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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Middle-earth TV Series Discussion:
'Lord of the Rings' TV Series Being Considered By Amazon
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Victariongreyjoy
Rivendell


Nov 4 2017, 12:50am

Post #1 of 210 (5529 views)
Shortcut
     'Lord of the Rings' TV Series Being Considered By Amazon  


Quote
Amazon and Warner Bros. Television are in talks for a series based on J.R.R. Tolkein's Lord of the Rings, Variety reports.

WB and the Tolkein estate are said to be shopping the property around, with Amazon emerging as the early frontrunner. No deal has yet been made, but Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos is said to be personally involved in the negotiations with WB TV and the estate of late LOTR author, J.R.R. Tolkein - a highly unusual procedure, which may convey just how serious Aamazon is about closing a deal.


http://comicbook.com/...gs-amazon-tv-series/


Lissuin
Tol Eressea


Nov 4 2017, 12:59am

Post #2 of 210 (4516 views)
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     Wow! Just wow. [In reply to]  

Shocked Unimpressed Smile


Eldorion
Gondor


Nov 4 2017, 1:27am

Post #3 of 210 (4518 views)
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     Pre-emptive reminder that Variety is almost certainly wrong about the Estate being involved [In reply to]  

Original article here: http://variety.com/...s-amazon-1202606519/


Quote
The studio and the Tolkien estate have been shopping a series based on the classic fantasy novels and their assortment of hobbits, wizards, and warriors, sparking a competitive situation from which Amazon has emerged as the frontrunner. Representatives for Amazon and Warner Bros. declined to comment.


The Estate does not have the legal right to "shop around" a LOTR screen adaptation even if they were inclined to do so (and there's no reason to think their opinions about those have suddenly changed). The most likely scenario is that either Variety or their source confused the Estate and Middle-earth Enterprises, which owns the adaptation rights to TH and LOTR.



There's a feeling I get, when I look to the West...



(This post was edited by Eldorion on Nov 4 2017, 1:28am)


Victariongreyjoy
Rivendell


Nov 4 2017, 1:33am

Post #4 of 210 (4496 views)
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     Reboot out of the question? [In reply to]  

So this mean Amazon can't reboot LOTR?


Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Nov 4 2017, 1:40am

Post #5 of 210 (4476 views)
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     Is it April and no one told me? [In reply to]  

Though, these days, this really shouldn't surprise me.

"The danger with any movie that does as well as this one does is that the amount of money it's making and the number of awards that it's got becomes almost more important than the movie itself in people's minds. I look at that as, in a sense, being very much like the Ring, and its effect on people. You know, you can kind of forget what we were doing, if you get too wrapped up in that."
- Viggo Mortensen


Eldorion
Gondor


Nov 4 2017, 1:59am

Post #6 of 210 (4472 views)
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     They just need permission from someone other than the Estate [In reply to]  

Tolkien sold the screen rights to The Hobbit and LOTR before his death, so the Estate has never held those rights. They are currently owned by the Saul Zaentz Company d/b/a Middle-earth Enterprises. (Well, some of the rights to The Hobbit are held by MGM but it doesn't seem like that'll be an issue here.) Middle-earth Enterprises then licenses the rights out to various content-producers, including Warner Bros and, potentially, Amazon as well now.

The Estate still gets a share of the money from adaptations, but they don't have any control over them and they're not the ones who decide if an adaptation can move forward or not.



There's a feeling I get, when I look to the West...



(This post was edited by Eldorion on Nov 4 2017, 1:59am)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 4 2017, 3:15am

Post #7 of 210 (4427 views)
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     Or... [In reply to]  


In Reply To
So this mean Amazon can't reboot LOTR?


More likely the report is wrong and meant Middle-earth Enterprises, not the Tolkien Estate.

"I may be on the side of the angels, but do not think for one second that I am one of them." - Sherlock


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 4 2017, 4:00am

Post #8 of 210 (4424 views)
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     Middle-earth Enterprises [In reply to]  

From the Middle-earth Enterprises website:


Quote
Middle-earth Enterprises owns exclusive worldwide rights to motion picture, merchandising, stage and other rights in certain literary works of J.R.R. Tolkien including The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit. We have produced and licensed films, stage productions and merchandise based on these Tolkien works for more than thirty-five years.


Link: http://www.middleearth.com/#about

This makes me wonder about the veracity of the Variety piece.

