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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Middle-earth TV Series Discussion:
EXCLUSIVE: Official Show Synopsis for Amazon's Lord of the Rings Series
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Altaira
Superuser


Jan 13, 3:02am

Post #1 of 39 (1429 views)
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EXCLUSIVE: Official Show Synopsis for Amazon's Lord of the Rings Series Can't Post

As announced on TORn Tuesdays tonight (watch here), and posted on the Home Page here, TORn happened upon the official synopsis of the new Amazon series and were granted an exclusive to release it tonight!

Together with the maps (also in the Home Page story), the synopsis helps us hone in on places we suspected might be in the series, as well as characters (Annatar/Sauron). Read it below, and hopefully look for more frequent releases (and/or leaks) in the future!



Quote
Amazon Studios’ forthcoming series brings to screens for the very first time the heroic legends of the fabled Second Age of Middle-earth’s history. This epic drama is set thousands of years before the events of J.R.R. Tolkien’s The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings, and will take viewers back to an era in which great powers were forged, kingdoms rose to glory and fell to ruin, unlikely heroes were tested, hope hung by the finest of threads, and the greatest villain that ever flowed from Tolkien’s pen threatened to cover all the world in darkness. Beginning in a time of relative peace, the series follows an ensemble cast of characters, both familiar and new, as they confront the long-feared re-emergence of evil to Middle-earth. From the darkest depths of the Misty Mountains, to the majestic forests of the elf-capital of Lindon, to the breathtaking island kingdom of Númenor, to the furthest reaches of the map, these kingdoms and characters will carve out legacies that live on long after they are gone.



Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





(This post was edited by Altaira on Jan 13, 3:04am)


Ataahua
Superuser


Jan 13, 3:44am

Post #2 of 39 (1385 views)
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Y'know what I'm most buzzed about? [In reply to] Can't Post

Moria. There's no reason why we couldn't see Moria at its height.

And just because of the timeline, we could also see the corruption of the northern ruler who became the Witch-king of Angmar - which, I'll be honest, is the story that most intrigues me from the Second Age. But whether we'll get to see it or not is guesswork.

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Fantasy novel - The Arcanist's Tattoo

My LOTR fan-fiction


(This post was edited by Ataahua on Jan 13, 3:46am)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jan 13, 3:47am

Post #3 of 39 (1377 views)
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Exciting! [In reply to] Can't Post

I read that TORn crashed earlier; THAT hasn't happened in a while!

The announcement pretty much confirms the show's setting as the middle of the Second Age. I'm still not sure that we'll see a huge time shift that takes us to the Last Alliance of Elves and Men, much less beyond it, though the description suggests that possibility.

"...[To] the furthest reaches of the map..." suggests that the show will indeed introduce us to such regions as Harad and maybe Rhûn and again raises the possibility of bringing the Blue Wizards into the series. And "the depths of the Misty Mountains" makes it pretty clear that the Dwarves of Khazad-dûm will have a part to play in the show.

#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity


entmaiden
Forum Admin


Jan 13, 3:50am

Post #4 of 39 (1376 views)
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This is so exciting! [In reply to] Can't Post

I love how Amazon is just giving us little bits - enough to talk about, but leaving us wanting more. I can't wait to see the next info release.
And huge Congratulations to TORn for the exclusive!


Altaira
Superuser


Wed, 7:23am

Post #5 of 39 (1314 views)
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I agree - Moria for sure [In reply to] Can't Post

Given that the rings of power were forged in Eregion which was Moria's neighbor, and the Elves of Eregion traded with Moria, I can't imagine not including that in the story somehow. Same with the Witch-King & other Nazgul, although at what point in the 2nd age would that come in? Maybe a future season?

My personal hope for something maybe in an earlier season is the story of Alderion & Erendis. Aldarion's voyages 'rediscovering' the lands where LOTR took place have as much effect if not more on those lands than on Numenor.

Next I'd like to see 1) cast in context not only with who they play but with how their character fits in, and where, and 2) more news forthcoming on what stages of production they're in - e.g., editing, scoring, cgi.


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





Altaira
Superuser


Wed, 7:32am

Post #6 of 39 (1315 views)
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Furthest reaches - east or west? [In reply to] Can't Post

I think you're spot on that we'll be venturing into those eastern regions Amazon showed on their teaser maps, and what better way to do that than with the Blue Wizards?

