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TIME - April 8 & 9
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dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 13 2007, 12:40pm

Post #26 of 36 (20 views)
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It's starting to hit Frodo... [In reply to] Can't Post

...and he's in the denial stage: "Are you just guessing?" and his "When did you discover that?" interruption.

It's an encouraging thought to Gandalf, that Frodo was meant to have the Ring, but our home-loving, peaceful-life-loving Hobbit has begun to fear and grieve for what this means...


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And when Sam heard that he laughed aloud for shear delight, and he stood up and cried: 'O great glory and splendour! And all my wishes have come true!'"


Morwen
Rohan


Apr 13 2007, 4:01pm

Post #27 of 36 (20 views)
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Definitely [In reply to] Can't Post

Frodo has quite a ways to go before he grasps what all this means, and that his old life is gone forever. He has a long road ahead of him, emotionally as well as literally.

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I wish you could have been there
When she opened up the door
And looked me in the face
Like she never did before
I felt about as welcome
As a Wal-Mart Superstore--John Prine


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 14 2007, 8:45am

Post #28 of 36 (27 views)
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TIME - April 12 pt.3 [In reply to] Can't Post

Today(ish) in Middle-earth.


April 12, 3018 (S.R. 1418) (continued) pt. 3
1. Gandalf and Frodo at Bag End.
(from the appendices)
..."Frodo drew the Ring out of his pocket again and looked at it. It now appeared plain and smooth, without mark or device that he could see. The gold looked very fair and pure, and Frodo though how rich and beautiful was its colour, how perfect was its roundness. It was an admirable thing and altogether precious. When he took it out he had intended to fling it from him into the very hottest part of the fire. But he found now that he could not do so, not without a great struggle. He weighted the Ring in his hand, hesitating, and forcing himself to remember all that Gandalf had told him; and then with an effort of will he made a movement, as if to cast it away---but he found that he had put it back in his pocket.
...Gandalf laughed grimly. 'You see? Already you too, Frodo, cannot easily let it go, nor will to damage it. And I could not "make" you---except by force, which would break your mind.'
...'Your small fire, of course, would not melt even ordinary gold. This Ring has already passed through it unscathed, and even unheated. But there is no smith's forge in this Shire that could change it at all. Not even the anvils and furnaces of the Dwarves could do that. It has been said that dragon-fire could melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough; nor was there even any dragon, not even Ancalagon the black, who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for that was made by Sauron himself.
...'There is only one way: to find the Cracks of Doom in the depths of Orodruin, the Fire-mountain, and cast the Ring in there, if you really wish to destroy it, to put it beyond the grasp of the Enemy for ever.'
...'I do really wish to destroy it!' cried Frodo. 'Or, well, to have it destroyed. I am not made for perilous quests. I wish I had never seen the Ring! Why did it come to me? Why was I chosen?'
...'Such questions cannot be answered,' said Gandalf. 'You may be sure that it was not for any merit that others do not possess: not for power or wisdom, at any rate. But you have been chosen, and you must therefore use such strength and heart and wits as you have.'
...'But I have so little of any of these things! You are wise and powerful. Will you not take the Ring?'
...'No!' cried Gandalf, springing to his feet. 'With that power I should have power too great and terrible. And over me the Ring would gain a power still greater and more deadly.' His eyes flashed and his face was lit as by a fire within. 'Do not tempt me! For I do not wish to become like the Dark Lord himself. Yet the way of the Ring to my heart is by pity, pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me! I dare not take it, not even to keep it safe, unused. The wish to wield it would be too great for my strength. I shall have such need of it. Great perils lie before me.'
...He went to the window and drew aside the curtains and the shutters. Sunlight streamed back again into the room. Sam passed along the path outside whistling. 'And now,' said the wizard, turning back to Frodo, 'the decision lies with you. But I will always help you.' He laid his hand on Frodo's shoulder. 'I will help you bear this burden, as long as it is yours to bear. But we must do something, soon. The Enemy is moving.'

