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The One Ring Forums: TheOneRing.net: Feedback:
What can TORNadoes do to help recover the old forums' content?
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N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Feb 2, 3:08am

Post #1 of 51 (4876 views)
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What can TORNadoes do to help recover the old forums' content? Can't Post

Seventeen months ago, the original 1999-2007 TORN forums--whose posts had continued to be accessible (if a bit slow to load) for nine years after the upgrade--suddenly were not.

In responses to this Feedback thread started by a.s. in Sep. 2016, indications were that the actual content though inaccessible to readers was still preserved, and several options were put forward as to how it could be restored as an archive, a project that several people volunteered to assist with. My life got pretty hectic soon after that, so I never followed up here--and it would seem that's true of others, since I don't think there's been any news on this front in the meantime. But recent events have me feeling especially nostalgic, and I've been able to free up my schedule, so:

I should like to save the Shire, if--I mean: I would like to help save that content and make it accessible once more, and I'm sure others would too. At the time, there were offers of financial assistance, data entry labor, programming expertise, and more, and I expect those offers still stand.

The discussions from those years are very dear to me, and I stand ready to devote much time, effort, and if necessary, what funds I can afford, to making that content available once more for the benefit of all. What can we do to make that happen?

Treason doth neuer prosper? What's the Reason?
for if it prosper none dare call it treason.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


NottaSackville
Tol Eressea

Feb 2, 1:14pm

Post #2 of 51 (4653 views)
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You have my sword, errr, keyboard // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Happiness: money matters, but less than we think and not in the way that we think. Family is important and so are friends, while envy is toxic -- and so is excessive thinking. Beaches are optional. Trust is not. Neither is gratitude. - The Geography of Bliss by Eric Weiner as summarized by Lily Fairbairn. And a bit of the Hobbit reading thrown in never hurts. - NottaSackville


entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Feb 2, 2:15pm

Post #3 of 51 (4665 views)
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I'm happy to help, too [In reply to] Can't Post

Hopefully Altaira can help us get access to the files. From what I remember, there's going to be some untangling to do, but we can probably section it off and have several people work on it.

I'm also happy to add funds if we need to bring in professional help. Thanks for bringing this up again NEB. I'm also feeling nostalgic for the discussions, especially the Reading Room.


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Feb 2, 4:36pm

Post #4 of 51 (4657 views)
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Did you ever see "One Man Lord of the Rings"? [In reply to] Can't Post

"You have my sword!"

"And my axe!"

"And my hair!"

Treason doth neuer prosper? What's the Reason?
for if it prosper none dare call it treason.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Feb 2, 5:15pm

Post #5 of 51 (4647 views)
Shortcut
I'm sure we can do it. [In reply to] Can't Post

Last summer, a performing arts group I follow put out an emergency appeal for funds so they could finish their summer tour. They raised $100,000 from a few thousand people in just 36 hours. If this project requires, the rent of additional space on the servers TORN currently uses, doubtless the participants here can help similarly.

Treason doth neuer prosper? What's the Reason?
for if it prosper none dare call it treason.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


squire
Half-elven


Feb 2, 7:12pm

Post #6 of 51 (4638 views)
Shortcut
I'd love to help as much as I could. [In reply to] Can't Post

Like you, I would make the time needed for such a valuable project.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


a.s.
Valinor


Feb 3, 2:23am

Post #7 of 51 (4614 views)
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I am standing by for assignment [In reply to] Can't Post

PLEASE someone send me a private message if I miss the planning or assignments. I would dearly love to preserve our history. I love this place and the fellowship, learning, and laughter down through the years.

With an occasional testy moment. I am but human.

Cool

Standing by.

a.s.

"an seileachan"


"A safe fairyland is untrue to all worlds." JRR Tolkien, Letters.



squire
Half-elven


Feb 3, 2:25am

Post #8 of 51 (4611 views)
Shortcut
WAIT [In reply to] Can't Post

Is that a smiley I see in your post, a.s.?

You know the consequences.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


a.s.
Valinor


Feb 3, 2:37am

Post #9 of 51 (4608 views)
Shortcut
en garde [In reply to] Can't Post

I still have all my old message board smileys, let's see if I can remember how to post them....



OK, old friend. I appear to be ready.

a.s.

"an seileachan"


"A safe fairyland is untrue to all worlds." JRR Tolkien, Letters.



Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Feb 3, 2:51am

Post #10 of 51 (4607 views)
Shortcut
I'd love to see this happen as well. [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm no technical wizard, but I would be glad to lend a hand to anything within my capabilities. Smile

Silverlode

Roads go ever ever on
Under cloud and under star
Yet feet that wandering have gone
Turn at last to home afar.
Eyes that fire and sword have seen
And horror in the halls of stone
Look at last on meadows green
And trees and hills they long have known.




squire
Half-elven


Feb 3, 2:56am

Post #11 of 51 (4603 views)
Shortcut
I love that one [In reply to] Can't Post

DEATH TO ALL SMILIES
Except the cute duelling gif.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


a.s.
Valinor


Feb 3, 3:12am

Post #12 of 51 (4601 views)
Shortcut
is nostalgia making you smiley tolerant? [In reply to] Can't Post

I do have a knight in training just for you, though:



But I won't push it.

a.s.

"an seileachan"


"A safe fairyland is untrue to all worlds." JRR Tolkien, Letters.



Loresilme
Valinor


Feb 3, 3:48pm

Post #13 of 51 (4562 views)
Shortcut
Count me in [In reply to] Can't Post

I would love to have the content restored and accessible.


Quote
At the time, there were offers of financial assistance, data entry labor, programming expertise, and more, and I expect those offers still stand.


I'm not a tech expert, but I should be able to help out on data entry labor.

Please feel free to PM me.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Feb 3, 10:52pm

Post #14 of 51 (4526 views)
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*mods up* Hear, hear! [In reply to] Can't Post

This would be so great, and I feel the same need to revive our dormant voices and friendships. If there's anyway at all to bring them home, I'm there! I'd donate what I can both financially and physically.

I did a lot of database work for bibliographic records in my old job... recovery, editing, hunting down elusive authority work. I've been clocked at typing 92wpm, so I'm game for retyping posts if that's the only way. Big jobs don't scare me. Do one at a time.

Count me in 100%. We need this.

Thanks for this, NEB :)



sample

We have been there and back again.


TIME Google Calendar


6th draft of TH:AUJ Geeky Observations List - November 28, 2013
4th draft of TH:DOS Geeky Observations List - May 15, 2014

5th draft of TH:BotFA Geeky Observations List - January 30, 2015


TORn's Geeky Observations Lists for LotR and The Hobbit


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Feb 3, 10:52pm

Post #15 of 51 (4514 views)
Shortcut
Sayeth the man in black ;) // [In reply to] Can't Post

 



sample

We have been there and back again.


TIME Google Calendar


6th draft of TH:AUJ Geeky Observations List - November 28, 2013
4th draft of TH:DOS Geeky Observations List - May 15, 2014

5th draft of TH:BotFA Geeky Observations List - January 30, 2015


TORn's Geeky Observations Lists for LotR and The Hobbit


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Feb 3, 10:59pm

Post #16 of 51 (4531 views)
Shortcut
ok you kids... [In reply to] Can't Post

SPLAT!



sample

We have been there and back again.


TIME Google Calendar


6th draft of TH:AUJ Geeky Observations List - November 28, 2013
4th draft of TH:DOS Geeky Observations List - May 15, 2014

5th draft of TH:BotFA Geeky Observations List - January 30, 2015


TORn's Geeky Observations Lists for LotR and The Hobbit


L. Ron Halfelven
Grey Havens


Feb 4, 8:10pm

Post #17 of 51 (4449 views)
Shortcut
Is this feasible, admins? I want to help if it is./ [In reply to] Can't Post

 

And Rose drew him in, and set him on the harpsichord bench, and put little Wilhelm Friedemann upon his lap.

He began composing a fugue. 'Well, I'm Bach,' he said.


NottaSackville
Tol Eressea

Feb 5, 1:57pm

Post #18 of 51 (4370 views)
Shortcut
Unfortunately, no. But sounds right up my alley // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Happiness: money matters, but less than we think and not in the way that we think. Family is important and so are friends, while envy is toxic -- and so is excessive thinking. Beaches are optional. Trust is not. Neither is gratitude. - The Geography of Bliss by Eric Weiner as summarized by Lily Fairbairn. And a bit of the Hobbit reading thrown in never hurts. - NottaSackville


Inferno
Superuser / Moderator


Feb 12, 10:29pm

Post #19 of 51 (4162 views)
Shortcut
At a guess [In reply to] Can't Post

(since I don't have server access to look myself)

The forum posts are likely stored in some sort of SQL database (postgres, mysql, being most likely options). So there would need to be a dump of all the data, and someone with some database skill could then do SQL extractions into chunks that could be passed to others to format. Don't know how large the dataset is, or how it would come out, but typically, SQL extractions go into CSV (comma separated value) files which can be opened with Excel or another spreadsheet program. People would have to take all the spreadsheet fields and copy/paste them out into text files where they make sense to read.

