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Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 4:52pm
Post #1 of 65
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What's wrong with this picture?
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So, here is the blu-ray cover for the BOT5A EE:
Well my first thought was, it looks a lot better than that stupid cover with Bilbo standing on the carrock from AUJ, but then I got to thinking, something's missing. We have Bilbo front and center, which is appropriate considering the movie IS called "The Hobbit." We have Gandalf, also appropriate since he was in all 3 movies AND is the biggest connection to the LoTR trilogy. We also have Thorin, also appropriate since it's largely his tragic story, and Bard, a pretty significant character in the book. But then there's a problem: Not one, not 2 but THREE Elves on the cover, only one of which was in the book! Now, I have often said I don't mind Legolas being in the movies, since he was a Mirkwood Elf, and I don't mind Tauriel either (surely there were female Elves!), but I don't think either belong here! Who DOES belong there instead? IMO, Dain should be here, in fact since the movie is called "Battle of the FIVE Armies," shouldn't the leader of each army be featured??? Now, Thranduil is indeed the leader of one of those armies - the Elven army - and Bard represents the army of Man, so why not Dain as leader of the Dwarf army??? Yes I know we have Thorin, who has a much bigger part, but he had a company of 13 Dwarves which is not an army (although they were apparently 13 very BADASS Dwarves, considering even the Trolls backed up when they came charging out ). And to complete this, we should also have Azog and Bolg, as leaders of the two Orc armies. Yeah, I know, what about the Eagles, weren't THEY the 5th army? I dunno, we could debate that, and I suppose we could actually debate whether there were 5 armies or 6, but I'll save that for another day. The point is, this cover is once again heavily skewed toward the Elves at the expense of the Dwarves - am I right? So, I respectfully request that some talented TORner with Photoshop (*cough* Avandel) please see if he or she could put together a cover for the Battle of 5 Armies that actually depicts all 5 armies, and not just the Elves! By all means, keep Bilbo, Gandalf and Thorin, but PLEASE, can we have some more Dwarves???
Proud member of the BOFA Denial Association
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Spriggan
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 5:04pm
Post #2 of 65
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What's the purpose of the picture?
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In your view.
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Shagrat
Gondor
Aug 26 2015, 5:04pm
Post #3 of 65
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Tends to betray WB's agenda IMO. There can be no denying it here.
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Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 5:07pm
Post #4 of 65
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Well clearly it's marketing - whoever is in charge of the marketing thinks that the Elves are the more important characters in the movie. Even more important than Fili & Kili, who also have tragic deaths, but I'm not suggesting they should be on the cover either. IMO, if you are marketing a movie called "Battle of 5 Armies" then there should be a representative of 5 armies to go along with the title.
Proud member of the BOFA Denial Association
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Spriggan
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 5:10pm
Post #5 of 65
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It's purpose is marketing. And so it shows, not the most important characters, but the most marketable characters. That means recognition - of the character and the actors. It's as simple as that, I'm afraid.
These sorts of things are not making narrative judgements!
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Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 5:28pm
Post #6 of 65
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Most marketable in THEIR opinion
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not mine. Of course, everyone's got an opinion, don't they? And I know it's not really my call, I'm just a fan that buys the product, no one important
Proud member of the BOFA Denial Association
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Bracegirdle
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 5:28pm
Post #7 of 65
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Agreed! It’s all about the Do-Re-Mi . . . $ $ $
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Its purpose is marketing.
Boromir looked in surprise at Bilbo, but the laughter died on his lips when he saw that all the others regarded the old hobbit with grave respect. Only Glóin smiled, but his smile came from old memories.
-JRR Tolkien
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Spriggan
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 5:35pm
Post #8 of 65
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Well, in their professional opinion, yes.
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I'm not suggesting that you are unimportant but I am guessing that you don't have a background in the global marketing of films.
They, assuming it is the same teams, give or take, seem to have been successful in their marketing of the previous films' various releases. I'm not quite sure why we would take any of our lay opinions on such matters as more likely to produce higher sales? It seems a long shot, surely?
(This post was edited by Spriggan on Aug 26 2015, 5:39pm)
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EgyptRaider
The Shire
Aug 26 2015, 5:44pm
Post #9 of 65
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It makes more sense then your suggestions
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If you would talk about some mural artwork depicting the battle a symbolic use of the five armies you might have a point, but this is not it.
This is a Blu-ray cover which simply shows the 7 biggest characters of the movie (pretty sure all of them have more lines than any of the other characters you suggested) their role in the battle or the book might be lesser compared to characters like Bolg or Fili and Kili but this is an artpiece that is supposed to represent the movie, and, like them or not, it is representing the most important characters of the movie.
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CathrineB
Rohan
Aug 26 2015, 5:46pm
Post #11 of 65
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I think it's a pretty awful cover and yes because of all the elves. The only one who rightfully should be there is Thranduil along with some of the dwarves as well as Bard. I'm so sick of the focus on the elves.  Way to go to turn your fans against you.
This one's a bit messy I agree, but at least it involves more than just one dwarf.
(This post was edited by CathrineB on Aug 26 2015, 5:47pm)
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Darkstone
Immortal
Aug 26 2015, 5:48pm
Post #12 of 65
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...since the movie is called "Battle of the FIVE Armies," shouldn't the leader of each army be featured???