...There was a long silence. Gandalf sat down again and puffed at his pipe, as if lost in thought. His eyes seemed closed, but under the lids he was watching Frodo intently. Frodo gazed fixedly at the red embers on the hearth, until they filled all his vision, and he seemed to be looking down into profound wells of fire. He was thinking of the fabled Cracks of Doom and the terror of the Firey Mountain."



sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 14 2007, 1:18pm

Post #29 of 36 (16 views)
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"I am not made for perilous quests." [In reply to] Can't Post

This makes me think of Bilbo on his quest, constantly thinking of his safe hobbit-hole back home; he did not think he was made for that quest, but he was - what other Hobbit could have done what he did?

"But you have been chosen, and you must therefore use such strength and heart and wits as you have."..."But I have so little of any of these things!" Bilbo, too, had to find these things within himself. In strength, heart, wits, and simple Hobbit courage, Frodo is indeed Bilbo's true heir.

Has anyone ever tried to figure out what the Ring could have been made of, to make it so impervious to damage? Most like a combination of "heavy" metals, and what we mortals call "magic", and a certain Power.

Good recovery on Sam's part: I bet he scrambled to his feet quickly once he heard the curtains being drawn back, and prepped himself to put on a nonchalant walk!


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And when Sam heard that he laughed aloud for shear delight, and he stood up and cried: 'O great glory and splendour! And all my wishes have come true!'"


Morwen
Rohan


Apr 14 2007, 10:20pm

Post #30 of 36 (19 views)
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Gandalf [In reply to] Can't Post

Another thing I missed the first time around.

Quote

'No!' cried Gandalf, springing to his feet. 'With that power I should have power too great and terrible. And over me the Ring would gain a power still greater and more deadly.' His eyes flashed and his face was lit as by a fire within. 'Do not tempt me! For I do not wish to become like the Dark Lord himself. Yet the way of the Ring to my heart is by pity, pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me! I dare not take it, not even to keep it safe, unused. The wish to wield it would be too great for my strength. I shall have such need of it. Great perils lie before me.'



This mirrors the scene in Lorien, when Galadriel refuses the Ring. Frodo offers Gandalf the Ring freely, and he admits he desires it, but refuses it. Galadriel and Gandalf were put through the same test and both passed. It would have been easy for Gandalf to delude himself into taking the Ring, and claiming he was doing it for Frodo's sake, to relieve his little friend of the burden. I wonder what went through his mind at that moment, and how is decision to do the right thing affected him and the things that happened to him later on.

When I read this for the first time, I saw the situation only from Frodo's point of view, and his disappointment that the Ring could not simply be handed off to someone wiser and stronger. This is part of Frodo's path from denial to acceptance of the burden, but it is a turning point for Gandalf as well.

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I wish you could have been there
When she opened up the door
And looked me in the face
Like she never did before
I felt about as welcome
As a Wal-Mart Superstore--John Prine


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 12:00pm

Post #31 of 36 (16 views)
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TIME - April 12 continued [In reply to] Can't Post