It occurred to me that they'll eventually need to provide an explanation as to why the lands to the est of Numenor are off limits to mortals. Maybe not a major story-line, but to get a glimpse of the undying lands would be very cool.

And, yes, TORn crashing does bring back fond memories in a way, doesn't it?Laugh


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





(This post was edited by Altaira on Wed, 7:34am)


kzer_za
Lorien

Wed, 1:49pm

Post #7 of 39 (1208 views)
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That was the part that stuck out ot me most [In reply to] Can't Post

The rest is more or less expected and still leaves a lot in the air (though an exciting scoop nonetheless). I'm leaning toward Harad right now as I don't think they will want to show Valinor very much at this point - at most a couple of teases, like in a prologue. Then a little more around the downfall if we get there. Also diversity is a big topic nowadays and a bigger role for Harad would be a natural way to beef it up. There isn't much to work on but Tolkien's late revision to the blue wizards does give a starting point.


One minor correction to the article: "Numenor, heretofore unmentioned in film adaptations" - Numenor is mentioned at least twice in the LotR trilogy, and one is in the theatrical even. The Eowyn stew scene and Elrond's "the blood of Numenor all but spent." There might be more I'm forgetting


(This post was edited by kzer_za on Wed, 1:55pm)


kzer_za
Lorien

Wed, 2:11pm

Post #8 of 39 (1186 views)
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Oh yeah, Faramir says "this is the city of Numenor" in RotK EE // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Chen G.
Rohan

Wed, 2:26pm

Post #9 of 39 (1178 views)
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Numenore in the movies [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
One minor correction to the article: "Numenor, heretofore unmentioned in film adaptations" - Numenor is mentioned at least twice in the LotR trilogy, and one is in the theatrical even. The Eowyn stew scene and Elrond's "the blood of Numenor all but spent." There might be more I'm forgetting


Is mentioned by Elrond


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The blood of Numenor is all but spent.


...by Eowyn:


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A descendant of Numenor, blessed with long life


...and Faramir...


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This is the city of the Men of Numenor.


...and obliquely by Gandalf:


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The old wisdom borne out of the west.


And obviously they could connect it visually: there's another white tree, the armour could be similar to the one used in the prologue. Narsil is obviously there somewhere, as are the Palantiri, the Ring of Barahir, etcetra.


(This post was edited by Chen G. on Wed, 2:29pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Wed, 2:31pm

Post #10 of 39 (1176 views)
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The Uttermost West? [In reply to] Can't Post

It would probably be best to leave Aman as mostly a mystery unless or until the show gets around to the era of King Ar-Pharazôn. At the same time, the series most definitely needs to address the Ban of the Valar and how that impacts the worldview of the Númenóreans.

#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity


Althoun
Lorien

Wed, 4:24pm

Post #11 of 39 (1129 views)
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Gandalf also calls Aragorn the "Heir of Númenor".... [In reply to] Can't Post

....in one of the extended scenes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDAREiqjFoY


Quote
Gandalf: "The veiling shadow that glowers in the East takes shape. Sauron will suffer no rival. From the summit of Barad-Dûr his Eye watches ceaselessly. But he is not so mighty yet that he is above fear. Doubt ever gnaws at him. The rumor has reached him: the heir of Númenor still lives. Sauron fears you, Aragorn. He fears what you may become. And so he'll strike hard and fast at the world of men."


So not just oblique reference.


Hasuwandil
Lorien


Wed, 5:34pm

Post #12 of 39 (1101 views)
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Go big or go broke [In reply to] Can't Post

Altaira was right: I was pleasantly surprised. I was expecting something more spoilerish, and for now I'm perfectly content with what was revealed. I also think TORn handled this leak very professionally. I'm still not quite clear what they mean by "confirmation", but I'd say the fact that they held onto it for a couple of weeks before releasing it demonstrates that it's not just a wild rumor they're passing along.

I have seen complaints that: 1) this doesn't tell us anything we didn't already know, and 2) any knowledgeable fan could have come up with it. I disagree on both counts, but I do see how some people could see it that way. In a separate post I'll address what I think this synopsis tells us.

After having sat through the whole hour and a half of TORn Tuesday, one thing that struck me about people's expectations for the series is that everyone (or most people, at least) seemed to be surprised about the scope of the show. In particular, the phrase "to the furthest reaches of the map" caught people's attention. Of course, there's still room for debate on what exactly that means, but I interpret that as confirmation of what I've been speculating all along about the show visiting places such as Harad, Khand, and Rhûn. There are possible story reasons for this:

  1. Sauron spent the first thousand years of the Second Age among the Men of the East, so that is basically his backstory, without going into First Age territory.