...since it's called "Battle of the Five Armies", not "Leaders of the Five Armies", the cover should be a color glossy map of the battlefield with circles and arrows and a paragraph next to each one explaining what their significance is, but that would be an awfully busy cover, and besides they'd probably have to include a magnifying glass just so you could read the paragraphs, but in the end it wouldn't sell as many copies as one with a cover with Elves on the cover, and really we ought to be grateful Warner showed some restraint and didn't add more Elves like Galadriel, Elrond, Figwit, and a few random Elf extras, but despite all that I'm sure the spirit of Hugo Dyson would heartily agree with you about the addition of more Elves.
******************************************
That hobbit has a pleasant face,
His private life is a disgrace.
I really could not tell to you,
The awful things that hobbits do.
Things that your paper never prints
They only speak of them in hints.
They have such lost, degraded souls,
No wonder they inhabit holes;
When such depravity is found,
It only can live underground.
I really dare not name to you,
The awful things that hobbits do.
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QuackingTroll
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 5:49pm
Post #13 of 65
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Your opinion is invalid because you can't prove otherwise
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Blah blah defensive semantics.
I refuse to have an opinion on the quality of these products and instead base my tastes on the popularity of said product and the professionalism of the product's creators.
(This post was edited by QuackingTroll on Aug 26 2015, 5:51pm)
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Spriggan
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 5:58pm
Post #15 of 65
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The effectiveness of marketing isn't a matter of opinion.
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It's measured in sales figures. I'm not sure anyone rational would say anything else.
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Susan
Bree
Aug 26 2015, 6:01pm
Post #17 of 65
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Like some people have said, from a marketing perspective, it makes more sense to have characters that the audience already knows/recognizes/likes. Dain would have looked great on the cover, but I think the general public would have been wondering, who's that dwarf again?. And the general public, more than Tolkien fans, is probably the biggest market for these films.
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Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 6:01pm
Post #18 of 65
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I hate to be harsh, but I think people get too hung up on each film's cover art being representative of the book. But these aren't the book. And, like it or not, the characters on the cover art are, in the film, the most important.
Putting all that aside, being underwhelmed by DVD/Blu-ray cover art is not limited to these films. Studios, in general, suck at designing cover art, packaging, etc. The best examples are usually when they stick to the Theatrical Poster Art (and even many of those underwhelm these days). Usually, however, the departments in charge of the home video releases want to put their own stamp on it, and we get photoshopped atrocities. 
"The danger with any movie that does as well as this one does is that the amount of money it's making and the number of awards that it's got becomes almost more important than the movie itself in people's minds. I look at that as, in a sense, being very much like the Ring, and its effect on people. You know, you can kind of forget what we were doing, if you get too wrapped up in that."
- Viggo Mortensen
(This post was edited by Aragorn the Elfstone on Aug 26 2015, 6:02pm)
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dormouse
Half-elven
Aug 26 2015, 6:03pm
Post #19 of 65
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Depends who's asking and why, I suppose....
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Someone was given the job of designing a picture represent the film (and sell it). Someone who might not even have seen the film - they just produce designs according to the brief that's given to them. I presume WB have a marketing department same as publishers do and it would be their choice. So they've picked three main characters Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin (all good choices, I think) and as many others as fit the design. Whether they're in the book or not won't have been a criterion - they're in the film the design is intended to sell. I'd say Legolas is there because he's instantly recognisable - like Gandalf.
Is the picture fit for purpose? Yes, I think it probably is. I'm betting they know from the sales of all their various merchandise which characters have most crowd appeal. From where they're standing there's nothing wrong with the picture at all.
Around here, of course, the preponderence of elves over dwarves tends not to go down all that well........ !
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QuackingTroll
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 6:04pm
Post #20 of 65
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You're the only one discussing sales figures...
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The rest of us are discussing our personal opinions on the image. Successful or unsuccessful no-one cares, a bad picture is a bad picture. Many of us enjoy the cover art on our DVDs from an artistic standpoint, which is why steelbooks are so successful (because they're often aesthetically attractive) so we should be allowed to voice our opinions without being told we're wrong because we're not marketing experts.
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Spriggan
Tol Eressea
Aug 26 2015, 6:09pm
Post #21 of 65
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If you look up the thread I think you will see that you are incorrect. The posts (to which I was replying) talk about how "marketable" the image is (and indeed whose opinions we should follow on what makes it more marketable).
That is not discussing it as a matter of individual artistic taste. I work have to be a total nutjob to suggest that only marketing experts can have a taste in pictures, wouldn't I?
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QuackingTroll
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 6:19pm
Post #22 of 65
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They should just put a big picture of Legolas..
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A big 3D image of Legolas jumping up the falling rocks. That'd sell well.
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balbo biggins
Rohan
Aug 26 2015, 6:30pm
Post #23 of 65
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film gripes aside, this cover simply portrays characters that the film is mostly about.
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Arannir
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 6:59pm
Post #24 of 65
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... for my aesthetic feeling the picture could use a mother character to the right or Tauriel moved more to the middle... It seems a bit asymmetrical like this.
But speaking characters... The movie is mostly about those portrayed. So pretty much appropriate. Actually Alfrid would kind of make sense on it as well.
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
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Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor
Aug 26 2015, 7:16pm
Post #25 of 65
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Well I'm not basing it on sales
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Okay let's just throw out the marketing thing - I regret that I ever answered that question. It is my personal opinion that this cover doesn't represent the film very well. I would have PREFERRED something more balanced and a little less Elf-centric. And I was very serious about hoping someone could do a mock-up featuring the characters I mentioned originally, since I don't have Photoshop. Just a suggestion, that's all.
Proud member of the BOFA Denial Association
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