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marary
Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 8:47am
Post #27 of 41
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Legolas walking on snow was used in LOTR
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It's such a subtle background thing, though. I thought it was hilarious how NOT pointed out this was. He was just walking on top of snow while the other characters sank. It was casual. 
What I meant was more of Legolas's superhero level, ah, acrobatics. The falling rocks. It looked way OTT! I doubt Tolkien wrote anything like that... but I may be surprised!
I'm curious... I haven't read the Silmarilliion, but does Tauriel's character draw much on any of the elves? Other than have her stand as a rather lovely representation of some elven-cultural points in the Feast of Starlight scene? How lore-friendly is she really?
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BlackFox
Half-elven
Apr 3 2015, 9:23am
Post #28 of 41
(877 views)
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I had to re-watch the credits twice as I missed it the first time around. 
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arithmancer
Grey Havens
Apr 3 2015, 11:54am
Post #29 of 41
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Depends on the emphasis one puts on the "facts" of the world. For example, Elf women who have never borne a child are said to be as athletic as the Elf men, able to compete with them in athletic feats, making Tauriel's physical feats entirely plausible within that world. On the other hand, Elf women are also said, as a cultural point, not to fight except in the last extreme, whereas Tauriel does so as her profession, in what is nominally peacetime.
Likewise - the Dwarves are a race originally formed not by the "one God" of that world, Eru Illuvatar, but by Aule, the Vala (powerful spiritual being below Eru Illuvatar) associated craftmanship and fire. So some say Tauriel could never fall in love with a Dwarf, because of this difference in origin stories (Men, who are know to have had loves with Elves, are also Children of Eru). On the other hand - Aule lacked the power to to create beings fully endowed with intelligence, moral agency, and free will - Eru took pity on Aule's creations, the Dwarves, and infused them with these traits, making them, if you wil,l his adopted children. One could equally argue, then, that such a romance was made possible by this choice of Eru's (though no Tolkien Elf/Dwarf romance was ever written). For whatever reason, though, I always liked the idea of such a romance as a child.
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Smaug the iron
Gondor
Apr 3 2015, 12:41pm
Post #30 of 41
(851 views)
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Oin and Gloin in the book are responsible at making the fire. And in AUJ Thorin tell them to get a fire starting and gloin wanted to start a fire in the cave after the stonegaints
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Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 12:51pm
Post #31 of 41
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Although, it seems a much younger Galadriel was rather famous for her physical feats (wasn't she?), so maybe Tauriel as a warrior isn't so odd. Does the gender-roles apply to the Silvan elves as well? Tauriel is of a different race than many of the elves we've met, so their traditions may be different. Also of note, Tauriel wasn't the only female warrior amongst the elves- female elf warrior background extras!
I have heard the extrapolation of the elves and dwarves having different valar makers precluding romance/mating. While the dwarves and elves having different makers is definitely canon, it is in fact pure extrapolation that they cannot mate/have romance. After all, the dwarves were at least modeled on the men and elves, so perhaps their physiology isn't too different. And Eru did in fact play some role in their making, so that must count for something. Also, if a maiar can mate with an elf, I think anything is possible!
And I've always been rather fond of the idea of an elf/dwarf pairing as well, since I first read LOTR. I actually thought Tauriel/Kili was handled well, up to a point, where they let Hollywood's worst tropes get the best of them. (A discussion for another thread!)
(This post was edited by marary on Apr 3 2015, 12:52pm)
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dormouse
Half-elven
Apr 3 2015, 1:18pm
Post #32 of 41
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Tauriel has a lot of the Silmarillion about her....
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She recalls the story of the Noldorin Aredhel, Turgon's sister. Aredhel goes with Turgon when he establishes the Hidden Kingdom of Gondolin but his isolationism there makes her restless, 'desiring ever the longer the more to ride again in the wide lands and to walk in the forests, as had been her wont in Valinor.' She persuades Turgon to let her leave and he gives her an escort, telling them to take her to their brother Fingon, but she becomes separated from them and eventually finds her way to the land of her cousins, the sons of Feanor.
In time she tires of being there too and goes off on long expeditions. She becomes lost in the enchanted wood of Nan Elmoth where the trees are so tall they block out the sun. She meets Eol, the Dark Elf, who lives alone in the wood and becomes his wife. He is said to have seen her in the distance and cast spells to draw her to him - he is rather sinister. On the other hand, she is 'not wholly unwilling' and is quite happy with Eol at first. The story describes them taking long walks together under the starlight and moonlight. They have a son, Maeglin, but in time Aredhel becomes restless again and longs for her own people - Eol hates the Noldor and won't allow her to see them. Maeglin - who has been brought up on stories of the Noldor - persuades Aredhel to escape with him to Gondolin one day when Eol is away. They do, but he follows, is captured by Turgon and will not accept the King's demand that he should remain in Gondolin. He prefers death - for himself and his son - but as he throws his spear at Maeglin Aredhel gets in the way. It's poisoned and she dies.