  2. The Númenóreans lived on a island in peace until after all the Rings of Power were forged. Many of them were mariners, however, so the best place for them to find adventure early on is on voyages across the Great Sea. Aldarion, for one, is known to have at least sailed past the coast of Harad. He also visited and traded with various kings in Middle-earth, at least one of whom gave him a diamond. Of course, the most notable source of diamonds is from Tolkien's birthplace, or thereabouts. Uttermost Harad? Wink

  3. The only way to have Wizards/Istari in the show and be consistent with something Tolkien wrote is to introduce the Blue Wizards, who upon arriving in Middle-earth immediately traveled to the East to try to undermine Sauron's plans there.

  4. Of the Nine Ringwraiths, one is known to have come from the East, and there are five whose origins are unknown. (The other three are said to be Númenóreans, though whether from the island itself or its colonies is I think unknown.)


In addition to those story reasons, the fact that Amazon was looking specifically for extras that met certain descriptions such as "Eurasian" or "South American" seemed to me to indicate that they were not doing "color-blind" casting, but rather looking to represent homogenous groups of people, such as Easterlings or Haradrim. There are both wonderful possibilities as well as dangers with going that route. I started to write about them, but this post is getting long enough as it is.

Anyway, obviously Amazon wants to increase its chances for success and, as far as possible, decrease its chances for failure. However, I would say that having a limited vision for the show would definitely decrease its potential for success, even if it may also slightly decrease its chances for failure.

Hêlâ Auriwandil, angilô berhtost,
oƀar Middangard mannum gisandid!


(This post was edited by Hasuwandil on Wed, 5:40pm)


Hasuwandil
Lorien


Wed, 7:58pm

Post #13 of 39 (1031 views)
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Synopsis analysis [In reply to] Can't Post


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Amazon Studios’ forthcoming series brings to screens for the very first time the heroic legends of the fabled Second Age of Middle-earth’s history.


I'm actually not quite sure what this is talking about. The Second Age is a bit of a downer from what I've read, and Tolkien wrote very little about it apart from some pseudo-historical entries and a few essays. The few actual prose works that exist are not what I would call heroic legends. There is a song about Gil-galad, so maybe that's it. Of course, that has to do mostly with the War of the Last Alliance.

Perhaps there are also legends about the defense of Ost-in-Edhil, the actions of Elrond and Celeborn, the arrival of Amroth and the Dwarves, and finally the arrival of Ciryatur and the Númenóreans, all in the War of the Elves and Sauron. These are really more bare-bones "historical" facts than legends within Tolkien's works, but Amazon may be advancing the idea that the stories they're creating for the show will become legends that people in Middle-earth tell later on. Perhaps Frodo and his friends hear Lindir sing about the defense of Ost-in-Edhil during their stay in Rivendell.


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This epic drama is set thousands of years before the events of J.R.R. Tolkien’s The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings, and will take viewers back to an era in which great powers were forged,


Of course, the obvious interpretation is that this is a reference to the Rings of Power. However, the way it's put is rather ambiguous, and it may also be referring to kingdoms, alliances, confederations, and such.


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kingdoms rose to glory and fell to ruin,


Everyone will think of Númenor, of course, but the description also fits Eregion quite well. It could also describe Lindon or the Woodland Realm to some extent after the War of the Last Alliance. It may even be referring to some kingdoms we have not yet heard of.


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unlikely heroes were tested,


One thinks of hobbits as the quintessential "unlikely heroes", but even if hobbits are absent from the show, there may still be a need for someone to fill similar roles to those filled by Bilbo Baggins in The Hobbit and Frodo and friends in The Lord of the Rings. Dwarves are one possibility.


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hope hung by the finest of threads, and the greatest villain that ever flowed from Tolkien’s pen threatened to cover all the world in darkness.


I assume this is referring to Sauron, though some would dispute whether he is Tolkien's greatest villain, or whether that honor belongs to Morgoth, or some other, less likely candidate, such as Lobelia Sackville-Baggins.


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Beginning in a time of relative peace,


This narrows down the start of the series to precisely the first half of the Second Age, a span of some 1700 years. I was hoping they would start in a period of peace. Especially on Númenor, I think it would be great to show people who may know a little bit about war from old stories, but really have no concept of what war means.


