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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Reading Room:
Were Gildor and his people self-luminous?

Laurelindo
The Shire

Apr 14 2016, 6:21am

Post #1 of 14 (1312 views)
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Were Gildor and his people self-luminous? Can't Post

This part of "The Fellowship Of The Ring" has always confused me:

"The hobbits sat in shadow by the wayside.
Before long the Elves came down the lane towards the valley.
They passed slowly, and the hobbits could see the starlight glimmering on their hair and in their eyes.
They bore no lights, yet as they walked a shimmer, like the light of the moon above the rim of the hills before it rises, seemed to fall about their feet.
They were now silent, and as the last Elf passed he turned and looked towards the hobbits and laughed."


What does this mean?
I have always assumed that Gildor and his companions were wearing bright clothes so that they reflected some of the moonlight, kind of like how we can appear self-luminous when we wear white clothes in a dark room.
But according to the book, the light from the Elves is supposed to "fall about their feet", so is this some kind of "godlike" trait among the Elves, since they are relatively close to the Valar? Tongue


(This post was edited by Laurelindo on Apr 14 2016, 6:29am)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Apr 14 2016, 7:00am

Post #2 of 14 (1275 views)
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Well... [In reply to] Can't Post

These were High Elves, probably Noldor. I think that Tolkien was being literal and this is very much how the Vanyar would have appeared to a resident of Middle-earth.

"Things need not to have happened to be true.
Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure
when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."


- Dream of the Endless


Eldy
Tol Eressea


Apr 14 2016, 2:08pm

Post #3 of 14 (1265 views)
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Calaquendi [In reply to] Can't Post

I think we're meant to take "Light-elves" at least somewhat literally, though usually the description focuses on the eyes. But yeah, living in Valinor during the Years of the Trees does something to Elves.



There's a feeling I get, when I look to the West...



Laurelindo
The Shire

Apr 14 2016, 2:52pm

Post #4 of 14 (1253 views)
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Valinor [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah, Valinor certainly seemed like a marvellous place during the Years Of The Trees.
You would hardly even need any "magical" properties to feel empowered and comforted by a realm that was alternating between shining in intense silver and gold. Cool

I have actually considered suggesting some kind of light show similar to this during Christmas time in my hometown - two very tall Christmas trees some distance away from each other with dazzlingly bright silver and gold lights (each tree with its own colour) that were timed so that they followed the light pattern of the Trees of Valinor (much quicker than the Trees though of course, so that people can actually notice the changes, but still slow enough to be relaxing) - although I guess that this would probably be very expensive, but I am definitely going to install something similar to this in my own home next Christmas.


(This post was edited by Laurelindo on Apr 14 2016, 2:56pm)


Meneldor
Valinor


Apr 14 2016, 3:18pm

Post #5 of 14 (1247 views)
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A related question for the M-e scholars: [In reply to] Can't Post

Did Tolkien's vampires sparkle?


They that go down to the sea in ships, that do business in great waters, these see the works of the Lord, and His wonders in the deep. -Psalm 107


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Apr 14 2016, 3:40pm

Post #6 of 14 (1249 views)
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Do they hobbits see it with their eyes or perceive it in their minds? [In reply to] Can't Post

Note that Tolkien says the light "seemed" to be there. But was it really?

I'm reminded a little of how C. S. Lewis describes the "eldila" in the Space Trilogy.

