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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Two Hobbit Movies: skip AUJ and start with DOS?
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Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Feb 17 2015, 8:21pm

Post #26 of 43 (610 views)
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Weathertop [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
And when did they go to Weathertop? They went to Trollshaws, which is near some breathtaking cliffs in Pio Pio (I've been studying this, as I plan to go on my own ME adventure late this year or early next - fingers crossed!), also walked near a glacier and over the "rock and pillar range," neither of which were in the LOTR movies. And that waterfall they walked under in Earnslaw Burn, I MUST do that someday!!! I probably can't help you with the alleged protagonist shifting, but go back and look for those scenes, they're really amazing!



The Company would have passed by Weathertop on the Great East Road several days out from the Forsaken Inn (itself a day's travel from Bree). However, it was Azog and his Hunters that we actually saw there.

"At the end of the journey, all men think that their youth was Arcadia..." - Phantom F. Harlock


CathrineB
Rohan


Feb 17 2015, 10:07pm

Post #27 of 43 (602 views)
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Weird question [In reply to] Can't Post

AUJ is the best movie in my opinion, surperior to DoS in many ways. I think many has been able to enjoy the first movie better after seeing all the movies.


AshNazg
Gondor


Feb 17 2015, 10:19pm

Post #28 of 43 (603 views)
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Yup [In reply to] Can't Post

Replace Smaug's weird action set-piece at the end of DoS with Smaug's death and the journey home. Pretend the battle never happened and it'd be a winner! Tongue


AshNazg
Gondor


Feb 17 2015, 10:22pm

Post #29 of 43 (611 views)
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Oh and to explain Thorin's absence in LotR... [In reply to] Can't Post

...When Bilbo hears the knock at the door at the end we hear Gandalf say "Thorin's dead" and Bilbo reply "Thorin's what?!" *cut to black* **roll credits** ~...I saw the light fade from the sky...~


(This post was edited by AshNazg on Feb 17 2015, 10:25pm)


Dwarewien
Rohan


Feb 17 2015, 11:34pm

Post #30 of 43 (600 views)
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Skip the prologue? Are you mad? [In reply to] Can't Post

Of course, there's a lot more to like about AUJ than the prologue, but you need that back story to understand what the dwarves are fighting for. I just re-watched the TE of AUJ yesterday (actually, it was more like this morning, since I watch my DVDs well after midnight), and I've forgotten how fun it is! I wanted to watch it again anyway, since my back story is set during the prologue, and I wasn't sure if I got some of Thorin's dialogue right. This was the line I messed up on: "Balin! Sound the alarm! Call out the guard! Do it now!" I left out the "Call out the guard!" part (I was close). The only part I don't like is when Thorin nearly gets killed at the end, since that still makes me cry, even though I know that Thorin's not really dead, but I don't even like him getting hurt, let alone killed (since that's even worse). I may have to watch all three Hobbit movies again, to see which order I really prefer them in, since I don't think BoFA should be on top (because of what happens to Thorin). Maybe I should list them in this order: DoS, AUJ, BoFA (but not because I hate it, it's just too emotionally draining to list as my favorite of the three).Smile


"Will you follow me... one last time?"


Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor


Feb 18 2015, 2:29am

Post #31 of 43 (559 views)
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Oh, that explains it [In reply to] Can't Post

I usually fast-forward through that scene, too.

Why yes, I DO look like Anna Friel!


Avandel
Half-elven


Feb 18 2015, 2:46am

Post #32 of 43 (563 views)
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No [In reply to] Can't Post

Why wouldn't I want to spend as much time in Middle Earth (at least PJ's version) as I possibly could? - for one thing. Far as I am concerned these films are too short and we needed one more.

What's the hurry? Tho you mention boredom, but yah know, you could splice some clips together and in theory see "everything" in 30 minutes or so. Unsure
Like a Cliff notes version of the movies.Unimpressed


Hanzkaz
Rohan

Feb 18 2015, 8:26am

Post #33 of 43 (541 views)
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I'd hate to lose AUJ - [In reply to] Can't Post

 For myself it represents my original introduction to Middle-Earth, back when I first read the Hobbit, decades ago.