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the series follows an ensemble cast of characters, both familiar and new,


Not a surprise, given that Amazon has announced 35 actors already. They can't all be from Tolkien's pen. This probably also means there will be a little more politics, diplomacy, and arguing different points of view than what people may be used to from Tolkien.


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as they confront the long-feared re-emergence of evil to Middle-earth.


My understanding is that people (at least in the West) assumed that with Morgoth gone, everything would be better from then on. At least, they had that assumption until about the time of Aldarion. Perhaps this is referring to a time after Aldarion but before the forging of the One Ring.


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From the darkest depths of the Misty Mountains,


My first thought was that we'll see Khazad-dûm. However, I wouldn't describe Khazad-dûm as lying in "the darkest depths of the Misty Mountains". To me this seems to be indicating that somehow there will be a story involving the Balrog, nameless things, or at least Orcs. Of course, Dwarves and Khazad-dûm will likely be involved anyway. And, since Eregion is just next door to Khazad-dûm (and where the Rings were being forged), it would make sense to show that realm as well.


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to the majestic forests of the elf-capital of Lindon,


Even if it's not exactly the center of the action, you have to show Lindon, because that's where Gil-galad is, and Gil-galad is the king of the Elves (or at least the Noldor). I think it's interesting that they call Lindon the "elf-capital". Lindon is a land, not a city. But Tolkien doesn't seem to have said what the capital of Lindon is. There are three major settlements: Mithlond (the Grey Havens), Forlond, and Harlond, all of which are on shores of the Gulf of Lune. Mithlond seems to be the major settlement, but Gil-galad seems to have lived in Forlindon (North Lindon), where Forlond is. It's possible that Amazon has invented a new settlement, perhaps in a forest, that will be the capital of Lindon, and they don't want to reveal that just yet. Or perhaps, like a medieval king, Gil-galad's capital is wherever he and his courtiers happen to be staying at the moment.


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to the breathtaking island kingdom of Númenor,


Was there ever any doubt (since we saw the maps, at least)? Words such as "majestic" and "breathtaking" are rather stirring, but they impart hardly any information (except perhaps that the trees in Lindon are tall).


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to the furthest reaches of the map,


I won't exactly call this confirmation, because it could be interpreted in various different ways. Of course, Valinor is in the West, but I don't expect the series will spend much time there, if at all. Apart from Ar-Pharazôn's assault on Valinor, I don't see any reason to include Valinor in a show about the Second Age. Perhaps to show where Glorfindel and the Blue Wizards came from, but I think even that is stretching it. At the other end of the map are the region of Rhûn and the land of Khand, as well as a mountain range, which might be the Orocarni Mountains. To the south is the region of Far Harad. And far in the north is Forodwaith, as well as the island remnants of Beleriand: Tol Himling, Tol Fuin, and Tol Morwen. It occurs to me that Forodwaith could also feature in the show, although I think that's a less likely possibility than Harad or Rhûn.


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these kingdoms and characters will carve out legacies that live on long after they are gone.


I'm not too keen on the recent trends of prequel-mania and trying to show the origin of every little thing, which tends to make the secondary world or universe seem smaller and less expansive than it seemed before. What fun is it living in a wide galaxy where everyone has heard of you? On the other hand, I think it would also be a mistake to try to make the stories entirely self-contained. If they have no impact on events leading up to the War of the Elves and Sauron, the War of the Last Alliance, or the War of the Ring, some people might wonder why they're worth telling. Given that Sauron is the major mover of events, particularly in the latter half of the Second Age (not to mention the eponymous "Lord of the Rings"), he could be the thread that ties (most of) the tales together, although his influence should be more obvious in some tales and less obvious in others. And he doesn't need to be the one who names Rivendell, for example.

Hêlâ Auriwandil, angilô berhtost,
oƀar Middangard mannum gisandid!


InTheChair
Lorien

Wed, 10:46pm

Post #14 of 39 (949 views)
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Does seem to confirm some of what has already been guessed [In reply to] Can't Post

Numenor and the Elves of Lindon.

Clear hints of Eregion and Khazad-Dum, so Dwarves.

Not sure what is meant by the furthest reaches of the map, I hope they will not overextend themselves.

Some familiar charactes. Elrond, Galadriel, Sauron. Celeborn? Thranduil? Probably some of the known evil characters also?



