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NManfredi
Rivendell
Aug 29 2015, 11:19am
Post #2 of 13
(1640 views)
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You're right, I just saw it. And I know that many people disagree with this, but personally I think that The Hobbit movies needed to show more blood. When you take away blood from the scenes that it should have been there, you lose a lot of realism and things feel more unnatural. There was a lot of complaints in this area and I think it's a big step forward that Middle-Earth movies can show this. I'm excited to see how it turns out.
"Is it not a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt for so small a thing? So small a thing! And I have seen it only for an instant in the house of Elrond! Could I not have a sight of it again?"
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Avandel
Half-elven
Aug 29 2015, 4:48pm
Post #3 of 13
(1463 views)
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Been discussed before - and IMO adding some realism is why (yes, these are fantasy films and so on but still.. ). If as in AUJ Thorin has really sunk Orcrist into a warg, when he pulls the blade loose I expect a SMEAR of goo on it.
Doesn't have to be Sweeney Todd or Rise of an Empire or Kill Bill - just some reasonable stickiness - and there seems to be no problem with blood being on characters' faces already which makes no sense.
Yeah for the R rating ! Now they can quit messing about and put some logical good goo about - like when Thorin or Kili or Dwalin take off an orc head, we can have some tasteful splatter, and quit messing about. 
More blood!!!!!
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NManfredi
Rivendell
Aug 29 2015, 5:03pm
Post #4 of 13
(1448 views)
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I agree completely! It doesn't have to be 300 or anything like that, but there are things that bugged me when I saw the battles throughout The Hobbit trilogy, and one of them was that some scenes definitely needed more blood to be taken for real. As when Fili is stabbed in the chest and no blood comes out from it, and then when you see at Azog's blade, still nothing. I know this is a concept that was brought from the LOTR movies, but I think it's outdated. People ask more and more for realism in movies, and things like that diminish a scene's power of impact, imo.
"Is it not a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt for so small a thing? So small a thing! And I have seen it only for an instant in the house of Elrond! Could I not have a sight of it again?"
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Avandel
Half-elven
Aug 29 2015, 5:58pm
Post #5 of 13
(1413 views)
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It has always bothered me in AUJ when weapons are pulled loose there is NOTHING - and to the films' credit, and the Chronicles books and the actors mention this, it's true that the actors ARE hitting something - like RA said once, the body "vibrates" or moves differently when you actually strike or stab something - e.g. you can't fake that.
So why go to all that effort, and spoil it with squeaky clean swords? Mercifully the beautiful closeup of Thorin with Orcrist on the ice cliff has Orcrist smeared with sticky black:
That IMO great shot, in time, - as maybe my first or second view it wouldn't have registered (or maybe it would on an IMAX screen) - would have started bothering me, I think, because Thorin pulls this from a creature's chest and it is all shiny-bright? NO.
And if the worry was that young children would be disturbed, again, we aren't talking loving closeups of blood flying through the air in slow motion, that seems to be so popular with some directors. Just a SMEAR or a dark pool or shadow where logically you are going to expect some - and not just on characters' faces and clothes.
Tho paradoxically it's OK to show a fallen teenager in Dale with blood on their mouth - sigh. But I think the R rating is finally a chance for PJ & co. to be able to stop walking on eggshells, as it were.
Tho to be fair, I think the fallen in Dale and some other scenes did work towards that realism - e.g. when Thranduil is looking at the fallen in Dale - I don't have an issue with that scene, and even Thranduil has orc blood on his face. If you look closely - what Thranduil is seeing is pretty grim (I was looking at some good resolution images yesterday). I think the elves lying there - so pale, with pools of dark around them - very well done IMO - as well as the chaotic still sadness of it.
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Otaku-sempai
Immortal
Aug 29 2015, 7:20pm
Post #6 of 13
(1382 views)
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The MPAA is reasonably forgiving about blood unless there are great gouts of it. The inclusion of gore is more likely to lead to a stronger rating. There is no good reason why we shouldn't have seen a bit more blood on blades and bodies except that Jackson may have been mindful of the story's origin as a children's bedtime tale.
"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock
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NManfredi
Rivendell
Aug 29 2015, 8:00pm
Post #7 of 13
(1359 views)
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I still don't buy the theory of the added "gory" elements. Maybe it has something to do with the rumor of Alfrid getting thrown to a Troll's mouth, but unless they linger on that moment for about 10 seconds and show some juice coming out the Trolls mouth (which I highly doubt it), I wouldn't consider that to be gory. My guess is that they added more blood and some more heads that were chopped and that's why it went up, but you could be right as well.
"Is it not a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt for so small a thing? So small a thing! And I have seen it only for an instant in the house of Elrond! Could I not have a sight of it again?"
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Otaku-sempai
Immortal
Aug 29 2015, 8:24pm
Post #8 of 13
(1349 views)
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Alfrid's fate is a bit more than just rumor; Jackson's plans for the character's demise were detailed in the fifth Hobbit Chronicles tome.
I more-or-less include the possibility of more decapitations into the category of gore, although I might be stretching definitions a bit. But I'm fairly sure that Jackson did specifically mention cutting down on the head-choppings for the theatrical cut.
"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock
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NManfredi
Rivendell
Aug 29 2015, 9:41pm
Post #9 of 13
(1332 views)
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Then, THAT might be the real reason why the rating went up. if there're is in fact more head chopping that in the TE, then they might have a point. Although I kind of disagree on the MPAA rating basing their decision just on that and the added blood –if it finally is the case. It's not like we have not seen a lot of chopped heads throughout the trilogy, and none of them has being for a human or Elf, rather to a fantastic creature that does not resemble our species.
On the other thing you mentioned, I didn't know Alfrid's death was on the chronicles. Perhaps it will be in the EE finally. I would love to see that.
"Is it not a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt for so small a thing? So small a thing! And I have seen it only for an instant in the house of Elrond! Could I not have a sight of it again?"
(This post was edited by NManfredi on Aug 29 2015, 9:44pm)
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Eleniel
Tol Eressea
Aug 29 2015, 10:03pm
Post #10 of 13
(1319 views)
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Yeah, especially if Dain's red axe is reinstated! 
"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort
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Smaug the iron
Gondor
Aug 29 2015, 10:07pm
Post #11 of 13
(1317 views)
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In the EE trailer at the new Dain scene he has still his hammer.
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NManfredi
Rivendell
Aug 29 2015, 10:10pm
Post #12 of 13
(1314 views)
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But we would also have TONS of more chopping if that's was the case! haha (which I can't say I wouldn't like)
"Is it not a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt for so small a thing? So small a thing! And I have seen it only for an instant in the house of Elrond! Could I not have a sight of it again?"
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QuackingTroll
Valinor
Aug 29 2015, 10:16pm
Post #13 of 13
(1313 views)
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Bilbo's line "One day I'll remember -- everything that happened, the good, the bad Those that survived and those that did not and how lucky I am that I made it home"
The "Those that survived..." line is from the theatrical trailer and I doubt we'll hear that line even in the EE. Which suggests some of this marathon trailer is taken from the theatrical trailer rather than the EE.
So it's still a vague possibility that the axe is back in. But not a likely one.
(This post was edited by QuackingTroll on Aug 29 2015, 10:17pm)
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