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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Why does a defeated, yet non-stone troll fall on the dwarves?
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Sep 20 2012, 4:01pm

Post #76 of 87 (205 views)
It's entirely possible [In reply to] Can't Post

That this thing will do for Jackson's overinflated reputation what Phantom Menace did for Lucas'

One can only hope

Tol Eressea

Sep 20 2012, 4:22pm

Post #77 of 87 (191 views)
I second this hilarious vote. [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To
It has to stay. It reminds me of Pippin.

But I also thought Gimli was funny so...

King Arthur: You know much that is hidden oh Tim.

Tim: Quite.


Sep 20 2012, 4:41pm

Post #78 of 87 (201 views)
Come off it. [In reply to] Can't Post

But this is outrageously implausible, destroys tension and suspension of disbelief,

You're talking about suspension of disbelief in a story that features a dragon, a wizard that talks to animals, trolls and stone giants?

Clutching at straws here aren't we? Tongue

"A single dream is more powerful than a thousand realities."


Sep 20 2012, 5:58pm

Post #79 of 87 (188 views)
In the Book.. [In reply to] Can't Post

"..Suddenly a sword flashed in its own light. BILBO
saw it go right through the Great Goblin as he stood dumbfounded
in the middle of his rage. He fell dead,and the Goblin
soldiers fled before the sword shreiking into the darkness."

So I'm guessing this allows the company a head start down
into the deep passages.
So maybe PJ will only have GG wounded and GG commands them to come back but this wound finally kills him.
This would allow Barry Humphrey more screentime.


Sep 20 2012, 6:00pm

Post #80 of 87 (178 views)
stone giants [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To
least wise that is what I see at 2:15 ish. Not really clear though, so it might just be my over-active imagination at work...

Simple, remember the reason why they were throwing rocks in the book?

They were throwing rocks at each other for a game, like a snowball fight. this guy was obviosuly hit by one.


Sep 20 2012, 6:18pm

Post #81 of 87 (184 views)
In the Book.. [In reply to] Can't Post

"...When he peeped out in the Lighning-flashes, he saw across the. Valley
the stone-giants were out, and were hurling rocks AT ONE ANOTHER (emphasis mine) for a game, and catching them, and tossing them down into the darkness where they smashed amount the trees far below, or splintered into bits with a bang..."

This is just a case of the company being in the wrong place at the Wrong time. I don't think they were intentionally aiming at the company...Too small for them to even be seen.

When in doubt
... consult your Book.


Sep 20 2012, 11:37pm

Post #82 of 87 (153 views)
I am always dumbfounded at how often this reasoning comes up [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, there are dragons and talking animals and such. But there is also real danger, real death, and real consequences. These are all established parts of a well-crafted sub-reality.

It is incredibly important to maintain internal consistency within the sub-reality of Middle Earth. What the Goblin King scene does is fly in the face of one of the core aspects of Middle Earth: its inhabitants experience real danger, real pain, real death, and the laws of physics are generally consistent with those of our Earth.

If a creature of that size can fall from a great height, and not threaten the lives of the dwarves at all, a viewer is led to believe: Is there any real, actual danger in this world? Can anyone really be hurt and die? Or is this a video game land, where one can resurrect himself as many times as he or she likes?

It kills suspension of disbelief in a way that mythical creatures, on their own, do not.

On top of that, the Goblin King's fall is preceded by a cliched joke which heralds the event! It's all a bit too much, way over the top, and it hurts the ability of an audience to accept this is a real story, worth watching and listening to.


Sep 21 2012, 12:30am

Post #83 of 87 (127 views)
Being miners of legend, perhaps dwarves hold up well [In reply to] Can't Post

under crushing weights? Perhaps they have a magical immunity to being squished? It's not as if people (or burrowing animals especially) never survive structure collapses in real life.

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Registered User

Sep 21 2012, 2:11am

Post #84 of 87 (137 views)
GG Death Scene/Fall [In reply to] Can't Post

I thought I would share what I think will happen. The only thing that would seem to make sense.

Gandalf kills the Great Goblin and saves the dwarves as in the book. The Dwarves collect their stuff and run while being chased by the goblins. As they run, chaos ensues and amongst the chaos, support beams in Goblin Town are destroyed. The Dwarves think they are home free, but the bridge they are crossing collapses and they all fall to the bottom. Thinking it is over, Bifur says his line from the trailer. The weight of the dead Great Goblin falls through the floor because of the weakened support beams under his throne, and he comes crashing down upon the dwarves.

Just what I think will happen.


Sep 21 2012, 4:43am

Post #85 of 87 (102 views)
Probably something like that, yeah [In reply to] Can't Post

And what narrative purpose does all that serve? IMO, it cheapens the story, while adding absolutely nothing to it.


Sep 21 2012, 5:13am

Post #86 of 87 (120 views)
This! [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To
And what narrative purpose does all that serve? IMO, it cheapens the story, while adding absolutely nothing to it.

I mean seriously... Imagine if Eowyn had of killed the Witch King then the head of the fell beast he was on's eye started blinking and everyone laughed Unsure

Moment killer!

Kangi Ska

Sep 21 2012, 1:27pm

Post #87 of 87 (154 views)
This is rely not a fair comparison.// [In reply to] Can't Post


Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

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