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the greatest villain that ever flowed from Tolkien’s pen



Quote
to the furthest reaches of the map


I don't know, these two quotes together makes me think we're going to be spending a bit of time with Sauron in this series. Although it could also be Numenorian colonization.

Not really sure that unlikely heroes would refer to Hobbits though.

Not much said about humans except for Numenor.


Did Lindon have majestic forests?


(This post was edited by InTheChair on Wed, 10:49pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Thu, 4:24am

Post #15 of 39 (836 views)
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Lindon [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Did Lindon have majestic forests?


Well, Lindon certainly had forests. They could well have been majestic. I even came up with names for the woodlands of LIndon for my "TOR Guide to the Lands of Lindon". In the far north of Forlindon there is Taur-na-Forod. South of that is the large forest of Taur-nu-Ered. Skirting the southern Blue Mountains in Harlindon is Taur-en-Ephel.

Forlindon:


Harlindon:


#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Thu, 4:38am)


squire
Half-elven


Thu, 6:01am

Post #16 of 39 (780 views)
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The tone of the language is anything but Tolkienian [In reply to] Can't Post

Reading the press release, I felt I was reading fan fiction. The attempts at nobility or grandeur fell flat or were overdone, in an attempt to convince modern-day fans of the films that this series will follow the same standards of modern-day fantasy writing.

I'm being a bit of a crank, but if you're selling a long-form TV series as "Tolkien's Second Age", when Tolkien himself wrote almost nothing about the Second Age, you're in a hard spot.

If you try to match Tolkien's distinctive style, vocabulary, and fantastic world-view, you're going to date yourself - his prose is from the 1940s and 50s, not the 90s-20s of this century. Modern audiences used to modern media aren't likely to respond to it.

But if you update the language, much as the New Line and Warner movie trilogies did more often than not, you drift away from Tolkien's essential quality: his focus on language. The films, more or less, could rely on the texts, plots, and characters of the books to 'fill in' for inaccurate or modernized dialogue. But this series has no underlying book for fans to rely on as they try to follow the new story, characters, and language.

If the series dialogue matches the prose style of this press release - and why wouldn't it, presumably the show's writers composed it - the result is going to be nasty. Well, maybe not nasty. Maybe really entertaining for a lot of viewers. Just not me.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


lurtz2010
Rohan

Thu, 7:11am

Post #17 of 39 (768 views)
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How should the synopsis have been worded? [In reply to] Can't Post

You’re already assuming this show won’t be for you because of the language used in this short synopsis. Isn’t that a bit of a premature judgement? What would a perfect synopsis look like to you?


Hsvfan
The Shire

Thu, 12:26pm

Post #18 of 39 (683 views)
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Tone of the text [In reply to] Can't Post

I don´t think the writers composed the synopses. The production has a huge amount of people working on marketing. A presume that the marketing wrote the text. You should not forget, that synopses are done for the press and the wider audience!


Althoun
Lorien

Thu, 4:13pm

Post #19 of 39 (628 views)
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Marketing [In reply to] Can't Post

Squire, the press release is quite evidently a synopsis for PR drafted by marketers.

Cull the explicit references to Tolkien's Second Age legendarium, and it reads like any other generic fantasy - because that's what marketing of such a 'product' is about.

As such, onw cannot deduce anything as to the quality - or lack thereof - of the actual TV series from this.


(This post was edited by Althoun on Thu, 4:14pm)


Hasuwandil
Lorien


Thu, 4:45pm

Post #20 of 39 (620 views)
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Hobbits and Lindon [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Not really sure that unlikely heroes would refer to Hobbits though.


I don't suppose it does. The question is, what do you replace them with? Men? Dwarves? Drúedain? Nandorin Elves?

With regard to Hobbits specifically, my opinion is that The Lord of the Rings wouldn't be the same without Hobbits, and The Silmarillion wouldn't be the same with them. The Second Age is somewhere in between the two. Unlike some, I'm not totally against the idea of halflings in the Second Age, but with certain rules that would probably preclude them being the "unlikely heroes":

1. They don't do anything notable.
2. They don't attract the notice of Sauron, as well as of any of his servants who later become Ringwraiths.
3. They are unknown to the Elves who inhabit Eriador.

My own head canon is that the halflings were living around Dorwinion during the middle of the Second Age, and that they became refugees during the Dark Years and had to flee westward. Perhaps they met up with the Entwives.


