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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Movie Marathon Review: The Desolation of Smaug Review
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Ingwion
Lorien


Nov 24 2016, 8:38pm

Post #26 of 42 (1381 views)
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Hmmm [In reply to] Can't Post

It's a very subjective matter, I suppose. For me, I love the cliffhanger and the beginning of BOFA.


It was a foggy day in London, and the fog was heavy and dark. Animate London, with smarting eyes and irritated lungs, was blinking, wheezing, and choking; inanimate London was a sooty spectre, divided in purpose between being visible and invisible, and so being wholly neither. - Our Mutual Friend, Charles Dickens.

It is said by the Eldar that in water there lives yet the echo of the Music of the Ainur more than in any substance that is in this Earth; and many of the Children of Ilúvatar hearken still unsated to the voices of the Sea, and yet know not for what they listen. - The Silmarillion, J. R. R. Tolkien


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 24 2016, 10:35pm

Post #27 of 42 (1370 views)
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Options [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Are those the only two options, though?


There was at least the third option of a more straightforward adaptation that could have been done as two parts even including incorporating Legolas and the subplot of the White Council against the Necromancer. However, Peter Jackson was not interested in that approach.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


dormouse
Half-elven


Nov 24 2016, 10:52pm

Post #28 of 42 (1366 views)
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Well.... [In reply to] Can't Post

Are you sure that this adaptation could have been done in two parts? I'm not convinced that it could - at least, not without unacceptable loss.

If you take the adaptation as it stands, from the beginning of AUJ to the meeting with Bard on the river bank which they say was the end of the two-parter you have something too long for one film. You also have a lot of things which didn't even make it into the theatrical cut but which seem to me to be worth keeping, from little Bilbo's first meeting with Gandalf through to his exploration of Rivendell, his conversation with Elrond, the dwarves' introduction to Beorn, the white stag. So, what is the approach Peter Jackson wasn't interested in which would have condensed all this into one film?

(By the way, in answer to the question you were answering, I agree that there are many more options that just the two. The book could have been adapted in any number of ways. This happens to be Peter Jackson's way).

For still there are so many things
that I have never seen:
in every wood and every spring
there is a different green. . .


KW
Rivendell

Nov 25 2016, 12:18am

Post #29 of 42 (1351 views)
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No, I meant aside from changing the number of movies [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't think they should have made three movies but I was trying to put that aside. I was questioning if a Smaug Cliffhanger really was the only or even best way available to bridge the two movies from the audience perspective.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 25 2016, 12:29am

Post #30 of 42 (1349 views)
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Not THIS Adaptation [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Are you sure that this adaptation could have been done in two parts? I'm not convinced that it could - at least, not without unacceptable loss.


No, not using Peter Jackson's approach. But a two-part movie could certainly have been made, or even a single film if you don't mind a more compressed version of the story.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 25 2016, 12:32am

Post #31 of 42 (1350 views)
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Okay. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I don't think they should have made three movies but I was trying to put that aside. I was questioning if a Smaug Cliffhanger really was the only or even best way available to bridge the two movies from the audience perspective.


All right, given that we did have the three movies then I think that DoS needed to end with either the death of Smaug or the cliffhanger that we got. I don't see another viable option.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


KW
Rivendell

Nov 25 2016, 1:15am

Post #32 of 42 (1341 views)
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I agree [In reply to] Can't Post

But the original poster was actually attaching inevitable audience reactions exclusive to each choice. That is what I mean by there being more options open to the storyteller. The writer could both kill Smaug and present some sort of tension or ending that would excite the audience as to what happens next. That is a third option not allowed consideration in the original post.


Oh, just to be clear, I mean ingwion's post and not No One In Particular's post..


(This post was edited by KW on Nov 25 2016, 1:19am)


DainPig
Gondor


Nov 25 2016, 12:47pm

Post #33 of 42 (1313 views)
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I see other option [In reply to] Can't Post

At the shores of Longlake, people around Bard, "winter is coming". That could work somehow.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Nov 25 2016, 3:57pm

Post #34 of 42 (1301 views)
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Sure. [In reply to] Can't Post

But, really, that's just an epilogue to "Fire and Water" and the demise of Smaug.

