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So i saw this on Reddit, what do you guys think?

DuBekar
Rivendell


Jan 25, 6:34pm

Post #1 of 15 (1307 views)
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So i saw this on Reddit, what do you guys think? Can't Post

"The rumours about Hobbits could be misleading/a misunderstanding. Sir Lenny Henry, a British comedian, said, that he will portray a "Hobbit" in the show. The word "Hobbit" could be more like a directional advice("like a Hobbit"), it's a known term for many people. Tolkien describes a race of men called Dr˙edain, around four feet tall, also living on N˙menor in the Second Age. They later migrated to Middle-Earth, more specifically to the White Mountains, and were hunted by "tall Men from the East"."

I think this could be a valid theory

" Why, O people of Noldor! FŰanor cried. Why should we longer serve the jealous Valar, who cannot keep us nor even their own realm secure from their enemy? And though he be now their foe, are not they and he of one kin? Vengence calls me hence, but even were it otherwise I would not dwell longer in the same land with the kin of my father's slayer and of the thief of treasure. Yet i am not the only valiant in this valiant people. And have ye not all lost your King? And what else have ye not lost, cooped here in a narrow land between the mountains and the sea? Here once was light, that the Valar begrudged to middle-earth, but now dark levels all. Shall we mourn here deedless forever, a shadow-folk, mist-haunting, dropping vain tears in the thankless sea? Or shall we return to our home? In cuiviŔnen sweet ran the waters under uncloaded stars, and wide lands lay about, where a free people might walk. There they lie still and await us who in out folly forsook them. Come away! Let the cowards keep this city!"


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 26, 4:34am

Post #2 of 15 (1193 views)
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Lenny was pretty specific. [In reply to] Can't Post

Lenny Henry went as far as to say he was playing a Harfoot hobbit. Of course there's still the possibility that he's been trolling the fandom.

#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations


Chen G.
Gondor

Jan 26, 1:27pm

Post #3 of 15 (1120 views)
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Used to think that was the case [In reply to] Can't Post

I used to think Lenny Henry was joking around, precisely because he was so specific. You'd expect him not to start throwing very specific, arcane terms like "Harfoot" and just say Hobbit, which just made it seem like he was riffing off of TORn's spy report which specifically mentions "Harfoots." My thinking was he came across it (or it was brought to his attention, no matter), thought it hysterical and then decided to roll with it for ordures and giggles, as it were. I mean, he is a comedian. Sure, the tone of his voice sounded sincere, but in a way that will have the prank all the funnier.

I no longer believe that's the case. I want to believe it is, and I guess in some sense it could be, but I doubt it. Uncle Iorlas himself told us that Amazon wanted Hobbits in the show all along, an there are quite a few characters in the cast whom we believe are playing some of them.


(This post was edited by Chen G. on Jan 26, 1:28pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 26, 2:38pm

Post #4 of 15 (1094 views)
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You may well be right. [In reply to] Can't Post

I am not accusing Sir Lenny Henry of actually lying, but part of me still hopes that he's pulling our legs. I'd be perfectly fine with learning that Henry is playing a Dr˙, one of the Dr˙edain (that readers of The Lord of the Rings know better as the Woses).



#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Jan 26, 2:43pm)


InTheChair
Rohan

Jan 26, 7:36pm

Post #5 of 15 (1030 views)
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Henry also claimed [In reply to] Can't Post

we're black, Asian and brown, even Maori types

Which I can see them try with Hobbits, but feels more doubtful if they're meant to be the more mysterious Druedain.

I suppose he could be trolling, but until confirmed otherwise I think I'll keep expecting him to play a Hobbit.


DuBekar
Rivendell


Jan 26, 10:42pm

Post #6 of 15 (989 views)
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Hobbits in second age doesn't feel right [In reply to] Can't Post

I hope this is the case.

Having Hobbits in the second age feels off for me.

I will ofc not hate the show if that would be the case and it is executed well.. but it will still feel off

" Why, O people of Noldor! FŰanor cried. Why should we longer serve the jealous Valar, who cannot keep us nor even their own realm secure from their enemy? And though he be now their foe, are not they and he of one kin? Vengence calls me hence, but even were it otherwise I would not dwell longer in the same land with the kin of my father's slayer and of the thief of treasure. Yet i am not the only valiant in this valiant people. And have ye not all lost your King? And what else have ye not lost, cooped here in a narrow land between the mountains and the sea? Here once was light, that the Valar begrudged to middle-earth, but now dark levels all. Shall we mourn here deedless forever, a shadow-folk, mist-haunting, dropping vain tears in the thankless sea? Or shall we return to our home? In cuiviŔnen sweet ran the waters under uncloaded stars, and wide lands lay about, where a free people might walk. There they lie still and await us who in out folly forsook them. Come away! Let the cowards keep this city!"


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 27, 2:26pm

Post #7 of 15 (915 views)
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That doesn't really work though. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Henry also claimed

we're black, Asian and brown, even Maori types

Which I can see them try with Hobbits, but feels more doubtful if they're meant to be the more mysterious Druedain.

I suppose he could be trolling, but until confirmed otherwise I think I'll keep expecting him to play a Hobbit.


Harfoots represent a specific type of Hobbit that Tolkien describes in some detail. The diversity that Sir Lenny Henry suggests is just not there.