Quote
Did Lindon have majestic forests?


I don't know that Tolkien ever described the forests of Lindon as "majestic", just as I don't know that he ever described Númenor as "breathtaking". However, there are clearly forests on the western slopes of the Blue Mountains (both north and south of the Gulf of Lune) on Christopher Tolkien's map as published in The Lord of the Rings. Both the forest of Forlindon and the forest of Harlindon each appear to be comparable in size to Lothlórien and larger than the Old Forest, though smaller than Fangorn Forest and, of course, Mirkwood.

Oddly there are no forests in Ossiriand on Christopher Tolkien's map of Beleriand, even though there is textual evidence to support the idea of forests in Ossiriand, and Ossiriand (or part of it) later became Lindon.

Hêlâ Auriwandil, angilô berhtost,
oƀar Middangard mannum gisandid!


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Thu, 5:01pm

Post #21 of 39 (608 views)
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The Synopsis [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
The tone of the language is anything but Tolkienian


Well, as you say, it's a press release, not a script. The description doesn't need flowery language or to capture Tolkien's narrative style.

#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity


Altaira
Superuser


Thu, 7:41pm

Post #22 of 39 (561 views)
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I think it's safe to assume, or at least strongly speculate, rights to UT [In reply to] Can't Post


I believe some media outlets have mis-reported that Amazon's rights only include LOTR and The Hobbit. Most of the reports are based on an interview with Tom Shippey with the German Tolkien Society.

I found and read the actual interview with Shippey here. His comments about not being able to use anything from LOTR and The Hobbit are specifically in response to the question: What about the First and Third Ages? So, it sounds like Amazon can't include anything from the First and Third Ages unless it's mentioned between the covers of LOTR and the Hobbit. But, regarding the Second Age, earlier in the interview Shippey says they can cover all the events of the Second Age, they just can't alter anything Tolkien wrote about:



Quote
Amazon has a relatively free hand when it comes to adding something, since, as I said, very few details are known about this time span. The Tolkien Estate will insist that the main shape of the Second Age is not altered. Sauron invades Eriador, is forced back by a Númenorean expedition, is returns to Númenor. There he corrupts the Númenoreans and seduces them to break the ban of the Valar. All this, the course of history, must remain the same. But you can add new characters and ask a lot of questions, like: What has Sauron done in the meantime? Where was he after Morgoth was defeated? Theoretically, Amazon can answer these questions by inventing the answers, since Tolkien did not describe it. But it must not contradict anything which Tolkien did say. That’s what Amazon has to watch out for. It must be canonical, it is impossible to change the boundaries which Tolkien has created, it is necessary to remain “tolkienian”


So, I think we can assume, or at least strongly speculate, about them at the very least using major parts of UT, and that that speculation is probably right on the mark. The challenge will be to keep true to the Tolkien parts with the dialogue and non-written parts they'll inevitably have to invent. In that respect, this comment from Shippey give me hope:


Quote
...the Tolkien Estate keeps a very careful eye on everything and is quite capable of saying no. They retain a veto over everything that concerns Tolkien.



Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase





(This post was edited by Altaira on Thu, 7:45pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Thu, 7:56pm

Post #23 of 39 (538 views)
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And possibly the Akallabeth? [In reply to] Can't Post

It also seems likely that Amazon Prime has received clearance to use at least some material from the Akallabêth (the Downfall of Númenor), though that work deals principally with the later days of Westernesse and its fall and so might be outside of he scope of this show.

#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity


Chen G.
Rohan

Thu, 10:14pm

Post #24 of 39 (508 views)
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That's what the reported spinoff may be for [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm willing to bet good money this show will concern itself entirely with the mid Second Age. i.e. be an adaptation of Of the Rings of Power and set between SA 1500 or so and up to SA 1701. Not the events of the early Second Age (zzzz...) nor the late second Age. Not in season three, and not in season five.

We've been told early on that "The streaming service has given a multi-season commitment to a LOTR series in the pact, which also includes a potential spinoff series."

I'm willing to bet THAT'S where Akallabeth will go.


(This post was edited by Chen G. on Thu, 10:17pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Fri, 3:18am

Post #25 of 39 (416 views)
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Yes. [In reply to] Can't Post

That's what I've been saying for a little while now, though we could be wrong.

#FidelityToTolkien
#DiversityWithFidelity

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