April 12, 3018 (S.R. 1418) The Great Years


1. Gandalf reaches Hobbiton. pt. 4
(from the appendices)
..."'Well!' said Gandalf at last. 'What are you thinking about? Have you decided what to do?'
...'No!' answered Frodo, coming back to himself out of darkness, and finding to his surprise that it was not dark, and that out of the window he could see the sunlit garden. 'Or perhaps, yes. As far as I understand what you have said, I suppose I must keep the Ring and guard it, at least for the present, whatever it may do to me.'
...'Whatever it may do, it will be slow, slow to evil, if you keep it with that purpose,' said Gandalf.
...'I hope so,' said Frodo. 'But I hope that you may find some other better keeper soon. But in the meanwhile it seems that I am a danger, a danger to all that live near me. I cannot keep the Ring and stay here. I ought to leave Bag End, leave the Shire, leave everything and go away.' He sighed.
...'I should like to save the Shire, if I could---though there have been times when I thought the inhabitants too stupid and dull for words, and have felt that an earthquake or an invasion of dragons might be good for them. But I don't feel like that now. I feel that as long as the Shire lies behind, safe and comfortable, I shall find wandering more bearable: I shall know that somewhere there is a firm foothold, even if my feet cannot stand there again.
...'Of course, I have sometimes thought of going away, but I imagined that as a kind of holiday, a series of adventures like Bilbo's or better, ending in peace. But this would mean exile, a flight from danger into danger, drawing it after me. And I suppose I must go alone, if I am to do that and save the Shire. But I feel very small, and very uprooted, and well---desperate. The Enemy is so strong and terrible.'
...He did not tell Gandalf, but as he was speaking a great desire to follow Bilbo flamed up in his heart---to follow Bilbo, and even perhaps to find him again. It was so strong that it overcame his fear: he could almost have run out there and then down the road without his hat, as Bilbo had done on a similar morning long ago. ...'My dear Frodo!' exclaimed Gandalf. 'Hobbits really are amazing creatures, as I have said before. You can learn all that there is to know about their ways in a month, and yet after a hundred years they can still surprise you at a pinch. I hardly expected to get such an answer, not even from you. But Bilbo made no mistake in choosing his heir, though he little thought how important it would prove. I am afraid you are right. The Ring will not be able to stay hidden in the Shire much longer; and for your own sake, as well as for others, you will have to go, and leave the name of Baggins behind you. That name will not be safe to have, outside the Shire or in the Wild."


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists

(This post was edited by grammaboodawg on Apr 15 2007, 12:01pm)


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 12:07pm

Post #32 of 36 (14 views)
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I've wondered about hte Ring [In reply to] Can't Post

and I don't think that other than molten lava, which is rock and not metal, there were no metals other than Mithril that were so impervious to damage... so I think the Ring was alive with Sauron's "magic" or power. He did put himself inot the Ring, so I've always thought of it as literally an extension of himself. When the Ring left Gollum, Sauron began to increase in power and re-establish himself. They both slept while the Ring was lost... which also tells me that Sauron and the Ring are (as Gandalf says) one.

My heart aches for Frodo. Especially now that we know what he endures... I love him all the more.


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 12:12pm

Post #33 of 36 (11 views)
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Oh me too! [In reply to] Can't Post

But Gandalf did have his little "Galadie" moment, even though it was a split second... "His eyes flashed and his face was lit as by a fire within." The power is right there... a hint of what he could become. I'm sure Frodo saw that, but was so amazed to see Gandalf actually scared of something that it probably didn't register.

You got my brain going on this... hmmmmmm.................... ;)



sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 12:23pm

Post #34 of 36 (11 views)
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I love Gandalf's reaction [In reply to] Can't Post

to Frodo's accusation... 'I knew much and I have learned much,' he answered. 'But I am not going to give an account of all my doings to you.' There's the fiesta Gandalf that puts the hobbit in his place while only hinting at the extent of his doing in Middle-earth. I still chuckle whenever I read Gandalf-moments like this!

I've tried to imagine what I would do if I realized my life had been chosen to be the hope of salvation for my home, my land, my world... and that I still had the choice as to whether I wanted to follow that call or not. I found myself feeling a lot like Frodo. You know you have to, but...

Gandalf is so careful to only share the history and the facts, but still waits for Frodo to process, understand, react and accept. He never manipulates through guilt or judgment.


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 15 2007, 12:57pm

Post #35 of 36 (16 views)
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There is just so much in this one section... [In reply to] Can't Post

Tolkien once wrote that he had considered every word that he'd written in LotR, and here is a prime example of that!

What do we find out? That the Ring is "slow to evil" if it's kept unused and guarded; Frodo's desire for something to "shake up" the Shire has diffused, now that the real danger is at hand - and his realization that he himself poses the greatest threat; the awakening of his desire to follow Bilbo. And that wonderful line: "I shall know that somewhere there is a firm foothold, even if my feet cannot stand there again." And we begin to understand the full meaning of this flight, of this sacrifice.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And when Sam heard that he laughed aloud for shear delight, and he stood up and cried: 'O great glory and splendour! And all my wishes have come true!'"


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 16 2007, 10:08am

Post #36 of 36 (17 views)
Shortcut
*****MODS UP****** *sigh* // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists

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