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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Shadowfax...what role will he play?
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Solicitr
Lorien

Sep 25 2012, 3:46pm

Post #26 of 44 (227 views)
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Wow! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I like to pretend that the 17 years does pass


Then Merry, Pippin and Sam must all have aging-prevention rings we don't know about


DanielLB
Immortal


Sep 25 2012, 3:51pm

Post #27 of 44 (214 views)
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I'm exactly the same [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
And although they don't mention the time lapses in the movie that doesn't necessarily mean that they didn't happen. Phillipa said something like "we just pretend that we didn't discuss those parts left out." This is one quote of hers that I liked. I like to pretend that the 17 years does pass, and that they spend a few months in Lorien, etc.


I like to think that the Hobbits did get waylaid in the Barrow Downs, and did meet Bombadil. Merry and Pippin did meet Quickbeam. Glorfindel is in Rivendell, and so on. Just because the film goes from scene to scene, doesn't mean things still didn't happen in between.

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imin
Valinor


Sep 25 2012, 5:32pm

Post #28 of 44 (189 views)
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They all have really long [In reply to] Can't Post

telomeres Tongue


PattyJB
Rivendell


Sep 25 2012, 5:41pm

Post #29 of 44 (183 views)
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Mearas do not live that long [In reply to] Can't Post

Shadowfax would not have been alive during the time of The Hobbit. The Encyclopedia of Arda entry is as follows:


Quote
Mearas
Noblest of the horses of Rohan

In the old north of Middle-earth lived a proud race of wild horses, long-lived, wise and fleet of foot. The legends of Men said that their ancestors had been brought from the West by Béma, their name for the Vala Oromë.

One of these was captured as a foal by Léod of the Éothéod. It grew into a strong white horse, but when Léod tried to mount it, it threw him and killed him. Léod's son Eorl took the horse himself, naming him Felaróf. Felaróf was one of the greatest horses to have ever lived, and was said to understand the speech of Men. He carried Eorl when the Éothéod rode south to Rohan, and there sired a race of horses nearly as great as himself.

These were the Mearas, noble horses that lived as long as a Man, and had extraordinary strength and intelligence. Throughout their history, they would only allow themselves to be ridden by the Lord of the Mark or his sons. This long tradition was broken by Gandalf, who managed to train the greatest of the Mearas of his time, Shadowfax, and rode that mighty horse throughout the War of the Ring.

The word Mearas comes from an Anglo-Saxon word meaning simply 'horses'. Its singular form would be mearh, but no character in The Lord of the Rings ever uses that word.

http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/m/mearas.html




Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Sep 25 2012, 6:41pm

Post #30 of 44 (176 views)
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Wouldn't mind seeing Shadowfax again, but don't really expect to... [In reply to] Can't Post

"Many dangers" could surely be interpreted as Gandy's efforts in TH, but they made such a big moment of his introduction in TTT, it'd be kind-of anti-climatic if he'd appeared earlier...then again, everyone else appearing from LotR had pretty good introductions before and we're seeing them again, so...could work either way, I guess.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


Elthir
Gondor

Sep 25 2012, 6:49pm

Post #31 of 44 (176 views)
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old horses [In reply to] Can't Post

I think Shadowfax could have been alive during Bilbo's adventures -- unless there is some indication of his age when Gandalf tamed him, for example, or somewhere else.

Year 2941 (Bilbo's adventure) + 85 years (life of a man, although this could be variable of course) brings us to Year 3026. This leaves some room for Shadowfax to be more than newly born in year 2941 (3021 Gandalf departs with Shadowfax at the Grey Havens).

If the math here is correct!

But in any case Gandalf rode the white horse Rohald during Bilbo's adventures, and only tamed the grey horse Shadowfax much later.


(This post was edited by Elthir on Sep 25 2012, 6:59pm)


stoutfiles
Rohan

Sep 25 2012, 7:35pm

Post #32 of 44 (166 views)
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PJ abandoned reason for madness [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Shadowfax would not have been alive during the time of The Hobbit.

Quote



Gandalf didn't have many adventures with Shadowfax before LOTR, but in PJ's Middle-Earth he supposedly did. They aren't the same place! PJ doesn't care what the Encyclopedia says. If he wants to connect his films and give Gandalf a unique horse after Goblin-town, he will give him Shadowfax.