#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations


VoronwŰ_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jan 29, 9:53pm

Post #8 of 15 (750 views)
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"The diversity that Sir Lenny Henry suggests is just not there." [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree it is not really there in what Tolkien wrote, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is there in the show.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

The Hall of Fire


Archestratie
Lorien


Jan 30, 12:11am

Post #9 of 15 (731 views)
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Yeah [In reply to] Can't Post

The whole hobbit scene could be related to a flashback/flashforward scene anyway. It's hard to guess atm.

My Low-Magic Fantasy Novel on eBook/hardback: The Huntsman and the She-Wolf

The Huntsman and the She-Wolf on audio Book.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 30, 1:54am

Post #10 of 15 (727 views)
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Perhaps... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I agree it is not really there in what Tolkien wrote, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is there in the show.


....yes, but that's a different issue.

#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations


VoronwŰ_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jan 30, 2:47pm

Post #11 of 15 (662 views)
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Is it? [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
that's a different issue.


Yes and no. Certainly what Tolkien wrote and what the show will portray are different issues, but as to what Sir Lenny Henry said and what it will mean for the show, it is obviously relevant. What he said was:


Quote
I'm a black hobbit, it's brilliant, and what's notable about this run of the books, its a prequel to the age that we've seen in the films, its about the early days of the Shire and Tolkien's environment, so we're an indigenous population of Harfoots, we're hobbits but we're called Harfoots, we're multi-cultural, we're a tribe not a race, so we're black, asian and brown, even Maori types within it. It's a brand new set of adventures that seed some of the origins of different characters and it's going to take at least ten years to tell the story. Because it's based on the Silmarillion which was almost like a cheat sheet for what happens next in this world in the second and third ages.


It's fairly obvious from that quote that Sir Lenny doesn't really know what Tolkien actually wrote, particularly given his statement about The Silmarillion. So either he was completely goofing (which I don't believe to be the case) or he was providing information based on what he was told by the writers/showrunners, not based on actually reading Tolkien's work.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

The Hall of Fire


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 30, 9:54pm

Post #12 of 15 (599 views)
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Amazon and The Silmarillion [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

Quote
I'm a black hobbit, it's brilliant, and what's notable about this run of the books, its a prequel to the age that we've seen in the films, its about the early days of the Shire and Tolkien's environment, so we're an indigenous population of Harfoots, we're hobbits but we're called Harfoots, we're multi-cultural, we're a tribe not a race, so we're black, asian and brown, even Maori types within it. It's a brand new set of adventures that seed some of the origins of different characters and it's going to take at least ten years to tell the story. Because it's based on the Silmarillion which was almost like a cheat sheet for what happens next in this world in the second and third ages.


It's fairly obvious from that quote that Sir Lenny doesn't really know what Tolkien actually wrote, particularly given his statement about The Silmarillion. So either he was completely goofing (which I don't believe to be the case) or he was providing information based on what he was told by the writers/showrunners, not based on actually reading Tolkien's work.


Well, we know that the primary source that Amazon Prime is drawing from is The Lord of the Rings and its appendices. However, they seem to also have access to parts of both Unfinished Tales and The Silmarillion (in particular in the latter case: "Akallabeth" and "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age"). Granted, describing Harfoots as "multi-cultural" is a statement being pulled out of somebody's rear-end.

#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations


VoronwŰ_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jan 30, 10:38pm

Post #13 of 15 (592 views)
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No arguments there [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree that it seems likely that the showrunners have been granted some as yet undefined permission for limited use of material from the published Silmarillion, as well as Unfinished Tales. My point, which you also reiterate, is that Sir Lenny's invocation of The Silmarillion as somehow giving credence to the idea of multi-cultural Harfoots is nonsense.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

The Hall of Fire


Chen G.
Gondor

Jan 31, 8:39am

Post #14 of 15 (529 views)
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Not knowing Tolkien [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
It's fairly obvious from that quote that Sir Lenny doesn't really know what Tolkien actually wrote, particularly given his statement about The Silmarillion.


Its not necessarily paramount for an actor to know their Tolkien very well to play their parts.

Elijah Wood had confessed that he hadn't read The Lord of the Rings to this day. Sean Astin at the time didn't read any of Tolkien's writings and he did read them for the part, he admits to have skimmed through it looking for clues to his character, rather than immersing himself in the writing. Ian McKellen had only read The Hobbit before he was offered the part.

Liv Tyler hadn't read the books, and I believe Cate Blanchet's knowledge of Tolkien is a fairly passing one.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 31, 2:35pm

Post #15 of 15 (491 views)
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Sir Lenny's Comments [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

In Reply To
It's fairly obvious from that quote that Sir Lenny doesn't really know what Tolkien actually wrote, particularly given his statement about The Silmarillion.


Its not necessarily paramount for an actor to know their Tolkien very well to play their parts.
)
Elijah Wood had confessed that he hadn't read The Lord of the Rings to this day. Sean Astin at the time didn't read any of Tolkien's writings and he did read them for the part, he admits to have skimmed through it looking for clues to his character, rather than immersing himself in the writing. Ian McKellen had only read The Hobbit before he was offered the part.

Liv Tyler hadn't read the books, and I believe Cate Blanchet's knowledge of Tolkien is a fairly passing one.


My objection (which I'm guessing that I share with VoronwŰ) is that Sir Lenny Henry seems to be speaking with a presumption of authority that he does not possess. He's offering an unfounded opinion as though it's a firm fact.

#FidelityToTolkien
#ChallengeExpectations

 
 

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