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**Spoilers & Theory** The Stranger

Victariongreyjoy
Lorien


Oct 2, 12:32pm

Post #1 of 18 (621 views)
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**Spoilers & Theory** The Stranger Can't Post

Even though the majority seems to think Halbrand is the dark lord himself, there is a big possibility the showrunners are playing with us and want us to think that. But in reality, he is red herring and the Stranger is Sauron. Let me lay out a couple of evidences that he is:

-Sauron theme playing when he does creepy things.

-All his magic causes harm around him. That bad things happen constantly around him.

-The fires of his meteor impact are not hot (just as Galadriel's company's torches bore no heat while in the presence of evil).

-The Strange whispers sound when he does shady/creepy things, almost like the One Ring whispering to those who bear it.

The symbol of the flaming eye of Sauron that the meteor impact with the Stranger as the pupil that the show reveals to us.

-Waldreg and others know the meteor is a sign of Sauron's return.

Why he arrived as a meteor?
Remember in last episode and the first episode, he was meddling with something in the Forodwaith fortress? Maybe that experiment went totally whack, created a chain reaction that lead him to lose his memory and reduced powers. The experiment might something similar the Valar did to Gandalf when he returned as Gandalf the White. Since Sauron is not a Ainur, it went totally bust and he managed only to transform himself into a meteorite.


(This post was edited by Victariongreyjoy on Oct 2, 12:40pm)


UtumnoSkirmish
The Shire


Oct 2, 2:52pm

Post #2 of 18 (560 views)
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That has been my preference [In reply to] Can't Post

Halbrand is way up in the polls but I'm holding out hope for a late rally from The Stranger. Looking at the evidence, my theory is that it would be more accurate to say that he is Mairon, Sauron's original Ainu form (Sauron was an Ainur- Valar and Maiar are orders of Ainur).

He's in a weakened state right now because he was "killed" by Adar. The cultists are on a mission to find him and nurse him back to good health. He arrived at the appointed time, as they told their wide network of operatives he would (including Waldreg)

Halbrand has all the classic signs of a red herring. A bunch of suspicious things he says or does. Double meanings and innuendoes.

The evidence is with The Stranger. Besides the things you mentioned, I would add that his hand and arm turned black as soon as he used magic. When he used more magic to apply ice to the arm, he seemed to lose control, lost in the lust of exercising power. At the most intense moment, we get a flashback to his touchdown site, which is clearly meant to represent The Eye of Sauron.

The implication is that the use of magic reveals his true nature.

Here's a quote from David Weyman on his character:

“As much as we don’t know about him, I think what we’re going to do – if we can stay with him – is to see that the way that he impacts communities around him is going to be dramatic. We are going to learn and learn and learn, and finding out what exactly is going on might not be so quick.”

Quote


(This post was edited by UtumnoSkirmish on Oct 2, 2:55pm)


dormouse
Half-elven


Oct 2, 3:20pm

Post #3 of 18 (546 views)
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It sounds reasonable.... [In reply to] Can't Post

.... and I don't think Halbrand is Sauron.
But I'm finding it hard to picture Sauron pushing a cart for a family of proto-hobbits, or uttering 'friend' as his first intelligible word. He still seems more Gandalf to me (and Gandalf was of the same order as Sauron, and would also be able to use magic - and in his present state of confusion might find it hard to control). And what would Sauron be doing rescuing Nori from wolves, or having a conscience about dead fireflies. Why would he care? So far his impact on the harfoot community seems to be positive.

For still there are so many things
that I have never seen:
in every wood and every spring
there is a different green. . .


AshNazg
Gondor


Oct 2, 3:47pm

Post #4 of 18 (545 views)
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I think he’s Saruman the Grey [In reply to] Can't Post

Maybe he will die before they reveal his identity and then he will be sent back as Saruman the White, similar to how Gandalf died and came back.

But I think they’ll explore a colour hierarchy for the wizards in some way. Maybe he’s Saruman the Brown.. I dunno. But that’s my theory.

Saruman makes sense because there is so much to explore with his character getting a Palantir and rising to power, occupying Isengard. I imagine ents will help him in some way too, so we see Saruman being raised by Harfoots and ents - species that he will betray and will ultimately destroy him in the end.