From the makers of 'The Lord of the Rings' comes the sequel to Peter Jackson's Hobbit Trilogy -
'The War in the North, Part I : The Sword in the Tomb'.



Ilmatar
Rohan


Feb 18 2015, 8:45am

Post #34 of 43 (531 views)
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No I couldn't [In reply to] Can't Post

I just re-watched AUJ last night and am completely baffled by this question:


Quote
do we really need AUJ to enjoy the Quest for Erebor?


Yes, we do...! Shocked

I echo those who have already said that - to most of us, it seems - it's not about visiting new places, it's about getting to know the characters, setting the scene for the quest, enjoying some quiet moments before the hectic action and darkening times that to some extent prevail, in comparison, in the latter films - it's about the heart of the story that shines through in the AUJ.

Luckily we can choose whether to see a film or not. :)




(This post was edited by Ilmatar on Feb 18 2015, 8:51am)


dormouse
Half-elven


Feb 18 2015, 9:11am

Post #35 of 43 (539 views)
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Do you really fast-forward? [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry, but I'm seeing so many references, in this and other threads, to people routinely skip scenes when they watch the films and it's really intriguing me. Not that I think it's wrong, or anything; just that it seems so strange to me. It's never occurred to me to do that. For sure, there are occasional moments I don't particularly care for but if I'm watching I watch. I couldn't lost myself in the story if I had my finger on the fast-forward all the time - it would break the magic. The only time I've ever skipped bits is if I'm not watching the whole thing but searching for a particular scene.

So now I'm really curious about the way other people engage with the films. Whole thing? Or just selected scenes?


mae govannen
Tol Eressea


Feb 18 2015, 10:17am

Post #36 of 43 (512 views)
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Seconded. Thank you, dormouse! [In reply to] Can't Post

 

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


mae govannen
Tol Eressea


Feb 18 2015, 10:27am

Post #37 of 43 (517 views)
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Agree with you on all your points, Kim. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


Starling
Half-elven


Feb 18 2015, 5:23pm

Post #38 of 43 (493 views)
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I don't usually fast forward but rather disengage [In reply to] Can't Post

For example, I find most of the Treebeard scenes in the LOTR's pretty dull, so I will go and do something else while they are on, but leave the film rolling and listen out so that I can re-engage when those parts are finished. I have occasionally skipped whole scenes if I don't have enough time or just don't feel interested in certain parts. Last time I watched AUJ I skipped most of the middle chunk.
I'm pretty good at tuning in and tuning out - I do it all the time when the TV is on and I have lots to do.


Kirly
Lorien


Feb 19 2015, 2:52am

Post #39 of 43 (454 views)
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Absolutely not! It's my favorite of the three! /// [In reply to] Can't Post

 

My avatar photo is Lake Tekapo in New Zealand's South Island. Taken by me in 2004 on a Red Carpet Tours LOTR Movie Location Tour. 'Twas the Vacation of a Lifetime!

pictures taken while on the tour are here:
https://picasaweb.google.com/Kirly7/LOTRNewZealandTour#


Kilidoescartwheels
Valinor


Feb 19 2015, 3:54am

Post #40 of 43 (453 views)
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Yes I do [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Sorry, but I'm seeing so many references, in this and other threads, to people routinely skip scenes when they watch the films and it's really intriguing me. Not that I think it's wrong, or anything; just that it seems so strange to me. It's never occurred to me to do that. For sure, there are occasional moments I don't particularly care for but if I'm watching I watch. I couldn't lost myself in the story if I had my finger on the fast-forward all the time - it would break the magic. The only time I've ever skipped bits is if I'm not watching the whole thing but searching for a particular scene.

So now I'm really curious about the way other people engage with the films. Whole thing? Or just selected scenes?


