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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
mirkwood spider shelob

thrainseye
The Shire

Oct 2 2015, 1:51am

Post #1 of 19 (2188 views)
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mirkwood spider shelob Can't Post

someone have a size compassion between shelob and mirkwood spiders (movieverse or at least book).

soon the ee will arrive, long live Dain!


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Oct 2 2015, 2:13am

Post #2 of 19 (2143 views)
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Guestimate [In reply to] Can't Post

Other than the films, I don't think there are solid figures, but I would go something like this:
- Mirkwood Spiders: Size of a wolf to a pony.
- Shelob: Size of a grizzly bear or larger.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


thrainseye
The Shire

Oct 2 2015, 2:54am

Post #3 of 19 (2120 views)
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perfetct [In reply to] Can't Post

just wondered


Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 3:12am

Post #4 of 19 (2109 views)
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Size matters [In reply to] Can't Post

Mirkwood spiders – Big

Shelob – Bigger

Ungoliant – Biggest

Or Otaku's guestimate seems as good as any... Shocked

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense
Rohan

Oct 2 2015, 3:26am

Post #5 of 19 (2103 views)
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Taking the hobbits from both (film) series as controls... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think the Mirkwood spiders are roughly 2 1/2 the size of the average hobbit whereas Shelob is about 3 1/2 - 4 (thinking mainly of when Bilbo and Frodo are both encased in webbing, respectively).


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Oct 2 2015, 4:10am

Post #6 of 19 (2079 views)
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Shelob [In reply to] Can't Post

Tolkien described Shelob as "huger than the great hunting beasts" (I'm guessing that he meant something on the order of a lion or tiger); she was large enough to be able to crush Samwise under her vast bulk. My kodiak bear estimate is probably on the conservative side. Shelob might have been as large as a hippopotamus.


I see the demon-spiders of Mirkwood as being at least as large as a wild boar and up to the size of a full-grown horse.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


dormouse
Half-elven


Oct 2 2015, 11:41am

Post #7 of 19 (1932 views)
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I could simplify that list... [In reply to] Can't Post

..just put 'Too big' beside them all! Shocked


Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 12:46pm

Post #8 of 19 (1901 views)
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Film? Film? There’s a Film? [In reply to] Can't Post

The real (book) Bilbo was able to ”beat the creature off with his hands”. (Describing his encounter with the first spider before he drew his sword.)

We could estimate that Bilbo was about 3’ 6” and 110-120 pounds. (Remember, he was a robust little fellow.)
Your “2 ½ the size of the average hobbit” would bring in the Mirkwood spiders in the neighborhood of 280-300 pounds and sized accordingly. This seems excessively large.
I’m 6’ and 165#. I wouldn’t care to take on a 400# spider. No siree Bob! I get the “ickys” just mashing the ½ inch wall crawlers. Mad

Cheers

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 12:57pm

Post #9 of 19 (1884 views)
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That's just too big IMO [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I see the demon-spiders of Mirkwood as being at least as large as a wild boar and up to the size of a full-grown horse.

Although it’s hard to equate a vertical (Hobbit) creature with a horizontal (spider) creature size-wise I see them more Hobbit-sized (or only slightly larger), as I quoted above, Bilbo was able to ”beat the creature off with his hands”.

Agree though with your est. of Shelob. Smile

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



Darkstone
Immortal


Oct 2 2015, 1:03pm

Post #10 of 19 (1881 views)
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Several! [In reply to] Can't Post

At least five, seven if you include the trilogy as individual films!

******************************************

"Mister Frodo, hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good frying pan at your side. I’ve been from one side of this garden to the other, I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to make me believe there's one all-powerful Providence controlling everything. There's no Music of the Ainur that controls my destiny. It's all a lot of simple tricks and nonsense."


(This post was edited by Darkstone on Oct 2 2015, 1:09pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Oct 2 2015, 1:59pm

Post #11 of 19 (1845 views)
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How big is too big? [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Although it’s hard to equate a vertical (Hobbit) creature with a horizontal (spider) creature size-wise I see them more Hobbit-sized (or only slightly larger), as I quoted above, Bilbo was able to ”beat the creature off with his hands”.




Well, are you assuming that all of the spiders were the same size? My upwards estimate was only for the very largest of the creatures, seen in DoS when the Elves come to the aid of the company. Horse-sized, though, might be too large to describe even the largest Mirkwood spiders of the book (although only the Necromancer knows what might have been lurking in the heart of the Forest!).

