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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Reading Room:
Arwens song of Valinor.

Hamfast Gamgee
Grey Havens

Sep 1, 7:39am

Post #1 of 6 (672 views)
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Arwens song of Valinor. Can't Post

After the Ring has been destroyed and Frodo has spend a few weeks relaxing in Minas Tirith he decides that it is time to depart and goes to tell Aragorn of this. Whilst Frodo sees him, Arwen is also there and is singing a song of Valinor. My question is what song? What is she singing about? Strange thing is that she has never actually been to Valinor although she does do a good impression of been there.


Omnigeek
Lorien


Sep 2, 3:44pm

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I don't know why you think it was strange [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
After the Ring has been destroyed and Frodo has spend a few weeks relaxing in Minas Tirith he decides that it is time to depart and goes to tell Aragorn of this. Whilst Frodo sees him, Arwen is also there and is singing a song of Valinor. My question is what song? What is she singing about? Strange thing is that she has never actually been to Valinor although she does do a good impression of been there.


I don't know the song in particular but I don't know why you think it's strange that she sings a song of Valinor despite never having been there. Songs have been written and sung about things we've never seen, places we've never been, for millenia. The Elves seem to have an excellent sense of documented and oral histories so I don't find it strange at all for Arwen to be singing about Valinor on occasion -- especially knowing that the Elves are eventually migrating back there.


InTheChair
Lorien

Sep 2, 7:35pm

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Unknown [In reply to] Can't Post

It probably does not matter which song, as it would be one of many.

She is singing about a place, a sort of paradise, to where she might have gone, but has now given up. (Unless she can go there before she dies and leaves the circles of the world?) Would this be lost on Frodo or not?


the 13th warrior
Rivendell


Sep 5, 7:10am

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Valinor not an option... [In reply to] Can't Post

hello ITC, i believe her choice to stay in middle earth was irrevocable--she called it, the choice of Luthien, bitter and sweet. the choice bound her here. there was literally no place for her on a ship or in the valinor realm as frodo had taken her place. from rotk appendices, tale of arwen, aragorn,he says while dying try and return to valinor, but she says, "that choice is long over. there is now no ship that would bear me hence. and i must indeed abide the doom of men." so once she pledged herself to aragorn in lorien on the hill cerin amroth, her fate was sealed. elrond knew it, why he demanded that aragorn be king of gondor and arnor, so his daughter would have given up her immortality for the greatest ruler and even still he predicted she might find death a bitter sad fate. why she was fine character, noble and resolute in her spirit & love and in the end understanding what is mortal and what is immortal in deep personal profound way.

The 13th Warrior -- Left Field Caliphate


From the scroll rooms of Gondor, admiring Arwen Undomiel and her sacrifice, encouragement of aragorn that helped save middle earth....


CMackintosh
Bree

Sep 5, 8:11am

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contexts [In reply to] Can't Post


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In Reply To
After the Ring has been destroyed and Frodo has spend a few weeks relaxing in Minas Tirith he decides that it is time to depart and goes to tell Aragorn of this. Whilst Frodo sees him, Arwen is also there and is singing a song of Valinor. My question is what song? What is she singing about? Strange thing is that she has never actually been to Valinor although she does do a good impression of been there.


I don't know the song in particular but I don't know why you think it's strange that she sings a song of Valinor despite never having been there. Songs have been written and sung about things we've never seen, places we've never been, for millenia. The Elves seem to have an excellent sense of documented and oral histories so I don't find it strange at all for Arwen to be singing about Valinor on occasion -- especially knowing that the Elves are eventually migrating back there.

She's got a number of teachers in such songs. Consider her grandmother, the idomitable Galadriel, who probably taught her as many songs of Valinor as she remembered. Then you have her father Elrond, who while never having gone to Valinor, was raised amongst the exiles of Gondolin, and whose grandfather was Turgon, King of Gondolin, and forceably fostered by Maglor, one of the greatest singers of the Ngoldorin. So I think he would've learnt a fair few from the Gondolin exiles, and even more from Maglor, who took pity on him and Elros and came to love them in his own fashion after a while.

And then you have Glorfindel, who was permitted to return to Middle Earth after spending the Second Age recuperating from his death fighting the Balrog during the fall of Gondolin. And so would've had a treasury of songs dating from pre-First Age and a pile of new ones from the Second Age.

I think she would've been spoiled for choice. (As far as singing songs about places we've never been to, I've sung about Jerusalem, and never been there, London, and never been there, New York NY, and never been there, Louisiana and never been there, etc. Standard practice.)


Hamfast Gamgee
Grey Havens

Sep 6, 6:49am

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Mind if you read the sub-text [In reply to] Can't Post

At the end of Lotr in the appendixes, does she regret her choice?

 
 

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