"I may be on the side of the angels, but do not think for one second that I am one of them." - Sherlock


Lindele
Gondor

Nov 4 2017, 4:20am

Post #9 of 210 (4408 views)
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     My first thought wasn’t that Variety was wrong about the estate [In reply to]  

But wrong about ‘The Lord of the Rings’ being the title. People often use LOTR when referencing ‘Middle-earth.’
This is just as likely/unlikely as them getting it wrong about the estate, but perhaps it is just wishful thinking on my part. I’d much rather see some new material than a LOTR reboot.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 4 2017, 4:23am

Post #10 of 210 (4396 views)
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     Christopher Tolkien doesn't like adaptations [In reply to]  


In Reply To
But wrong about ‘The Lord of the Rings’ being the title. People often use LOTR when referencing ‘Middle-earth.’
This is just as likely/unlikely as them getting it wrong about the estate, but perhaps it is just wishful thinking on my part. I’d much rather see some new material than a LOTR reboot.


The involvement of Warner Bros., and Christopher Tolkien's well-known objections to adaptations of his father's works speak against this interpretation.

"I may be on the side of the angels, but do not think for one second that I am one of them." - Sherlock

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Nov 4 2017, 4:23am)


Lindele
Gondor

Nov 4 2017, 4:25am

Post #11 of 210 (4380 views)
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     Of course [In reply to]  

But you never know. I’m sure you’re right.
But you never know.


Ent Wife
The Shire


Nov 4 2017, 4:30am

Post #12 of 210 (4382 views)
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     I noticed someone mentioned that in the Variety comments section. [In reply to]  

It will be interesting to see if there's any subsequent follow-up on this story.


jlj93byu
Bree

Nov 4 2017, 4:30am

Post #13 of 210 (4370 views)
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     What amazing timing [In reply to]  

I am amazed at the coincidental timing of this announcement. Of course, nothing is official, but the mere potential of more Middle-earth is exciting.

So why do I say the timing is amazing? Just moments before I saw this article, I had been watching the appendices on Battle of the Five Armies, and I had just watched "A Last Desperate Stand," which features the last day Ian McKellan portrayed Gandalf, as well as Orlando Bloom as Legolas and Evangeline Lilly as Tauriel. Seeing all these actors wrap up and leave their characters behind really made me emotional, and had me longing for more Middle-earth. Of course, this announcement means if anything happens, it will likely be aesthetically much different from Peter Jackson's Middle-earth, but any chance to see more stories from Tolkien's rich legendarium is most welcome.


Eldorion
Gondor


Nov 4 2017, 4:31am

Post #14 of 210 (4380 views)
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     It's possible I guess, but I'd be surprised [In reply to]  

The Tolkien Estate legally can't sanction an adaptation of late Third Age material that is drawn from the LOTR Appendices (or adaptations of TH and LOTR proper). They could, theoretically, sell or license out the rights to adapt The Silmarillion in whole or in part, but I think that if that was the case Variety would probably have mentioned it. It's possible they got the two books confused, but I think it's more likely that they confused the Tolkien Estate and Middle-earth Enterprises, which happens all the time even among people who should know better. It was even worse back when the latter was called Tolkien Enterprises.



There's a feeling I get, when I look to the West...



(This post was edited by Eldorion on Nov 4 2017, 4:32am)


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


Nov 4 2017, 5:59am

Post #15 of 210 (4342 views)
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     Dream come true! [In reply to]  

I've been hoping for something like this for years! I never imagined we'd be getting it so soon though. I can't wait to see a fresh take on the series! After finally listening to the radio drama last year (and going through it again a few weeks ago), I've really come to appreciate having multiple (complete) adaptions. And I want more.

But if they don't include Tom Bombadil...


Silverlode
Forum Admin


Nov 4 2017, 6:01am

Post #16 of 210 (4336 views)
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     That was my thought as well. [In reply to]  

I don't think they can make any sort of LOTR series without getting them involved unless their rights are expiring. So whoever wrote this story either doesn't know the difference between M-e Enterprises and the Estate (entirely possible, there's a reason we dubbed entertainment journalists "neekerbreekers") or got bad information.

I'm taking this with a whole shakerful of salt until more credible info comes to light.