You can't bring logic into this argument. PJ doesn't follow logic, he just gives the mainstream audience what they want, does what looks best on camera, and will likely jump at the chance to link his films. What he likely won't do is put Gandalf on a white horse that isn't Shadowfax, because that would be confusing for the mainstream audience.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Sep 25 2012, 10:12pm

Post #33 of 44 (129 views)
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In my opinion [In reply to] Can't Post

you have filled your cart with a load of horse pucky. But then sometimes you just got to vent. Evil

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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Ring-Bearer
Rivendell


Sep 25 2012, 10:36pm

Post #34 of 44 (141 views)
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The Return of the King, appendices, page 1066. [In reply to] Can't Post

The year 3018, one of the great years, following the account of the War of the Ring.
September 21, 3018-
Gandalf meets Shadowfax, but the horse will not allow him to come near. He follows Shadowfax over the fields.
September 22, 3018-
Gandalf overtakes Shadowfax.


'I will take it! I will take the Ring to Mordor- though, I do not know the way...'


stoutfiles
Rohan

Sep 26 2012, 12:05am

Post #35 of 44 (118 views)
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Do I not speak the truth? [In reply to] Can't Post

In TTT alone:

Did the Hobbits go to Osgiliath?
Did Aragorn almost die in a warg attack?
Did Haldir show up at Helm's Deep and die?
etc.

People keep pointing out things that can't happen because they didn't happen in the book, but PJ has shown time and time again he doesn't care if it happened in the book. If it makes for better cinema and character development, he will change the material as he sees fit.

Knowing this, to say there's no way Shadowfax will be in one of the films is "horse pucky".


Solicitr
Lorien

Sep 26 2012, 1:19am

Post #36 of 44 (115 views)
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Not exactly [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
If it makes for better cinema and character development


No, if it makes for better pandering the tastes of a mass mouth-breathing audience, he'll do it.

And before anyone challenges me, two words:
Shield surfing.


Fàfnir
Rohan


Sep 26 2012, 2:23am

Post #37 of 44 (118 views)
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There were some unused Tolkien notes about elvish shield surfing, but... [In reply to] Can't Post

Ok, there were none. Too bad Unsure


Milknut
Rohan


Sep 26 2012, 6:46am

Post #38 of 44 (90 views)
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How I remember it: [In reply to] Can't Post

Shocked <-- whistling

The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie___


Milknut
Rohan


Sep 26 2012, 6:47am

Post #39 of 44 (82 views)
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Hehe :)// [In reply to] Can't Post

 

The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie___


Ring-Bearer
Rivendell


Sep 28 2012, 4:16am

Post #40 of 44 (55 views)
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Along with... [In reply to] Can't Post

...running up a chain while attacking a cave troll and taking down an entire oliphaunt...
I agree, PJ did put in a lot to create excitement for the audience, though I must admit the oliphaunt was pretty neat. I'm actually looking forward to seeing the fighting styles of the elves in The Hobbit.


'I will take it! I will take the Ring to Mordor- though, I do not know the way...'
'I can't carry it for you, but I can carry you!'


Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 28 2012, 8:20am

Post #41 of 44 (44 views)
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I've just rechecked the trailers [In reply to] Can't Post

And the "Gandalf" ending shows the company riding horses. It's apparently just after they have left the Shire, and Gandalf is riding a Brown horse.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Elthir
Gondor

Sep 28 2012, 12:56pm

Post #42 of 44 (51 views)
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a brown horse? [In reply to] Can't Post

Well that just possibly maybe shows that Jackson isn't paying attention to the text of either The Lord of the Rings or The Hobbit...

... as there ain't any brown horses in Middle-earth! Wink

Well maybe there is... but I can't find any such description so far... not that I checked every page myself... yet. Anyone remember a 'brown' horse or pony in these two books (or anything in The Silmarillion for that matter)?

Just wondering. But Rohald is white in any case. But I agree Jackson might want to avoid that considering he had a white horse for Shadowfax (who again ain't described as white in the books).

It's slightly confusing.


Fardragon
Rohan

Sep 28 2012, 12:59pm

Post #43 of 44 (39 views)
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I think it's meant to be the same colour [In reply to] Can't Post

as the horse that pulls Gandalf's cart in Fellowship.

But it's easy to see for yourself.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Elthir
Gondor

Sep 28 2012, 1:07pm

Post #44 of 44 (111 views)
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magic carts [In reply to] Can't Post

But the text says an old man was driving that cart, all alone.

There ain't any 'brown' pony even; if I'm not mistaken.


(This post was edited by Elthir on Sep 28 2012, 1:08pm)

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