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Discuss Tolkien's life and works in the Reading Room!
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
How to find old Reading Room discussions.


noWizardme
Half-elven


Apr 14 2016, 4:04pm

Post #7 of 14 (1246 views)
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Tolkien is up to his Fantastic Hesitation thing again, isn't he? [In reply to] Can't Post

Fantastic Hesitation? I don't hesitate to recommend this fantastic explanation by Black Fox

http://newboards.theonering.net/...i?post=833138#833138

~~~~~~
volunteers are still needed to lead chapters for our upcoming ROTK read-through http://newboards.theonering.net/...i?post=893293#893293


A set of links to our Book III discussions can be found here: http://newboards.theonering.net/...i?post=886383#886383

A set of links to the Book IV discussions are here: http://newboards.theonering.net/...i?post=899201#899201

A wonderful list of links to Boook II, Book I and previous read-throughs is curated by our very own 'squire' here http://users.bestweb.net/...-SixthDiscussion.htm


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Apr 14 2016, 4:25pm

Post #8 of 14 (1241 views)
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Gaaah! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Did Tolkien's vampires sparkle?


By Eru and the Valar, I hope not!

"Things need not to have happened to be true.
Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure
when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."


- Dream of the Endless


enanito
Rohan

Apr 14 2016, 5:41pm

Post #9 of 14 (1232 views)
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Product placement [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd say Tolkien was paid by the pound for each mention of the word "seemed":

Quote
And now for your reading pleasure, the Return of the King, sponsored in part by the FACV (Foundation for the Advancement of Copular Verbs), a for-profit organization encouraging non-committal language worldwide



squire
Half-elven


Apr 14 2016, 8:40pm

Post #10 of 14 (1222 views)
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Ask yourself: does starlight glimmer on hair and eyes? [In reply to] Can't Post

Starlight's actually pretty dim. So if starlight can reflect off of the Elves' hair and eyes, I don't see why it can't also selectively illuminate the path before their feet.

It is also possible that with the Elves, the old Aristotelian theory that the eyes give off light rays applies.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Archive: All the TORn Reading Room Book Discussions (including the 1st BotR Discussion!) and Footerama: "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
Dr. Squire introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


= Forum has no new posts. Forum needs no new posts.


Eldy
Tol Eressea


Apr 14 2016, 10:05pm

Post #11 of 14 (1207 views)
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I don't know, does it? [In reply to] Can't Post

Serious question. I live somewhere with too much artificial light to really have any meaningful starlight. Wink



There's a feeling I get, when I look to the West...



Ataahua
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 18 2016, 5:55am

Post #12 of 14 (1129 views)
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Reminds me of a post yeeeeears ago [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

It is also possible that with the Elves, the old Aristotelian theory that the eyes give off light rays applies.


...that discussed how Gollum's shining eyes would have blinded him.

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Ataahua's stories


Elizabeth
Half-elven


Apr 18 2016, 7:14am

Post #13 of 14 (1120 views)
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That green gleem... [In reply to] Can't Post

...seems quite physiologically unlikely, but conveys what it needs to.

We're talking about perception, after all, not physics. If the sight that captures your attention is an Elven figure, it shines... for you.








Darkstone
Immortal


Apr 18 2016, 2:12pm

Post #14 of 14 (1112 views)
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Elves and Dragons are related! [In reply to] Can't Post

He was just about to step out on to the floor when he caught a sudden thin and piercing ray of red from under the drooping lid of Smaug’s left eye.
...

“Revenge!” he snorted, and the light of his eyes lit the the hall from floor to ceiling like scarlet lightning.

-Inside Information

BTW, how the heck do Elves ever sneak up on people or hide? Their eyes glow, their swords glow, it's like they're a walking neon sign going "Here I am!!" Not exactly a positive Darwinian trait.

******************************************
“Begone, foul dwimmerlaik, lord of carrion! Leave the dead in peace!"
"Come not between the Nazgul and his prey! Or he will not slay thee in thy turn. He will bear thee away to the houses of lamentation, beyond all darkness, where thy flesh shall be devoured, and thy shrivelled mind be left naked to the Lidless Eye."
"Do what you will; but I will hinder it, if I may."
"Hinder me? Thou fool. No living man may hinder me!"
"But no living man am I! I am Eowyn, daughter of Theodwyn!”
"Er, really? My mother's name was Theodwyn, too!"
"No way!"
"Way!"
"Wow! Let's stop fighting and be best friends!"
"Cool!!"

-Zack Snyder's The Return of the King

 
 

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