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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
DOS: Smaugs 'cool down sound'

Legolas_Shoehorn
Bree


May 19 2015, 5:58am

Post #1 of 19 (2148 views)
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DOS: Smaugs 'cool down sound' Can't Post

Dwarf Forges: when Bilbo pulls the lever and tons of water hit Smaug, we see that his 'ready-to-breath-fire' chest cools down ... but the sound PJ used to underline what happened is somewhat dumb.

That specific sound always takes me out of the movie. To me it sounds like a 'real' machinery of some kind cools down and not an organic being. We all know from the DOS Appendices that the sound design of the last twenty minutes was rushed, but did they really thought that was a proper sound effect?

My English is not that good, my Elvish is better ;-)


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


May 19 2015, 6:13am

Post #2 of 19 (2091 views)
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proper sound effects [In reply to] Can't Post

If they thought using the Wilhelm Scream for Thrain's death was okay, who knows what was going on in the sound department.


AshNazg
Gondor


May 19 2015, 8:11am

Post #3 of 19 (2052 views)
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Theres also a few times where Smaug's wing hits the floor without making a sound [In reply to] Can't Post

Was hoping theyd fix it in the EE, but they didnt.


arithmancer
Grey Havens


May 19 2015, 1:47pm

Post #4 of 19 (1975 views)
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Hmm. [In reply to] Can't Post

This so did not register or take me out of anything that I am not sure what you are even talking about.



dormouse
Half-elven


May 19 2015, 1:57pm

Post #5 of 19 (1967 views)
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Same here.... [In reply to] Can't Post

But then, a lot of the posts here at the moment seem to be about a film I didn't see...


Bishop
Gondor


May 19 2015, 2:42pm

Post #6 of 19 (1948 views)
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haha! [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Bishop
Gondor


May 19 2015, 3:42pm

Post #7 of 19 (1924 views)
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My feeling on the wilhelm withstanding...... [In reply to] Can't Post

I went back to listen to the sound you're talking about with Smaug. And I think it's not a machine at all. To me it sounds exactly like it should, which is an extremely high temperature source being suddenly extinguished. There is crackling and a high whizzing sound which is precisely what you could expect from any organic material moving instantly from one extreme temperature to the other and the stresses that would naturally follow. Any additional machinery noises can no doubt be attributed to the fact that they're actually in the forges which are fully activated. But I'm not hearing anything machine like in that moment specifically attributed to Smaug anyways. Actually I think the sound there is quite brilliant!


Bombadil
Half-elven


May 19 2015, 3:53pm

Post #8 of 19 (1911 views)
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We must remember these are PROFESSIONALS [In reply to] Can't Post

some likely have a Bank of sounds collected over
their years of doing this & search through these Banks.

Have you ever worked one of those Sound Boards?
The infinite combinations modulated of WHAT? 64 or more
possibilities.?

It's beyond belief!
Crazy

ADD in the Awesome Foley artists,
& by Committee
with Pj's input...YOU..

...got to go "WHOA?"

Cool

www.charlie-art.biz
"What Your Mind can conceive... charlie can achieve"


Legolas_Shoehorn
Bree


May 19 2015, 3:59pm

Post #9 of 19 (1910 views)
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Actually ... [In reply to] Can't Post

... you can here the same sound effect (of course shorter and of toned down in volume) when Bolg is sniffling for the Dwarves at the shores of the great lake!

It's not just the sound effect that bothers me. Maybe it's the fact that Smaugs ability to breath fire can simply be avoided by throwing tons of water at him. This implies that in a certain way Smaug is vulnerable by outer influences (in this case Water).

So Water can interrupt his 'main weapon' but Molten Gold does nothing?!

My English is not that good, my Elvish is better ;-)

(This post was edited by Legolas_Shoehorn on May 19 2015, 4:00pm)


Bofur01
Lorien


May 19 2015, 4:03pm

Post #10 of 19 (1899 views)
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Water stored underground for a few hundred years is probably pretty cool... [In reply to] Can't Post

Whereas molten gold is pretty warm....


Bishop
Gondor


May 19 2015, 4:12pm

Post #11 of 19 (1891 views)
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I guess that's what you'd call the biology of fantasy [In reply to] Can't Post

At some point Smaug had to be designed and the logistics of his fire breathing needed to be considered. Behind the scenes reveals some interesting discussions about this, such as how the flames are created inside his body, or is he spewing some kind of flammable liquid and hitting it with a biological pilot light on the way out. Then of course at some point the most reasonable thing to do is throw your hands up in the air and resign yourself to the fact that you're creating a fire breathing dragon, so it doesn't have make perfect biological sense. All that said, I'm perfectly happy to accept that water thwarts the effect, whereas some other molten liquid would not. Just don't get me started on why they took away his front legs though.


(This post was edited by Bishop on May 19 2015, 4:21pm)


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


May 19 2015, 5:45pm

Post #12 of 19 (1869 views)
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Balrogs [In reply to] Can't Post

Balrogs have a similar problem.


Bombadil
Half-elven


May 20 2015, 3:28pm

Post #13 of 19 (1726 views)
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..."they took away his front legs"...MAYBE we should ASK [In reply to] Can't Post

Everyone here, about their Opinion on that...

Personally Bom was FINE with it for a few reasons...

1. Allowed Smaug more room.
2. Allowed him to be different from the Many dragons that have been depicted.
3. Using his front claws as part of his wings? made his Climbing around
a bit more Threatening...
4. Sure, It's Not Tolkien, @least for Bomby it was an Improvement.
Crazy

www.charlie-art.biz
"What Your Mind can conceive... charlie can achieve"


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


May 20 2015, 4:20pm

Post #14 of 19 (1715 views)
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They didn't remove Smaug's forelegs. [In reply to] Can't Post

They just attached his wings to them.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


Bishop
Gondor


May 20 2015, 4:54pm

Post #15 of 19 (1706 views)
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This is actually not true [In reply to] Can't Post

They removed his forelegs. There is an entire section in the BTS about doing exactly that. The original Smaug design that was the lead contender for a while was this, which is from Weta. Removing the forelegs meant redesigning the anatomy basically from the ground up, making him more like a bat.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


May 20 2015, 5:00pm

Post #16 of 19 (1703 views)
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It is a matter of interpretation. [In reply to] Can't Post

The filmmakers did alter Smaug from a dragon with six limbs (including his wings) to a dragon with four limbs. But now his wings have been moved forward to also act as his forelegs. And, yes, it is a substantial redesign.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


Bishop
Gondor


May 20 2015, 5:09pm

Post #17 of 19 (1692 views)
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I'm just making a distinction between forearms and wings [In reply to] Can't Post

And they made this distinction as well in the BTS I believe. Anyways, I always find it interesting that he had distinct forearms in AUJ and then not in the EE.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


May 20 2015, 5:26pm

Post #18 of 19 (1686 views)
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Indeed. [In reply to] Can't Post

Other filmmakers, upon settling on a similar redesign, would have probably altered the original version of the movie for home video and any subsequent re-releases, director's cuts or extended editions.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


Bishop
Gondor


May 20 2015, 5:52pm

Post #19 of 19 (1675 views)
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I think the problem [In reply to] Can't Post

was that the decision was made well after AUJ TE was released on home video on all formats. I know that filmmakers have to prioritize when faced with literally thousands of tough decisions before and as they film. But it's astonishing that they hadn't figured out a design for Smaug until after the release of AUJ TE on home video. I would think that Smaug's design would be one of the first things they locked down in pre-production.

 
 

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