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Why weren't representatives from Dol Amroth and Rohan invited to the Council of Elrond?

elf_wannabee
Lorien

Jul 28, 5:57pm

Post #1 of 11 (643 views)
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Why weren't representatives from Dol Amroth and Rohan invited to the Council of Elrond? Can't Post

Since Elrond invited high positioned representatives of all the Free Races to his council why wasn't Eomer or Imrahil invited? Or were Aragon and Boromir sufficient to represent Men at Elrond's Council? Did Tolkien ever say anything about this? Forgive me if this has been previously discussed.


(This post was edited by elf_wannabee on Jul 28, 6:05pm)


squire
Half-elven


Jul 29, 12:18am

Post #2 of 11 (574 views)
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It's funny (odd funny), but... [In reply to] Can't Post

...as Elrond puts it, he didn't invite anyone!

The Council of Elrond is one of those events in the story that is explicitly said to be an intervention by the Powers. By total coincidence, emissaries from Erebor, Mirkwood, Gondor, the Havens, the Rangers, the Wizards, and the Shire all arrive at Rivendell in the same week or so.

Elrond puts this most plainly in his speech after the preliminary discussions and introductions have concluded:
‘The Ring! What shall we do with the Ring...? That is the purpose for which you are called hither. Called, I say, though I have not called you to me, strangers from distant lands. You have come and are here met, in this very nick of time, by chance as it may seem. Yet it is not so. Believe rather that it is so ordered that we, who sit here, and none others, must now find counsel for the peril of the world. - LR II.2
Then, as far as your immediate question is concerned, we learn in the History of Middle-earth edition of Tolkien's drafts, that at the time of writing this part of the book he had not yet invented the Rohirrim or the Principality of Dol Amroth. Believe it or not, Gondor itself was invented at the very moment that he decided to add the mysterious 'stranger from the South', i.e. Boromir, to the chapter.

And then later in the process, the Council scene was pretty crowded with new characters and information, and was fiendishly difficult to write over several drafts, so during his revisions after completing the full tale Tolkien had no reason to add two more emissaries.



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Solicitr
Rohan

Jul 29, 1:53pm

Post #3 of 11 (502 views)
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Yes [In reply to] Can't Post

moreover, Belfalas (capital: Dol Amroth) was merely a province of Gondor; its Princes ranked first among the realm's nobility, but they were still subjects of the Crown (represented by the Steward). One might as well ask why Forlong the Fat wasn't invited.

----------------------

In general, it's often overlooked, or simply little-known, how much of the history of the Third Age was invented during the writing of LR or, for most of it, ret-conned afterwards during the writing of the Appendices. There was basically no Third Age when Tolkien started the book.


(This post was edited by Solicitr on Jul 29, 1:56pm)


Eruonen
Valinor


Aug 3, 4:46am

Post #4 of 11 (438 views)
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As it appears Rohan was under the say of Saruman no emissary was called. [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Aug 3, 12:56pm

Post #5 of 11 (409 views)
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Are you referring to the film? [In reply to] Can't Post

As has already been pointed out, none of the representives at the Council of Elrond had been summoned (in the book) with the exception of Boromir, who had received a vision. The Council was an ad hoc affair attended by whomever was present at the time.

"Change is inevitable. Growth is optional." - DRWolf (after John C. Maxwell)


Solicitr
Rohan

Aug 5, 3:22pm

Post #6 of 11 (379 views)
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Exactly [In reply to] Can't Post

Boromir had come prompted by a dream, which had really targeted Faramir first- but Elrond wasn't the source of the dream. Legolas had come to report Gollum's escape. Gloin and Gimli were sent by Dain to get advice on how to deal with Mordor's threatening messages. Galdor happened to be present on an errand for Cirdan. Only the four hobbits and Gandalf, plus Aragorn as escort, were there expressly because of the Ring and, again, it wasn't because Elrond had sent for them.

The movie scenario is kind of ridiculous, if one thinks how long it would take messages from Elrond to reach all over Middle-earth and for those summoned to get there; as we know, Boromir's journey took him 110 days.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Aug 5, 3:46pm

Post #7 of 11 (375 views)
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Not only that... [In reply to] Can't Post

...but the vision was also received in a dream by Faramir. One wonders how events might have played out if Faramir had journeyed to Rivendell in the place of his brother.

"Change is inevitable. Growth is optional." - DRWolf (after John C. Maxwell)


Hamfast Gamgee
Grey Havens

Aug 6, 7:43am

Post #8 of 11 (296 views)
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possibly someone from Lorien should have been there [In reply to] Can't Post

Even if not called Galdriel might well have felt something or seen something in her Mirror to send someone to Rivendell at the time. Of course, I know the real reason why no-one from Lorien was present at the council.


Cirashala
Tol Eressea


Aug 7, 12:42am

Post #9 of 11 (249 views)
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What was it? // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

My writing and novels:

My Hobbit Fanfiction

My historical novel print and kindle version

My historical novels ebook version compatible with all ereaders

You can also find my novel at most major book retailers online (and for those outside the US who prefer a print book, you can find the print version at Book Depository). Search "Amazing Grace Amanda Longpre'" to find it.

Happy reading everyone!


squire
Half-elven


Aug 11, 10:19pm

Post #10 of 11 (147 views)
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Lorien had not yet been invented when the chapter was written. [In reply to] Can't Post

And, as I noted in my earlier post here, the entire Council was meant to be an ad-hoc event supervised by the Powers, rather than a rationally organized staff meeting of the White Council, etc. Tolkien could have added an emissary from Lorien in revision, but that would have spoiled a great deal of suspense and mystery in Book Three where the 'mysterious woods' gradually become a more and more important destination for the Company.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


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Cirashala
Tol Eressea


Aug 12, 3:55am

Post #11 of 11 (123 views)
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Thanks Squire! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

My writing and novels:

My Hobbit Fanfiction

My historical novel print and kindle version

My historical novels ebook version compatible with all ereaders

You can also find my novel at most major book retailers online (and for those outside the US who prefer a print book, you can find the print version at Book Depository). Search "Amazing Grace Amanda Longpre'" to find it.

Happy reading everyone!

 
 

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