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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Scenes in the Hobbit films that will affect how you watch the Rings films!!
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Sep 23 2012, 1:08am

Post #51 of 63 (872 views)
Is there a real reason why not changing him? [In reply to] Can't Post

The only one I can think would be... respect?
But, I mean, if someone comes to me and say 3 + 2 = 6, I just have no respect for him/her.
Holm is also in these new movies and I see it as big sign of respect from PJ.
We all love him, we all respect him, but this is just about logic/continuity, not respect.
These movies, I think, are to be intended as single piece.
If there's another reason, please let me know.



Sep 23 2012, 1:34am

Post #52 of 63 (857 views)
Simple [In reply to] Can't Post

In the Fellowship of the Ring, it is important that the audience connect the Bilbo from the prologue to the Bilbo in the Shire. If the Bilbo from the prologue is Martin Freeman, and then the Bilbo from the Shire is Ian Holm, it will be confusing for those who are just watching the Fellowship of the Ring.


Sep 23 2012, 1:51am

Post #53 of 63 (850 views)
I agree in general [In reply to] Can't Post

..although I disagree about Moria. I see this as a very different situation than the ring. The ring has been lost for centuries and its discovery is the entire center of the plot of FOTR. Therefore it would be redundant and crude to include any of that sort of material in TH and would diminish FOTR.

For Moria, though, I see no problem with Balin, Ori, and Oin stating that they are planning on heading to Moria, or at least fantasizing about going back there one day. There is no thematic reason to conceal the name Moria. All they need to do is describe it as an ancient and abandoned dwarf kingdom far to the southwest. I don't think there should be any hint of their dark fate, but talking about the place seems more than appropriate.

The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie.
The cake is a lie___


Sep 23 2012, 2:32am

Post #54 of 63 (860 views)
Hopefully we'll see Estel win the Pod race. [In reply to] Can't Post

And be called Aragornie.

Seriously though, I expect some Ring involvement since Sauron/Necromancer is a large subplot. Sounds like we'll be getting some story about the Seven and the Nine, so they will likely discuss the Three and the One. It will make Gandalf look like a fool for talking so long to figure it all out.

Balin will likely be mentioned as going to Moria in the third film's ending as a "where are they now?" finale. Radagast will be shown either using The Moth or becoming it, hopefully the former. I believe Freeman should replace Ian Holm in the prologue scene, although it's not crucial.


Sep 23 2012, 2:36am

Post #55 of 63 (850 views)
Glowing swords [In reply to] Can't Post

Also large glowing swords would look like lightsabers! Perhaps they tried it and were like "Oh...wow...no..."

Still not sure about Orcrist glowing, though doubting it more now. In one scene we see Thorin holding Orcrist (right behind Dwalin) while in the presence of goblins:

You can barely make out a sword in his right hand, and it is not blazing with light (though the angle is bad, and they could add it still, I guess).

And in the tree shot, I would expect it to be lit up since there should be orcs down below:


It has a blue tint, but that could just be reflection of the sky. Compare to Sting here:


The Hobbit Photo Gallery


Sep 23 2012, 5:33am

Post #56 of 63 (862 views)
Thank God. [In reply to] Can't Post

The book was utterly clear tha Gandalf breaks the bridge and it always bothered m that Peter made that ambiguous for dramatic effect. I have long hoped that these movies would properly display the Wizard's power as the book describes it.

In Reply To
I was just thinking about some of the scenes from the trailer, and one of them got me thinking -which scenes/parts of the Hobbit films will affect how you view the Rings films? Cool

The scene I am thinking about ***spoilers*** is where Gandalf breaks the big rock to let sunlight through against the trolls... Now at first I thought "that is really cool" but now I have realised something... Gandalf has done this before with the Balrog! "Yeah we know!!" you all say Tongue

I always thought (and I am probably alone here) that when Gandalf does his "You shall not pass" it does nothing what-so-ever and as the Balrog approaches him his WEIGHT is what brakes the bridge causing him (it?) to fall! Now I will watch that assuming Gandalf weakens the bridge (or cracks it) causing the Balrog to fall (same as the big rock in the Hobbit)


*also the Balin death might actually be sad if he is an enjoyable character*

"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Sep 23 2012, 3:31pm

Post #57 of 63 (777 views)
Ah, ok. You consider them as two distinct movies. I do not. [In reply to] Can't Post

Unless the Hobbit is a complete failure, I hope they replace Ian Holm.
But if the Hobbit ends up like the prequels of Star Wars, I totally agree with you.


The Shire

Sep 23 2012, 3:59pm

Post #58 of 63 (776 views)
Balin's tomb... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think this is one sequence that will be profoundly more impactful after the Hobbit movies, particularly seeing as Balin becomes such an endearing character and friend to Gandalf and Bilbo. I hope they keep the final scene of the three in Bag End sat discussing matters which, given PJ's adherance to the ending of ROTK I am confident they will (though we will likely also return to older Bilbo and Frodo for some LOTR plugging).

In Fellowship that sequence was somewhat moving due to Gimli's reaction and Gandalf's clear sorrow at Balin's death, however after the Hobbit trilogy I think the audience too will be much more moved and invested learning of his death.

Trailer breakdown for The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey now live!


Sep 23 2012, 4:04pm

Post #59 of 63 (776 views)
I always thought it was pretty clear [In reply to] Can't Post

That Gandalf's power is what broke the bridge as the Balrog stepped in it.


Sep 23 2012, 4:09pm

Post #60 of 63 (771 views)
Moria [In reply to] Can't Post

I wouldn't have a problem them including that in the hobbit. I think it adds a lot to the ties that bind. Obviously, be some folks out there that will disagree but to each his own.

The Shire

Sep 23 2012, 4:33pm

Post #61 of 63 (770 views)
I agree [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm so surprised people think it is ambiguous as to whether or not Gandalf broke the bridge - he made a big issue of doing so - raising his staff, yelling 'you shall not pass' and then slamming it down onto the bridge.

There were close ups of the staff slamming into the bridge and the following cracking and grinding sound... do people really need anything more concrete?

Trailer breakdown for The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey now live!


Sep 23 2012, 6:14pm

Post #62 of 63 (746 views)
I'll judge Freeman when I see the finished product [In reply to] Can't Post

But Holm's Bilbo is etched into my Tolkien heart forever.

That's a bit gushy for me ...

*goes to throw up*

Want Hobbit Movie News? Hobbit Headlines of the Week!


Sep 23 2012, 8:33pm

Post #63 of 63 (811 views)
erm [In reply to] Can't Post

I was under the impression that Estel was just a kid in the time of the Hobbit? could be wrong, where are the Loremasters when you need them? Blush

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