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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Fili's death scene: inside story
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Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


Sep 6 2015, 5:31pm

Post #51 of 57 (950 views)
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Exactly. [In reply to] Can't Post

Kili and Fili could have been wearing clown suits, and the whole thing could have been shot upside down. Who knows how insane and out of place it could have been.


dormouse
Half-elven


Sep 6 2015, 5:32pm

Post #52 of 57 (942 views)
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Yes [In reply to] Can't Post

Seems to me that's the clear implication of that shot of Thorin standing looking out across the battlefield to the orcs breaking up and running for their lives. The whole point of Ravenhill was that he saw Azog's death as the only way the orcs could be defeated: he manages to summon up enough strength at the last to look back to the main battlefield and see that his strategy worked. Then he can let go.

And I agree with everything else you've said too!


Avandel
Half-elven


Sep 6 2015, 7:39pm

Post #53 of 57 (894 views)
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What? [In reply to] Can't Post

I was being serious!!!!Wink - I mean there was that whole part of the camera zooming into an extreme close-up of a single ice crystal on Bilbo's eyelash, that falls away in slow-mo as it is cast to the ground when he SSSSSSSLLLLLLLLLOOOOWLY opens his eyes, and the sun is breaking through the clouds, and then he hears Thorin's voice in his head, with this "mystical" shot of Thorin's soul becoming the sky.....

I mean, if only PJ hadn't cut all this, I would have really felt I got my money's worth!
******************************
OK, I'll stop now.CoolCoolCool



Avandel
Half-elven


Sep 6 2015, 7:54pm

Post #54 of 57 (885 views)
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*bows* and [In reply to] Can't Post

THIS!!!!!!

Quote

The whole point of Ravenhill was that he saw Azog's death as the only way the orcs could be defeated


Which, I think was accurate "to cut the head off the snake". Even LOTR depicts orcs as tending to bicker and fight among themselves, and without a strong figure like Azog to fear IMO they would just be rabble - and even the dwarves had rallied as well as the people in Dale.

In the film, it's even IMO the way IMO Thorin falls - as RA would say later, Thorin could just let it go. I'll also add tho it's probably been said, I found the end shots of Thorin sitting on Azog and then shoving the blade down - and then the shot under the ice - for me were spectacularly effective - e.g., it's over, finally.

And well, the end - I don't watch that without crying. EverFrownFrownFrown. Which I suppose, for me, is one of the highest compliments I could pay to Martin Freeman and Richard Armitage, and to PJ with IMO the sensitivity of the handling of that scene, which was much appreciated. (I re-watched BOFA last night, and their relationship just struck me as depicted e.g. Thorin in the cells, and then "not our only hope" - and then Bilbo with the keysHeartHeartHeart)


Spriggan
Tol Eressea

Sep 6 2015, 8:01pm

Post #55 of 57 (882 views)
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Or it could have been great, or rubbish, or anything in between. [In reply to] Can't Post

I suspect this is why, on the whole, reviewers watch films before deciding if they are good or not.


Arannir
Valinor


Sep 6 2015, 8:57pm

Post #56 of 57 (847 views)
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I would like to see that too. [In reply to] Can't Post

Generally though, I don't think one needs to see that to be able to imagine a version of that scene and state that one thinks it could have been better (for one's personal taste) than what we got.

Immensely disappointed by the Ravenhill sequence, it is natural, I guess, that I am more inclined to contemplate what could have been.



"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien

We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.



Yva
Lorien


Sep 10 2015, 9:12pm

Post #57 of 57 (656 views)
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That's a sweet story [In reply to] Can't Post

What a nice story.

I think all the dwarves deserve their own spin-off movies, but Fili is my absolute favourite (and yes the looks is entirely relevant). I like to imagine what's behind that bold, self-confident exterior, what worries and uncertainties, and I think Dean is a great fit as he himself is a bit of a gentle looking fellow, well at first glance anyway.

I'm in two minds when it comes to the death scene, though. Putting aside there's clearly some bit missing (him being hurt in a fight that we didn't see), I change my opinion every few weeks and I both love and hate the way it was done, mostly just being frustrated it had to be done at all. I was also reminded of similar discussions concerning the death of a certain character in the Harry Potter series, who fell through a mirror. Basically, in one sentence he was still there, fighting, in the next, he wasn't, and he was gone and there was nothing left and no reconciliation and no meaning to it. JKR later said, in a response to complaining fans, that, quite obviously, this is what war is like.

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