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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Lord of the Rings:
MAKE AN MODERN ANIMATION of LOTR

lotr08
Registered User

Jun 8 2017, 7:00pm

Post #1 of 21 (4327 views)
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MAKE AN MODERN ANIMATION of LOTR Can't Post

Anyone else ready for a modern animation version of LOTR? As much as I enjoyed PJ's effort, I thought he missed the point with the treatment of the storyline outside Frodo/Sam. Especially Return of the King. All the death at Pellenor Fields only to have a giant green wave wash thru and wipe out the enemy? Seems they were a litle late..

A modern animation could look even better in key moments... Nazgul, Elves, paths of the dead...


L. Ron Halfelven
Grey Havens


Jun 8 2017, 8:08pm

Post #2 of 21 (4295 views)
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Any voice casting suggestions, people? [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd get Yoko Ono to do the cries of the Nazgūl.


Darkstone
Immortal


Jun 8 2017, 8:29pm

Post #3 of 21 (4292 views)
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Well... [In reply to] Can't Post

Paul McCartney as Frodo and Ringo Starr as Sam?

******************************************

Once Radagast dreamt he was a moth, a moth flitting and fluttering around, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know he was Radagast. Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakably Radagast. But he didn't know if he was Radagast who had dreamt he was a moth, or a moth dreaming he was Radagast. Between Radagast and a moth there must be some distinction! But really, there isn't, because he's actually Aiwendil dreaming he's both Radagast *and* a moth!
-From Radagasti: The Moth Dream


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jun 8 2017, 8:55pm

Post #4 of 21 (4284 views)
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Maybe. [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't think that I would want, at this point, a trilogy of feature-length animated films. However, an animated limited series might be able to touch upon aspects of The Lord of the Rings that Jackson couldn't or wouldn't include in his films. Such a series could explore the measures that Frodo took prior to leaving the Shire. It could include some of the search for Gollum on screen. The four Hobbits could encounter Tom Bombadil and Goldberry as well as the Wight on the Barrow-downs. And we could have the full story of the Scouring of the Shire.

I think that such an adaptation might even be able to incorporate some material from the Appendices, such as parts of "The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen".

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Jun 8 2017, 8:59pm)


squire
Half-elven


Jun 8 2017, 9:27pm

Post #5 of 21 (4281 views)
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Any visual style suggestions? [In reply to] Can't Post

An animated Lord of the Rings would have the freedom to present the story in a non-realistic way. Animation studios often choose a gifted graphic artist or painter to guide them, or else follow their house style as established by the drawing talents of their lead animators. Modern day computer animation studios often have a style dictated by the first efforts of the programmers on their earliest films.

Tolkien himself expressed a desire to see LotR animated more in a Arthur Rackham style than, say, an Enid Blyton or Walt Disney style. The first two were well known British illustrators from his youth:

Illustration by Enid Blyton


Illustration by Arthur Rackham
Of the two, I much prefer Rackham for Tolkien. What do you think?

And then there's Disney. I think Tolkien's hatred for Disney's style stems from the 1930s Mickey Mouse cartoons, and the rather saccharine, cutely medievalized, and outlined "Snow White and the Seven Dwarves", the world's first animated feature film from 1937. But by the 1950s Disney had branched out and matured a bit artistically, and I can't think Tolkien's scornful comment (from a letter about a proposed animated LotR in the late 1950s) would have been applied to this work from Anaheim in this period:

Concept art from '101 Dalmatians', Walt Disney (1961)

And of course Disney is still at it, upholding a fine standard that I think could arguably work for Tolkien:

Concept art from 'Tangled', Walt Disney (2010)

And there are a host of other animators and styles from the past 100 years that we could look at. But I am drawn back to Arthur Rackham, partly because of Tolkien's own feelings -- which should count, given his own talent as a self-taught illustrator -- and partly because I do think his Middle-earth has its firmest roots in late-Victorian medievalism as seen through the Arts and Crafts lens of William Morris, Rackham, and so many other talented artists. I do not think today's audiences need to be spoon-fed an "updated" or "modern" graphic style for a classic like The Lord of the Ring, especially when we have just received a fine live-action version inspired by two artists (Lee and Howe) working strictly in the modern realist tradition.

