Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Moor Gnidaer:
Nameless Things origin?

Victariongreyjoy
Neirol


Feb 1, 7:35pm

Post #1 of 9 (476 views)
Shortcut
Nameless Things origin? Can't Post

Could these creatures be Maiars that Morgoth turned to his side during the time of the Lamps?


Otaku-sempai
Latrommi


Feb 1, 8:23pm

Post #2 of 9 (456 views)
Shortcut
I'm not sure. [In reply to] Can't Post

To paraphrase Gandalf: "Sauron knows them not. They are older than him."

I'm not sure that these "nameless things" need all be of the same nature. At least some might be nature spirits corrupted by Morgoth's influence. Others might be actual beasts similarly corrupted.

#FidelityToTolkien


uncle Iorlas
Neirol


Feb 1, 9:56pm

Post #3 of 9 (444 views)
Shortcut
Anyway they needn't be evil. [In reply to] Can't Post

A quintessential example of a deliberate mystery that wouldn't really be improved by an explanation, I think.


Otaku-sempai
Latrommi


Feb 2, 1:50am

Post #4 of 9 (419 views)
Shortcut
That's a good point. [In reply to] Can't Post

While it's possible that none of the "nameless things" might be characterizable as 'good', many might have no regard one way or the other towards the Free Peoples of Middle-earth.

#FidelityToTolkien


Morthoron
Rodnog


Feb 2, 3:21am

Post #5 of 9 (407 views)
Shortcut
Hence, the term "nameless things" // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Please visit my blog...The Dark Elf File...a slighty skewed journal of music and literary comment, fan-fiction and interminable essays.



N.E. Brigand
Nevle-flah


Feb 2, 3:23am

Post #6 of 9 (409 views)
Shortcut
Perhaps comapre to C.S. Lewis's "Perelandra". // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Treachery, treachery I fear; treachery of that miserable creature.

But so it must be. Let us remember that a traitor may betray himself and do good that he does not intend.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


sador
Nevle-flah


Feb 2, 5:23am

Post #7 of 9 (404 views)
Shortcut
'Tell me, who are you, alone, yourself and nameless?' [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree that these creatures might be anything.

As a matter of fact we do know one - younger than Sauron but who has forgotten his own name, until recalled by Gandalf, or probably Sauron himself (when extracting memories about the Gladden Fields).
Also, the Mouth of Sauron had forgotten his name.
But as Tom implies, that might have happened to anyone.

And anyone, Sauron was around (if not specifically in Arda yet) when the lamps were overthrown. And I have always assumed the Misty Mountains and the Anduin date to the great upheavals that chaged the shape of Middle-earth when Utumno was overthrown.

If we still want to accept Gandalf's words literally, perhaps he simply means these creatures were at the roots of the Mountains before Sauron came to Hollin at the Second Age, so he had no chance to make their acquaintance...

Thinking about things I don't understand


uncle Iorlas
Neirol


Feb 2, 3:09pm

Post #8 of 9 (375 views)
Shortcut
I've often thought of that parallel. [In reply to] Can't Post

In both Perelandra and Silver Chair, the subterranean deeps seem to be the idea that most compels Lewis to a Tolkienian gesture toward offstage mysteries.


uncle Iorlas
Neirol


Feb 4, 12:09am

Post #9 of 9 (332 views)
Shortcut
you've set me to noodling [In reply to] Can't Post

It's Gandalf who tells us how Sméagol wormed his way under the Misty Mountains in search of great mysteries—only to find endless empty darkness without meaning. How odd to realize that Gandalf himself, later, brings back a report of mystery upon mystery from his own wild chase through the deeps under those same mountains, somewhat further south, confirming young Sméagol's whimsy in spades.

Which in turn makes me think: but in between, Gollum himself turned back to the Misty Mountains again, and crept inside again, didn't he? He must have, for Aragorn's supposition to be true that he picked up their trail when they passed through there. After centuries in a dead-end job on his little island, Gollum came back for a second crack at his mad passion, and this time he hit the jackpot. Epic dwarf city, abandoned, familiar goblin activity, ancient reawakened demon, lost mythic architecture, funky undiscovered biosphere if you keep going down... before those blasted hobbits came traipsing through his new digs waving his Precious around all over again, he'd managed to pull off a picture-perfect retirement scheme. Not bad for a bloke who'd had the misfortune to be questioned by Sauron personally.

 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.