Keep in mind this is just a guess. Based on the snippet Altaira posted in the original thread, it's possible I'm incorrect and the data wouldn't be extractable via SQL. But the first order of business would be to get a copy of the entire data store somewhere that isn't on the tOR.N server where other people could access it.

Tangentially, I have probably 90% of the original LotR chapter discussion we did-- the first few chapters were before the Reading Room was created and were never recovered-- saved on my hard drive from when Gorel put it all up on Geocities, but it's all in html files that I've never had time nor inclination to go back through and reformat. If someone were really interested and had the time, I could pass those along for someone to put into a legible format.

Inferno.

======================
Good night, tOR.Nados. Good work. Sleep well. I'll most likely delete you in the morning.
======================


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Feb 13, 3:47pm

Post #20 of 51 (4110 views)
Shortcut
That sounds hopeful. [In reply to] Can't Post

And perhaps, if the files are in the right format, manageable via the "nerdy scripts" that Notta was pondering in the earlier discussion.

Also, you had the foresight to post a copy of the first Reading Room LOTR discussion to this thread from TORN's tenth anniversary celebration in 2009.

Treason doth neuer prosper? What's the Reason?
for if it prosper none dare call it treason.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


Inferno
Superuser / Moderator


Feb 13, 4:56pm

Post #21 of 51 (4102 views)
Shortcut
Heh. I'd forgotten I'd done that. [In reply to] Can't Post

Course, it was a lot of years ago. =)

Inferno.

======================
Good night, tOR.Nados. Good work. Sleep well. I'll most likely delete you in the morning.
======================


NottaSackville
Tol Eressea

Feb 13, 7:57pm

Post #22 of 51 (4090 views)
Shortcut
I would agree [In reply to] Can't Post

My biggest fear is that the data is corrupt and simply cannot be retrieved in any fashion. If the data is intact and can be retrieved in a consistent fashion (even if not the way it was originally intended) then I feel pretty good that we could have an automated process that does *something* useful.

Happiness: money matters, but less than we think and not in the way that we think. Family is important and so are friends, while envy is toxic -- and so is excessive thinking. Beaches are optional. Trust is not. Neither is gratitude. - The Geography of Bliss by Eric Weiner as summarized by Lily Fairbairn. And a bit of the Hobbit reading thrown in never hurts. - NottaSackville


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Feb 16, 12:22am

Post #23 of 51 (3929 views)
Shortcut
This sounds like fun!!! :D [In reply to] Can't Post

I've done clean-up projects like this before. When the university library I worked for transitioned their collection from the card catalog to a database.



Quote
SQL extractions go into CSV (comma separated value) files which can be opened with Excel or another spreadsheet program. People would have to take all the spreadsheet fields and copy/paste them out into text files where they make sense to read.




SWEEEEEEEEEEEET!


Even if the files are possibly corrupted, I'm all for giving it a go. While they may not be perfect, we could have more content than we do now... and it's so worth giving it a try, imho.


Thanks for considering this so seriously. :D



sample

We have been there and back again.


TIME Google Calendar


6th draft of TH:AUJ Geeky Observations List - November 28, 2013
4th draft of TH:DOS Geeky Observations List - May 15, 2014

5th draft of TH:BotFA Geeky Observations List - January 30, 2015


TORn's Geeky Observations Lists for LotR and The Hobbit


ElanorTX
Grey Havens


Feb 24, 10:54am

Post #24 of 51 (3281 views)
Shortcut
Although I'm no techie, I would like to help [In reply to] Can't Post

with $$. Would we use the regular TOR.n donation button or set up a separate crowdfunding account?

ElanorTX

"I shall not wholly fail if anything can still grow fair in days to come."



N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Mar 15, 6:03am

Post #25 of 51 (3115 views)
Shortcut
Not sure. [In reply to] Can't Post

But it's great to see all the interest in this effort. Maybe we'll hear more soon from the powers that be about what we can do?

Treason doth neuer prosper? What's the Reason?
for if it prosper none dare call it treason.


-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.

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