So, Rackham? Or, or, ... I have always been a fan of Howard Pyle:

Illustration for 'King Arthur' by Howard Pyle (1903)

And just for perspective, here is one I found when looking to see who illustrated William Morris' saga-like stories from the late 1800s, that Tolkien so admired:

Spenser's medieval heroine Britomart, by Walter Crane (1900)



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jun 8 2017, 10:28pm

Post #6 of 21 (4272 views)
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Stylistically Speaking [In reply to] Can't Post

I would prefer more traditional cell animation to a CG approach, though interesting effects can be achieved via computer.

Yes, Arthur Rackham is a good choice, visually. Along those lines I might also suggest Charles Vess.



'Though Vess' style might actually work better for The Hobbit.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


wizzardly
Rohan


Jun 10 2017, 3:52pm

Post #7 of 21 (4143 views)
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Possibly... [In reply to] Can't Post

if the director/animator expresses a dislike of the PJ version, and a much deserved disgust with his Hobbit, I would be interested in seeing what they could do.

"Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time." -Christopher Tolkien


Smaug the iron
Gondor


Jun 10 2017, 3:56pm

Post #8 of 21 (4138 views)
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Possibly [In reply to] Can't Post

if the director/animator expresses a dislike of the Rankin/Bass version, and a much deserved disgust with his Hobbit, I would be interested in seeing what they could do.


wizzardly
Rohan


Jun 10 2017, 4:01pm

Post #9 of 21 (4138 views)
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To be fair... [In reply to] Can't Post

Rankin/Bass never fully animated LotR, but their take on the Hobbit was far superior to PJ's. It was even approved by the Tolkien estate.

"Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time." -Christopher Tolkien


Smaug the iron
Gondor


Jun 10 2017, 4:13pm

Post #10 of 21 (4129 views)
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In my opinion [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
but their take on the Hobbit was far superior to PJ's.

In my opinion PJ version is much better then Rankin/Bass version. Both are fateful to the book in some ways and not fateful in other ways but PJ did it better in my opinion.


In Reply To
It was even approved by the Tolkien estate.

That is no proof that it is a good film.


squire
Half-elven


Jun 10 2017, 4:19pm

Post #11 of 21 (4140 views)
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Tolkien Estate "approved" the R-B Hobbit film script? [In reply to] Can't Post

I was taken by your reference to the Tolkien Estate approving the Rankin-Bass production of The Hobbit. I'd never heard that, and found it surprising as I thought Tolkien had sold the film rights to his two main books outright, with no retained power of approval.

I looked around on the internet, and found other references (8 rewrites by writer Romeo Muller pending TE approval; this information appeared in a TV Guide article) but in all cases the information is given as hearsay.

Do we have any reliable first-hand source for this?

(I happen to agree that the R-B Hobbit adaptation is very good for its market: older children).



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


wizzardly
Rohan


Jun 10 2017, 4:21pm

Post #12 of 21 (4128 views)
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As I've said many times before... [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm a fan of the books first, and in my opinion, the Rankin/Bass version for all of its shortcomings, still presented a more true-to-the-book adaptation. And as a fan of the books and of it's author, the opinions of Tolkien and his son Christopher I hold above all others in matters of adaptions of the stories.

"Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time." -Christopher Tolkien


wizzardly
Rohan


Jun 10 2017, 4:26pm

Post #13 of 21 (4128 views)
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I've read it somewhere, though admittedly I don't remember where... [In reply to] Can't Post

and now that I think of it, it may have even been Tolkien himself who approved the script. If someone can track down this info, I would appreciate it as well.

"Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time." -Christopher Tolkien


Smaug the iron
Gondor


Jun 10 2017, 4:34pm

Post #14 of 21 (4121 views)
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I understand that [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I'm a fan of the books first, and in my opinion, the Rankin/Bass version for all of its shortcomings, still presented a more true-to-the-book adaptation

I understand that you likes Rankin/Bass more, and that is fine, it is your opinion and I respect that. But my problem is that instead of going to this forum to talk about the books and Rankin/Bass version, you are only talking about PJ hobbit trilogy that you are hating. And some times it feals like you like to insult PJ, because that is almost the only things you post about.


wizzardly
Rohan


Jun 10 2017, 4:49pm

Post #15 of 21 (4118 views)
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I must point out... [In reply to] Can't Post

there is a difference between "insult" and "critique". I hated what he did with the Hobbit based upon my love of the book and nothing more.

Now that being said, the OP asks what folks would think of a new animated version of the LotR, and my opinion was that I think a director who did not care much for the PJ version, might be able to produce something I would like to see.

"Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time." -Christopher Tolkien


L. Ron Halfelven
Grey Havens


Jun 10 2017, 6:05pm

Post #16 of 21 (4108 views)
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Looks like Jerry Seinfeld is Haldir: [In reply to] Can't Post

https://twitter.com/...s/872061806885392385


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Jun 10 2017, 8:43pm

Post #17 of 21 (4098 views)
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Tolkien Approval? [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
and now that I think of it, it may have even been Tolkien himself who approved the script. If someone can track down this info, I would appreciate it as well.


That seems very unlikely. J.R.R. Tolkien passed away in September of 1973 and the television adaptation of The Hobbit aired fully four years later in November of 1977. I don't know that even development of the project began early enough for Tolkien to have been able to critique a treatment, outline or teleplay.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


dreamflower
Lorien

Jun 12 2017, 3:36am

Post #18 of 21 (4029 views)
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Much as I might like it [In reply to] Can't Post

I think it is much too soon to do another feature length film either live or animated of LotR or TH.

However, I would LOVE to see feature length versions of a couple of Tolkien's other works:

First and foremost: Roverandom, which would be lovely done in old-fashioned animation, in a style similar to that used in The Snowman, but with scenes showing the family (Father, Mother, and Boys One, Two and Three) filmed in live action, perhaps in black and white. It should have some really lovely music, mellow and soft.

Then there is Farmer Giles of Ham which would do well in rather comical CGI style, and with music that sounds medieval, but played on comical sounding instruments.

And I would love a movie adaptation of The Adventures of Tom Bombadil, again with old-fashioned animation imitating the style Pauline Baynes used, maybe framed by an old hobbit telling the stories to young ones.

Perhaps, down the road a decade or so, there could be another feature length adaptation of LotR or TH. I wish the person who tries it a lot of luck, because I think it would be fun to see--of course, I'll be in my seventies or eighties then, but good things are worth the wait.

Some people call it fanfiction. I call it story-internal literary criticism.


Darkstone
Immortal


Jun 16 2017, 11:23pm

Post #19 of 21 (3936 views)
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No [In reply to] Can't Post

The bizarre myth is that since Zaentz only had the film rights (not the video rights) and that he only had rights for a "tangible" product" (which a television broadcast was not) the Tolkien Estate could and did authorize Rankin-Bass' The Hobbit. (A contradictory addendum to the myth also states that Zaentz only had the film rights to The Fellowship of the Ring and The Two Towers and so the Tolkien Estate also gave Rankin-Bass the rights to The Return of the King.) That's all obvious nonsense.

In truth Zaentz rented Rankin-Bass the film rights to The Hobbit pretty much immediately after he acquired them from United Artists. As for Rankin-Bass' The Return of the King, Zaentz rented them those rights after he decided not to make part two of Bakshi's Lord of the Rings.

The Tolkien Estate had no connection with Rankin-Bass except their usual 7.5% rakeoff.

******************************************

Once Radagast dreamt he was a moth, a moth flitting and fluttering around, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know he was Radagast. Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakably Radagast. But he didn't know if he was Radagast who had dreamt he was a moth, or a moth dreaming he was Radagast. Between Radagast and a moth there must be some distinction! But really, there isn't, because he's actually Aiwendil dreaming he's both Radagast *and* a moth!
-From Radagasti: The Moth Dream


(This post was edited by Darkstone on Jun 16 2017, 11:26pm)


lotr08
Registered User

Jun 27 2017, 9:25pm

Post #20 of 21 (3634 views)
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modern animation [In reply to] Can't Post

I just think it would be cool to see an interpretation of LOTR that takes full advantage of animation. Fewer limitations for sets and looks.
A multiple episode made for video version. 12-15 or so episodes.. IMHO, for a fantasy work like LOTR, animation can better bring out the range of mood (Terror of the Nazgul, weight of the Ring, Aragorn the king versus Aragorn the Ranger) & middle earth characters & races. When I read the books I imagine a Midieval/gothic'ish look.

I'm pretty sure we have all read the books more than once. A new, intelligently done vision of the book would find an audience.


AshNazg
Gondor


Jul 9 2017, 9:41pm

Post #21 of 21 (3348 views)
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How about this... [In reply to] Can't Post

 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erKuzx84uc4

Someone needs to animate that.

 
 

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