on his plate without having to worry about animal welfare. The studio and/or his team should sort the day to day administration of the shoot surely? Its the person PAID to organize the animals scenes and hires the animals and is in contact with the animals owners and the wranglers on the shoot. that has the responsibility to make sure no animals are harmed. They are paid to do this job, so that PJ can get on with his job. If they do a bad job well it sucks, but that remains to be seen, in my opinion all this is a huge waste of time and no animals were really hurt. I also saw on the blogs how much CARE the whole team put into making sure the land is not disturbed during shooting. They made a huge bridge over some land to stop trampling feet and disturbance of the flora and fauna. That shows PJ and co are very keen eco issues on how they use the land and it seems unbelievable they would allow animals to be hurt. IMHO.


Kassandros
Rohan


Nov 21 2012, 4:14pm

Post #45 of 50 (100 views)
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"its not ok for animals to be harmed, thats obvious." - Really? [In reply to] Can't Post

Your position really is that it's never ok for any animal to be harmed? For any reason? No animals should ever be harmed for food? For medical research? For making leather or fur to use in costumes?

I'm guessing you misspoke, but it might be good to think about in just which circumstances it's ok to harm an animal and in which circumstances it isn't.

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...


Lissuin
Tol Eressea


Nov 21 2012, 7:51pm

Post #46 of 50 (118 views)
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Today's news: Is it [sic] a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury... [In reply to] Can't Post

signifying nothing?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/...mp;objectid=10849134


imin
Valinor


Nov 21 2012, 8:49pm

Post #47 of 50 (76 views)
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Its ok in certain circumstances [In reply to] Can't Post

Such as to eat them or for medical research where there are no other choices - i would rather test on an animal than a human, to me a human life is worth more than an animals, this is not to say animals are worthless its just if push came to shove i would save my mum before saving my dog - therefore humans are more important to me overall.

I wouldnt want to see needless harm come to animals - as in being cruel to them for no reason or shooting them for fun.

I think you can eat meat and still respect animals as people have believed for thousands of years.

Current practices of slaughter stun the animal and keep them apart so they dont see what is about to happen (for pigs in the uk atleast). So it decreases stress levels and they are unconscious and paraylsed before being killed or killed instantly.

Ultimately i could if i had to live a vegetarian life and it would be better for the environment - allowing other animals to thrive where there would only be cattle etc but ultimately if the animal was raised well and cared for and given a quick painless death then im ok with that and would be willing to kill it myself as i have done.


Elenorflower
Gondor


Nov 21 2012, 10:35pm

Post #48 of 50 (63 views)
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wow! [In reply to] Can't Post

so much patronizing in so little time. My compliments to the Vegan chef!


squitzl
The Shire

Nov 21 2012, 11:01pm

Post #49 of 50 (66 views)
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I understand, but my point was... [In reply to] Can't Post

That although Peter can't oversee everything, and the people paid to do their job failed, the allegations are that the whistle-blowers were ignored by the production company. (which I'm not sure is true seeing as they spent a lot of money improving the farm conditions after the reports.) But if PJ and/or co. ignored and fired whistleblowers, it obviously means that they were aware and were choosing not to take the rap.

I tend to lean towards siding with PJ, due to Peta's bad track record. But we can't just baselessly accuse Peta of false allegations or we're simply as bad as them. They might end up having told the truth, remember, PJ has a lot of money invested in this project.

The point is let's not jump to conclusions, just because Peta have lied before doesn't necessarily mean they are lying now.


Elenorflower
Gondor


Nov 22 2012, 12:51am

Post #50 of 50 (136 views)
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I didnt mention PETA [In reply to] Can't Post

so please dont say I accused them of anything. I didnt mention them, nor was I thinking about them.

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