To be honest, I fast-forward through the "boring" scenes, at least the scenes I find boring. AUJ is as close to a perfect movie as you can get, BUT I don't think the "Old Bilbo & Frodo" add much to the movie, or the "Azog kills one of his guys to prove how bad he is" scene, either. But I LOVE the extended edition for Bofur's table dance and the scene where Bilbo & Thorin overhear Gandalf & Elrond. About the only scene in DOS that I occasionally fast-forward through is the "Feast of Starlight" scene. It's weird, because I don't like the "healing" scene, but I never skip that one. I can't imagine that I would skip ANY of the scenes in BOTFA. It's just a personal preference, really. Just like the OP prefers to completely skip AUJ - no, I don't get it but different strokes for different folks.

Why yes, I DO look like Anna Friel!


mefansmum
Rivendell

Feb 19 2015, 5:21am

Post #41 of 43 (457 views)
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ditto and [In reply to] Can't Post

I would not miss the first 40 mins for anything.


Scorchster
Rivendell


Feb 20 2015, 9:44am

Post #42 of 43 (415 views)
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Confession: I fast forward too [In reply to] Can't Post

But only in TTT, when Treebeard's scenes cut into the battle of Helm's Deep. The tonal shift is always jarring, to me at least, and takes me out of the suspense in a bad way.

Never felt the urge to skip any Hobbit scene though.


Michelle Johnston
Rohan


Feb 20 2015, 4:08pm

Post #43 of 43 (409 views)
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The Effect of the Second Prologue [In reply to] Can't Post

One of the curious effects of the Prancing Pony and flash forward is it can encourage you to think exactly what has happened between Bree and them leaving the Carrock.

The answers are not straight forward. We have had 40 minutes of the most exquisitely crafted Hobbit Lore in the form of the Unexpected Party which feels like a pilot episode for a 24 part series and yet is meant to head, as it was filmed, a two part film totalling only just over 5 hours.

I watched Shakespeare In Love and Last of the Mohicans last week where the principals and story exposition was introduced in about 10 minutes. It is certainly unusual to film with exposition lasting a total of 110 minutes.

If you ask a film fan could you do without this they say no. If you ask the average film goer who sees the Hobbit Trilogy as another big film series to attend the answer can be different.

When PJ announced he was going two to three Richard Armitage said he thought it was so that more of the film ended up at the cinema than in the E.E.'s if that is right it is certainly true there is more economic ways of establishing character and exposition than to take about 80 minutes (the net time to the end of the White Council).

The other difficulty with AUJ, which is probably the film I enjoy the most, is there is a good deal of investment in characters where the pay off is either negligible or exceptionally small taken over the next 8 hours

Gloin,Oin,Dori, Nori, Ori, Bifur and even Fili.

or erratic

Radagast

or just short of being a cameo

Saruman
Galdariel
Elrond
The Nine

and in between a long section with the trolls which gives you Sting and a couple of swords which are inconsequential.

If you look at the BOFA apart from Bilbo/Thorin/Gandalf/Azog and to lesser extent Kili and possibly Balin and Dwalin the investment in character is made in DOS.

Tauriel/Kili
Legolas/Bolg
Thranduil/Legolas/Tauriel
Alfrid/Bard and the children.
The Lake Towners
and not forgetting a certain worm.

The only two that really survive the 8 hours are :-

Bilbo/Thorin
Bilbo/Gandalf and if you think of it in those terms
Azog/ Thorin

That is why we all love those last few moments of the film as Thorin dies in the same way we love the first 40 minutes. We really have been on a journey with Bilbo and Thorin and it is why what happens in between can seem optional depending on how you view the quality of the water you are drinking from the well. Personally I like films which have a creative tension and are just the right side of economy so they leave you wanting more where the point is made fully and clearly and you then move on like Gollum and the Master and the Goblin King up to the blast from G. PJ has a habit in the Hobbit of making unimportant points over and over again at the expense of explaining and linking the story in a glorious logical whole.

My Dear Bilbo something is the matter with you! you are not the same hobbit that you were.

(This post was edited by Michelle Johnston on Feb 20 2015, 4:19pm)

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