Silverlode

Roads go ever ever on
Under cloud and under star
Yet feet that wandering have gone
Turn at last to home afar.
Eyes that fire and sword have seen
And horror in the halls of stone
Look at last on meadows green
And trees and hills they long have known.




cats16
Valinor


Nov 4 2017, 7:20am

Post #17 of 210 (4314 views)
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     I'm waiting for more info [In reply to]  

The details in the article probably came from Amazon, which makes sense why we're not getting precise language about what's going on. I'm going to sit tight and wait to hear more concrete news before getting too fussed up, knowing firsthand how wobbly these things can be behind closed doors.

Still, cool news I didn't expect to read this evening. No one at work had heard any whispers of this.

Join us every weekend in the Hobbit movie forum for this week's CHOW (Chapter of the Week) discussion!




(This post was edited by cats16 on Nov 4 2017, 7:21am)


Victariongreyjoy
Rivendell


Nov 4 2017, 10:22am

Post #18 of 210 (4274 views)
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     Young strider prequel, Angmar vs Arnor, Oath of Eorl? [In reply to]  

What about making adaptations of these things than rebooting PJ LOTR, which is still today considered as a masterpiece? And The Hobbit trilogy is farily still new.


Victariongreyjoy
Rivendell


Nov 4 2017, 11:08am

Post #19 of 210 (4256 views)
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     Akallabêth? [In reply to]  

What about the fall of Numenor and the War of the Last Alliance?


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 4 2017, 12:25pm

Post #20 of 210 (4262 views)
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     It could be the Sil or one of the other books like The Children of Hurin [In reply to]  

 

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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squire
Half-elven


Nov 4 2017, 12:29pm

Post #21 of 210 (4279 views)
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     "a series based on the classic fantasy novels and their assortment of hobbits, wizards, and warriors" [In reply to]  

In commenting on this story, it's important to use the actual Variety story, not the secondary reporting from comicbook.com, or the tertiary commentary of blogs, forums, etc. that will echo and possibly further distort the original Nov. 3 story by Daniel Holloway.

One thing to note is that this probe by Amazon reflects an already-announced redirection of their TV production efforts "away from niche, naturalistic series such as 'Transparent' and 'Mozart in the Jungle' and toward large-scale genre programming with potential for broad international appeal." This suggests that the proposed production will be almost entirely based on audience expectations coming from the existing Jackson films, rather than Tolkien's books.

Another interesting angle from the Variety report is that the proposal is very vague about how "The Lord of the Rings" actually relates to the series. As per my header, the series is "based on" the book's "assortment of hobbits, wizards, and warriors". This may be Holloway's own shorthand for Tolkien's characters, but it reads to me like a very (again) generic recasting of Tolkien into a standard "fantasy" mix based on games, art, and other stories and series that have been, at best, inspired by Tolkien rather than actually based on, or adapted from, The Lord of the Rings. Most specifically, this feels like someone thinking how to compete with, or at least reproduce the success of, Game of Thrones on its own territory.

As so many have already said, it's too early to do more than speculate on the news report's wording, including the almost certain confusion between the Tolkien Estate and Zaentz's Middle-earth Enterprises organization. (On the other hand, note Holloway's mention of the actual Tolkien Estate's settlement with Warner Brothers over licensing rights and fees, which suggests at least some familiarity with the ins and outs of Tolkien's posthumous media empire!) But I wonder if this doesn't feel like, not a 'reboot' of The Lord of the Rings in the closely adapted format of the New Line movies, but a much looser TV series featuring the characters, names, places and events of the War of the Ring in, essentially, a new story or stories revolving around the periphery of Tolkien's actual plot? More sex, more fighting, more intrigue, more up to date 21st century characterizations? Kind of like a LotR with all Tauriel, all the time?



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


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Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 4 2017, 12:29pm

Post #22 of 210 (4254 views)
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     Strange Days Indeed [In reply to]  

This could be good or it could be very bad.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 4 2017, 12:34pm

Post #23 of 210 (4261 views)
Shortcut
     The fact that the source is Variety [In reply to]  

gives me some hope. I am certain that there are discussions and that they are relatively advanced or Variety would not have went with the story, But will they pan out? Only time will tell.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 4 2017, 12:46pm

Post #24 of 210 (4259 views)
Shortcut
     All Tauriel, all the time... [In reply to]  

You certainly know how to rain on a guys parade.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Victariongreyjoy
Rivendell


Nov 4 2017, 1:08pm

Post #25 of 210 (4218 views)
Shortcut
     Should not reboot LOTR, but... [In reply to]  

I won't mind they do something with The Hobbit. Also, I want to see a adaptation of Angmar and Arnor.

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