I don’t like the Blue Wizard idea because they’re just irrelevant characters and I’m pretty sure Amazon doesn’t even have the rights to them? Sauron could be interesting too though, I’m not against that.


Lieutenant of Dol Guldur
Gondor


Oct 2, 5:11pm

Post #5 of 18 (506 views)
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The Blue Wizards aren't irrelevant at all... [In reply to] Can't Post

... only because they left the West.

Both versions of their story written by Tolkien are amazing. In the first one they've failed and became leaders of secret magic cults in the East and in the other one they initiated rebellions and civil wars among the different tribes and peoples of Rhûn and Harad and therefore helped the Men of the West to not get overrun by the far superior numbers of Easterlings and Haradrim.

I think both versions would work in the show and it would be cool if the writers used both with the Stranger being the second one of the two Blue Wizards to arrive in Middle-earth while his fellow blue brother came a little earlier and already started a cult in the East (the Mystics maybe?). The Stranger has to find and bring the other one back to the light and together they try to undermine Saurons plans in the Far East of Middle-earth as well as in the South. Through them we could finally discover the cities and people of Rhûn and Harad.

"There is only one Lord of the Ring, only one who can bend it to his will. And he does not share power."


Hopefull Harfoot
Rivendell


Oct 2, 5:14pm

Post #6 of 18 (506 views)
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I was convinced The Stranger was Olorin , but you guys have me wondering [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, you could read certain things differently, and the writers seem to really enjoy messing with people's minds (which I am not really against as it is making it very interesting).

The idea that the Stranger is Saruman, that Ashnazg mentioned, is something I never considered and intriguing


50th year anniversary since I first read The Lord of the Rings

(This post was edited by Hopefull Harfoot on Oct 2, 5:15pm)


UtumnoSkirmish
The Shire


Oct 2, 9:30pm

Post #7 of 18 (433 views)
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In his beginning [In reply to] Can't Post

No matter who The Stranger is, I think it's clear that he suffers from some sort of amnesia. And it's true that, when viewed in isolation, this indicates the Istari (Tolkien wrote a little passage once saying that they would need to relearn things once they arrived. Unfinished Tales).

However, this Stranger theory says that based on what we've seen so far, they are instead using the idea to explore the concept that "nothing is evil in its beginning." By the way, as we know that is a quote from Gandalf at the Council of Elrond, and his very next sentence is "Even Sauron was not so."

The justification for why he is like this is that Adar "split him open." Through his own or his agents use of dark magic he was able to schedule a return, but only at the cost of coming back in this state. Or perhaps he came back just by virtue of being a Maia. The cultists are rushing to bring him back for real. Only then will "Sauron" appear in the show. At the moment he is only "inside" The Stranger. That's why we see the effect of evil all around him, things dropping dead around him. The Necromancer. I even think Sauron's spirit is influencing the Harfoots to become evil.

There is also the idea in Unfinished Tales that Annatar's deception anticipated the Istari. The Stranger is the character in the position to pull it off.


InTheChair
Rohan


Oct 2, 9:37pm

Post #8 of 18 (430 views)
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I suppose that still both [In reply to] Can't Post

could be Sauron,

Both Halbrand and the Stranger I mean


Archestratie
Rohan


Oct 2, 10:37pm

Post #9 of 18 (405 views)
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Well [In reply to] Can't Post

I just saw an interesting theory that The Stranger is Tom Bombadil. Discuss.

My Low-Magic Fantasy Novel on eBook/hardback: The Huntsman and the She-Wolf

The Huntsman and the She-Wolf on audio Book.


Annael
Immortal


Oct 2, 11:43pm

Post #10 of 18 (388 views)
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I've heard that one too but [In reply to] Can't Post

Bombadil was in Middle-earth before anyone else. Or anything. He says he remembers "the first raindrop and the first acorn."

I am a dreamer of words, of written words.
-- Gaston Bachelard

* * * * * * * * * *

NARF and member of Deplorable Cultus since 1967


AshNazg
Gondor


Oct 2, 11:55pm

Post #11 of 18 (384 views)
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What about the Dweller? [In reply to] Can't Post

I’m thinking Khamúl


Eruonen
Valinor


Oct 3, 1:12am

Post #12 of 18 (357 views)
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A bit like an Istari dojo [In reply to] Can't Post

"Curumo" aka Saruman was a Maia of Aulë" Hmm...... "Aulë was a Vala and one of the Aratar, also known as the the Smith and Smith of the Valar, concerned with rock, metal, nature of substances and works of craft."