So the story plays out very differently, but there is a lot of Aredhel in Tauriel. Her restlesstness for a start - that longing for the wider world. The love of forests and of walking under the stars. Both of them are very tough and capable. And although Tolkien never gave us an elf falling in love with a dwarf, Aredhel is as close as it gets, because Eol is like no other elf. He avoids other elves and is very friendly with the dwarves, often staying in their halls, and he learns metalwork from them. There are quite a few parallels there - as there are between Thranduil in the film and Turgon.
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Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 1:27pm
Post #33 of 41
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For enlightening me! That does seem to be quite a few similarities.
I wonder if Kili's runestone might stand in for Eol's spell, somewhat, if that is from where they drew inspiration. A powerful spell lies upon it... Hm. :) Although in truth, there is very little sinister about Kili.
But Tolkien did give us a dwarf falling in love with an elf (Gimli). So perhaps it's not such a stretch for Jackson to give us an elf (very reluctantly, I might add) falling in love with a dwarf, methinks.
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Smaug the iron
Gondor
Apr 3 2015, 1:57pm
Post #34 of 41
(825 views)
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Having the song sang by the people of laktown in the book to a prophecy in the film.
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Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 2:49pm
Post #35 of 41
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The book version was funnier though, because the Lake-town people get all up in a tizzy and expect the water to turn into gold once Thorin shows up. The film version is very foreboding.
Another I just thought of: I don't think it's mentioned that Thrain's finger was cut when the ring of power was taken from him, but it was in DOS EE. While (I think) not lifted from Tolkien, it's certainly very "traditional" to lose one's finger along with a ring of power.
Also, Kili and Tauriel falling love very quickly is a bit jarring... until you realize how Tolkien-eque it actually is. Tolkien was a big fan of everlasting love at first time.
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Bombadil
Half-elven
Apr 3 2015, 3:57pm
Post #36 of 41
(798 views)
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Bom has read about half of LOTR this week. {Favorite chapters}
pg. 418 "The Riders of Rohan" in TTT.
"Aragorn walked behind him, grim and silent,
stooping now and again to scan some print or mark
upon the Ground.
Legolas still stepped as lightly as ever,
his feet hardly seemed to press the grass,
leaving NO FOOTPRINTS as he passed..."
{Emphasis mine}
Bom often thinks some object to Legolas in TH
since, other than the White Council members
he is the Only Principle Actor who came back.
SOME can't seem
to separate Orlando Bloom from an Immortal Elf,
who has
Super-Sight,
Super-Hearing,
Super-Fast Reflexes &
Hardly weighs anything at all.?
Tough job, & some audiences are often HARD to please.
www.charlie-art.biz
"What Your Mind can conceive... charlie can achieve"
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marary
Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 4:04pm
Post #37 of 41
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If Legolas can walk atop the blades of grass without bending them... then perhaps... just perhaps Legolas on the falling rocks is plausible in Tolkien's universe!
Another funny one related to our younger dwarves' beards, or lack thereof, during the spider bit in Mirkwood.
Somehow or other Fili was got on to the branch, and then he did his best to help the hobbit, although he was feeling very sick and ill from spiderpoison, and from hanging most of the night and the next day wound round and round with only his nose to breathe through. It took him ages to get the beastly stuff out of his eyes and eyebrows, and as for his beard, he had to cut most of it off.
Ladies and gentlemen, we have canonical beardlessness for one of the brothers! Woot! (It's a stretch, but I'm still loving this one.)
(This post was edited by marary on Apr 3 2015, 4:07pm)
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AshNazg
Gondor
Apr 3 2015, 4:06pm
Post #38 of 41
(791 views)
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Also, Gollum paddles his boat without making a ripple...
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...Therefore Gollum should be able to do crazy, floating, unnecessary back-flips and take down huge monsters too! *logic*
(This post was edited by AshNazg on Apr 3 2015, 4:07pm)
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Bombadil
Half-elven
Apr 3 2015, 4:08pm
Post #39 of 41
(780 views)
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Oin will get it Goin,... Gloin will get it Glowing"
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www.charlie-art.biz
"What Your Mind can conceive... charlie can achieve"
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Lorien
Apr 3 2015, 4:27pm
Post #40 of 41
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Oin seemed rather appreciative of Tauriel's "glowing"
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Bombadil
Half-elven
Apr 4 2015, 12:38am
Post #41 of 41
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PJ has the Rights & "The Right" to...use
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JRRT's Book as a Starting POINT
& bom for ONE?
is Fine about how
HE gave us, ALL Worldwide " Somethingie"
Quite Unexpected...
bom does not believe any Changes were to
Disrespect
our Professor.
Some would agree that there were lots of Improvements.
AND when PJ got it RIGHT {Canon} he came OUT with his
GUNS... a BLAZING..!
Bom Thinks JRRT is likely a
Fan of PJ!
PUT that Beorn BEE in your Bonnet?
{All rights to this Post are reserved as "OPINION only}
www.charlie-art.biz
"What Your Mind can conceive... charlie can achieve"
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Heh...
[