"He who lies artistically, treads closer to the truth than ever he knows." -- Favorite proverb of the wizard Ningauble of the Seven Eyes


dormouse
Half-elven


Nov 25 2016, 7:16pm

Post #35 of 42 (1294 views)
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Yes, I agree.... [In reply to] Can't Post

A two-part or one-part adaptation of The Hobbit could be made. But as I would have minded a more compressed version, I'm glad things didn't go that way!

For still there are so many things
that I have never seen:
in every wood and every spring
there is a different green. . .


Eruonen
Valinor


Nov 25 2016, 11:02pm

Post #36 of 42 (1269 views)
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I enjoy DOS however..... [In reply to] Can't Post

the barrel scenes are just too over the top for me....not quite as bad as Goblin Town but still, less would have been more. But, we have Beorn, Thranduil, High Fells, Bard, Laketown, Dol Guldur, Smaug....so yes, quite a bit to like despite some of the excesses.


(This post was edited by Eruonen on Nov 25 2016, 11:08pm)


Eruonen
Valinor


Nov 26 2016, 12:08am

Post #37 of 42 (1265 views)
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I really liked the Gandalf and Sauron duel..... [In reply to] Can't Post

seing the EE again, I agree it is probably the best of the three because is has the role of the Reveal movie....AUJ the intro. DOS the big reveals and then BOFA the concluding.


OldestDaughter
Rohan


Nov 26 2016, 12:52am

Post #38 of 42 (1260 views)
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I like the Sauron and Gandalf duel also. [In reply to] Can't Post

I really liked how when Sauron was revealed, he looked as he did in the FOTR at the battle of the last alliance, and how that formed the Eye in the LOTRs.




"Keen, heart-piercing was her song as the song of the lark that rises from the gates of night and pours its voice among the dying stars, seeing the sun behind the walls of the world; and the song of Lúthien released the bonds of winter, and the frozen waters spoke, and flowers sprang from the cold earth where her feet had passed."


DainPig
Gondor


Nov 26 2016, 3:06pm

Post #39 of 42 (1203 views)
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It sucks [In reply to] Can't Post

It is for me one of the worst parts of the movie. Visually. The light that shines from Gandalf staff is just too over the top, too Harry-potterish. In Lotr the light came from the top of his staff, it was very sutile. In DOS it looks like a damn video-game, visually horrible.


Eruonen
Valinor


Nov 27 2016, 1:06am

Post #40 of 42 (1159 views)
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Light and dark settings = different results [In reply to] Can't Post

Gandalf in daylight
https://hannahscribbles.files.wordpress.com/..._to_minas_tirith.jpg

vs Balrog - as a defensive shield ...not from the top but surrounds him.
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/...st?cb=20111209180754

When facing Sauron...maximum effort
https://youtu.be/eh2WGJYMpRw?t=29


(This post was edited by Eruonen on Nov 27 2016, 1:08am)


dormouse
Half-elven


Nov 27 2016, 10:59am

Post #41 of 42 (1137 views)
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Really? [In reply to] Can't Post

Visually I think the whole confrontation's very impressive - and in other ways too, but as you're stressing the visual..... He's facing the heart of darkness, in Middle-earth terms, so it seems only right for his light to shine more brightly.

As for video games, I can only say what I always say - I've yet to see one that comes anywhere near the visual quality of these films.

For still there are so many things
that I have never seen:
in every wood and every spring
there is a different green. . .


BOSW
The Shire

Dec 6 2016, 8:03pm

Post #42 of 42 (1032 views)
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DOS [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree that this was the best. That's not saying much for me, I don't like the LotR's trilogy much and really disliked TH trilogy intensely. But for what it is, DOS is the most absorbing and rewarding of the three films for me. It does get better with further viewings (I watched it twice). I'm not planning on watching any of these films again but I'll give DOS my highest grade for TH trilogy.


(This post was edited by BOSW on Dec 6 2016, 8:03pm)

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