Hopefull Harfoot
Rivendell


Oct 3, 2:07am

Post #13 of 18 (338 views)
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I've come to the conclusion The Stranger is not Sauron. [In reply to] Can't Post

We are purposely being given false leads, and things may not be what they seem as Halbrand says early on.

And I have a theory that the truth may be discerned by examining the eyes of the actors. My findings:

The Stranger is powerful but gentle

Halbrand is human to the core

Adar is a psychotic elf genuinely concerned for his monsterous kids.

So here is my current favorite for Sauron and her two most powerful lieutenants: The Dweller, and The Ascetic and The Nomad, who are Blue wizards. These are not the eyes of ordinary (human) women. They are haughty and confident in great power. The Dweller's are also as dark as night and frightening as hell.




50th year anniversary since I first read The Lord of the Rings


Barliman's Beer
Registered User

Oct 3, 7:22pm

Post #14 of 18 (208 views)
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Snap! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I think both versions would work in the show and it would be cool if the writers used both with the Stranger being the second one of the two Blue Wizards to arrive in Middle-earth while his fellow blue brother came a little earlier and already started a cult in the East (the Mystics maybe?). The Stranger has to find and bring the other one back to the light and together they try to undermine Saurons plans in the Far East of Middle-earth as well as in the South. Through them we could finally discover the cities and people of Rhûn and Harad.


I posted this exact theory a few days ago on the PPP Facebook group and Reddit Wink

I'd love it to be true, and would be even more excited if they used the correct names for them. I'm not fussed which combo they use, Alatar and Pallando or Romestamo and Morinehtar, both are fine by me.


UtumnoSkirmish
The Shire


Oct 5, 1:31pm

Post #15 of 18 (114 views)
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Second Age stuff [In reply to] Can't Post

https://www.express.co.uk/...wer-Stranger-Gandalf

The article speculates that The Stranger is Gandalf. However, near the end Daniel Weyman (The Stranger) shares:


Quote
“What I’m really excited about is people who know this material, because obviously, this is going to be Second Age stuff,” he told Express.co.uk.

“Nobody’s seen this on screen before. People might know the story from earlier books, but when they watch this, both the newcomers and the people who know it, they’re going to find a huge amount of mystery and enigma; the shadow is dark at times.


This seems suggestive of another direction. We'll see.


jlj93byu
Rivendell


Oct 5, 2:51pm

Post #16 of 18 (98 views)
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Sounds like NOT Gandalf [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
https://www.express.co.uk/...wer-Stranger-Gandalf

The article speculates that The Stranger is Gandalf. However, near the end Daniel Weyman (The Stranger) shares:


Quote
“What I’m really excited about is people who know this material, because obviously, this is going to be Second Age stuff,” he told Express.co.uk.

“Nobody’s seen this on screen before. People might know the story from earlier books, but when they watch this, both the newcomers and the people who know it, they’re going to find a huge amount of mystery and enigma; the shadow is dark at times.


This seems suggestive of another direction. We'll see.


Agreed. The fact that he specifically says it is Second Age stuff is telling, because Gandalf is solidly only Third Age material. Even in Tolkien's differing accounts of the arrival of the Istari, in every one Gandalf always arrives in the Third Age. Plus his comments about not having seen it on screen, and it's from earlier books...both those comments are pretty much the opposite of Gandalf.


Narvi
Lorien

Oct 5, 3:01pm

Post #17 of 18 (97 views)
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Opposite of Gandalf [In reply to] Can't Post

but not of Olorin....


dormouse
Half-elven


Oct 5, 3:18pm

Post #18 of 18 (91 views)
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Never read The Express.... [In reply to] Can't Post

...unless you have your salt cellar handy! Reading the whole article I'd say they're telling us precisely nothing - which is what you'd expect at this stage.

For still there are so many things
that I have never seen:
in every wood and every spring
there is a different green. . .

 
 

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