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 6:06pm

Post #12 of 19 (1765 views)
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I recon I’m assuming the spiders [In reply to] Can't Post

that Bilbo fought would not be “horse-sized” (more Hobbit-sized for a fair fight) as he was able to beat one off (temporarily I suppose) with his hands. So the spiders that captured the Dwarves and the spiders near the Elf-path were probably of a lesser size.

Agreed that there may be much larger spiders down around the Narrows or Dol Guldur and your upwards estimate could well be (textually) correct (as well as DoS which I haven’t seen).


In Reply To
(although only the Necromancer knows what might have been lurking in the heart of the Forest!).

” "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? The Shadow Knows! Mwaa Ha ha!” Cool Cool

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense
Rohan

Oct 2 2015, 6:10pm

Post #13 of 19 (1768 views)
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Surely we can agree the films are real [In reply to] Can't Post

I have 'em sitting right next to me on my shelf. Wink

As I was sticking strictly to the movies, I maintain my estimation of the size of these much-too-large-wherever-they're-found arachnids. Considering that a de-legged Mirkwood spider is about the same size as Bombur (seen easily perched upon his robust stomach) and that - while he is, of course, the largest of the dwarves - Bilbo is a bit smaller than all of them, I think 2 1/2 times larger than the average hobbit is a fair guess.

Shelob, in contrast, can hold Frodo up in midair and spin her web upon him with little effort and almost no movement from her stationed limbs, and the simple mass above him is just dauntingly huge (seen even more clearly in the wide shot where Sam confronts the 'terror').


Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 7:21pm

Post #14 of 19 (1748 views)
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Psst, TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Film? Film? There’s a Film?



In Reply To
Surely we can agree the films are real
I have ‘em sitting right next to me on my shelf.


It’s called “sarcasm”. Being a book-firster of which there are a couple here on TORn I tend to jump in where I’m uninvited on occasion. Which is fair game as all opinions are of a value. (Even mine (occasionally) and yours.)) Yes, this is “The Hobbit” Movie Discussion Board but most boards (if the thread is long enough) tend to delve into both the films and the books.

And BTW WELCOME to TORn. Smile Enjoy yourself and express your thoughts early and often!

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



Bumblingidiot
Rohan

Oct 2 2015, 7:38pm

Post #15 of 19 (1734 views)
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If I'm remembering correctly, [In reply to] Can't Post

Shelob's hide is too thick for Sam to be able to puncture it with Sting - it requires her putting her full weight down onto the sword for it to injure her. That suggests she's in a completely different league to the Mirkwood spiders. OK, that's not much help... I tend to spend as little time as possible thinking about spiders.

"Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear."


Susan
Bree


Oct 2 2015, 9:46pm

Post #16 of 19 (1695 views)
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Spider Sizes [In reply to] Can't Post

Considering the scene in ROTK when Shelob has Sam pinned up on the wall, she looks to be about 7 feet long, with a legspan of maybe 14-16 feet and a height of about 5 feet (I'm using Sam's height of 3'6'' as a measure, but these numbers may be a bit large). As for the Mirkwood spiders, like Bracegirdle said, they look to be more hobbit sized: maybe 4 feet in length, 10 in legspan, and 3 in height.
But overall, I wholeheartedly agree with Dormouse. Too big. (Actually, all spiders are too big for my taste Unimpressed).


TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense
Rohan

Oct 2 2015, 10:16pm

Post #17 of 19 (1684 views)
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I understand sarcasm just fine [In reply to] Can't Post

That's why my response was something of a "joke" (tried to use the winky to give it away). Smile

Thank you for the kind welcome! I've lurked on these boards for quite some time and I know what a special community this is - just glad to finally be a part of it!


(This post was edited by TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense on Oct 2 2015, 10:17pm)


Bracegirdle
Valinor


Oct 2 2015, 11:35pm

Post #18 of 19 (1672 views)
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Ok, we good [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
That's why my response was something of a "joke" (tried to use the winky to give it away). Smile


And I started off being a bit of a smarty-pants. Apologies for that, as I was fairly sure you were aware that my comment “There’s a film?” was sarcastic, and as your very TORn-handle is also somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Wink Wink

Hope to see you "de-lurk" often. We need lottsa folks with some "Sense" Shocked.

”. . . computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.”
- Popular Mechanics, 1949



TheOnlyOneAroundWithAnySense
Rohan

Oct 5 2015, 8:36pm

Post #19 of 19 (1438 views)
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Oh, no apologies necessary [In reply to] Can't Post

I plan to be around for the long haul - I just hope I can live up to my name! Cool

 
 

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