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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
"Down, down to Goblin Town" in TH?
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Sinister71
Tol Eressea


Sep 26 2012, 12:40am

Post #26 of 36 (351 views)
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there were a few scene directly out of Bakshi's LOTR in FOTR [In reply to] Can't Post

in Peter Jackson's version, the Black rider with Frodo hiding under the roots, The scene in Bree where the nazgul were stabbing the beds, as well as the proud feet one... scenes and camera angels are almost exact between the 2 films.

On a side note Bakshi was at dragon-con last year in Atlanta and got quite upset about those instances when someone asked him about them. He seemed to not like Peter Jackson very much at all. Unimpressed


FiliSonOfDis
Rivendell


Sep 26 2012, 1:01am

Post #27 of 36 (349 views)
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I'd love to hear down down to goblin town [In reply to] Can't Post

Bakshi is well known for being overly critical though, comic book guy on the simpsons is based on which says a lot about his personality.

If they reference the Rankin/Bass Hobbit I'd like it to be the "down down to goblin town" song. I don't expect the song to be in there but some kind of reworked song thats similar sounding in rhythm or whatever would be awesome. I don't think it's too comical, it could actually be really frightening if they have them laughing and taunting all the dwarves in song. Given that the great goblin falls on all the dwarves, goblin town might not be 100% serious in tone anyway.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Sep 26 2012, 2:00am

Post #28 of 36 (335 views)
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Agreed. [In reply to] Can't Post

Enough said, and agreed. The way some people object you would think no one had ever heard of people singing in groups in everyday life before. Singing happens all the time. And groups sing often enough, if the song is known to all. Marching songs, carols, anthems etc. etc.

In Reply To
So why not goblins?

I hope to hear it.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 26 2012, 6:52am

Post #29 of 36 (321 views)
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The dwarves' song [In reply to] Can't Post

Is some of Tolkien's better poetry - certainty up to song lyric standard.

But goblins singing a silly song just aint scary.

They could have a sinister chant (e.g. like Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom), but you would need to translate the lyrics into goblin.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...

(This post was edited by Fardragon on Sep 26 2012, 6:53am)


grinman
Rivendell


Sep 26 2012, 1:30pm

Post #30 of 36 (289 views)
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...but [In reply to] Can't Post

So, with all this singing going on around us, when was the last time you were scared or intimidated by a group singing an anthem or a christmas carol (besides when the local state penitentiary goes out on it's annual caroling drive)? Yes, singing happens pretty regularly.. especially if the song "is known to all". I don't deny this. I'm still not convinced that goblins singing (a pretty silly song, really) can be scary or convey the proper sense of oh-crapitude. It's not the fact that the goblins are singing that I'm objecting to, it's what they're singing and when they're singing it.

Someone else suggested maybe a goblinish chant.. I can get behind that idea too. I don't even think the audience would necessarily have to know what they're saying... just a scary marching chant would work for me.



In Reply To
Enough said, and agreed. The way some people object you would think no one had ever heard of people singing in groups in everyday life before. Singing happens all the time. And groups sing often enough, if the song is known to all. Marching songs, carols, anthems etc. etc.

In Reply To
So why not goblins?

I hope to hear it.




Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 26 2012, 1:55pm

Post #31 of 36 (295 views)
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I've been thinking... [In reply to] Can't Post

It's the Snap! Crack! (and similar) lines that could only be sung by helium voiced munchkins.

The Goblins could have a chant similar to the original song, but instead of singing "Snap! Crack!" they could make the sound by actually cracking their whips to the beat.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Sep 26 2012, 7:12pm

Post #32 of 36 (263 views)
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Those words are great [In reply to] Can't Post

Particularly when you place them next to lyrics that the dwarves and elves sing.

The dwarves are short and terse in their word usage, but they talk about making, creating, and the love of things of man-made beauty.

The orc songs are also short and terse, but the words they use revolve around maiming, torturing and breaking, rather than making, crafting. There is no love for anything in those words, apart from a delight in destruction.

The elves are a bit less terse, and their songs are often about rather simple natural things, such as streams and wind.

As such, the songs are great little character sketches. I hope the song makes it in as it is in the book. Give the goblins harsh and booming voices, and it should still have some oh-craptitude.


grinman
Rivendell


Sep 26 2012, 7:35pm

Post #33 of 36 (278 views)
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IF! [In reply to] Can't Post

IF the song is in and the filmmakers make it appropriately tense and scary, I will happily enjoy the hell out of that scene!! I want as much of Tolkien's words in these films as possible, songs and all. I just have these ideas of what I think would and wouldn't work in a film. Obviously, I'm not a film maker and more importantly, I'm not Peter Jackson. He has a pretty good track record, in my opinion, so I trust that whatever makes it on screen for this scene will work.

But honestly, the worst that could happen would be me rolling my eyes while the goblins come across as silly for a few seconds. Unless the song is absolutely horrid, there's no way I'll HATE this part.

I originally didn't want the Stone Giants in the film.. personal preference. They're obviously in and I'm excited to see how that scene turns out on the screen! So, my preferences mean very little to PJ & Co... probably to everyone else's benefit.


Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 27 2012, 7:47am

Post #34 of 36 (264 views)
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You can sing Snap! Crack! [In reply to] Can't Post

With a harsh and booming voice.

Very short words with rising intonation (made even more so by the exclamation marks).

In a low register, you would get something that sounds like snnaaarrrppppcraaarrrrrck, nothing like the sound of a whip that it is intended to invoke.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Sep 28 2012, 1:12am

Post #35 of 36 (248 views)
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Agreed [In reply to] Can't Post

My guess is that PJ will give us some goblin singing. Can't wait for it.

In fact, so far, the most excited about these films I have been was while listening to the dwarf song in the teaser trailer. Chills down the spine would be an understatement.


Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 30 2012, 8:21am

Post #36 of 36 (289 views)
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It's not suprising [In reply to] Can't Post

Since it was the edition of LotR with the cover taken from the Bakshi film that PJ read first.

(same for me, as it happens)

A Far Dragon is the best kind...

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