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PJ's open to film more Tolkien/M-E movies in two-three years time, according to Variety
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DigificWriter
Lorien

Dec 19 2014, 7:47am

Post #26 of 46 (1251 views)
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My question has gone unanswered [In reply to] Can't Post

Is anybody going to answer my question about whether we know anything concrete about exactly what was planned for the "bridge film" that was originally going to be a follow-up to The Hobbit?


Aunt Dora Baggins
Immortal


Dec 19 2014, 8:29am

Post #27 of 46 (1237 views)
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I can always count on you to make me chuckle :-D // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"A Chance Meeting at Rivendell" and other stories

leleni at hotmail dot com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Dec 19 2014, 9:25am

Post #28 of 46 (1253 views)
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Nothing concrete [In reply to] Can't Post

that I can recall, anyway. I thought that probably the White Council stuff would have been part of it - so I'm thinking that the 3 Hobbit films may have incorporated a lot of the original bridge material. But now they've left themselves an opening for the Aragorn and Legolas adventures, so who knows?

Silverlode



Want a LOTR Anniversary footer of your own? Get one here!

"Dark is the water of Kheled-zâram, and cold are the springs of Kibil-nâla, and fair were the many-pillared halls of Khazad-dűm in Elder Days before the fall of mighty kings beneath the stone."



Brethil
Half-elven


Dec 19 2014, 11:49pm

Post #29 of 46 (1218 views)
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That would be amazing! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

Quote
Understood with affection and respect m'dear!


Unless a group from TORn made it, of course! Then I know it would be in good hands. I reckon we could make a pretty good job of it. Wink


Talent and heart to spare in this bunch.








imin
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 12:09pm

Post #30 of 46 (1206 views)
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It is bad [In reply to] Can't Post

It is bad because the adaptation of the hobbit movies has been on average not very good - and got worse as the movies were released.

Can you imagine how badly The Sil would be treated?

For me there are some things best left to ones imagination and don't need to be made into movies.

I also do feel they have an effect on Tolkien's works as most people watch movies than read books so it would become the main image for Tolkien's work. If you like that then good for you, but the idea to me is very disheartening and i hope they just leave it alone now.

As for C. Tolkien, best just to say, you don't get it.

All posts are to be taken as my opinion.


imin
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 12:10pm

Post #31 of 46 (1209 views)
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This is how i feel [In reply to] Can't Post

Apart from any additional third age movie, lol.

All posts are to be taken as my opinion.


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 1:45pm

Post #32 of 46 (1198 views)
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What is it I don't get about CT? // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


Magpie
Immortal


Dec 20 2014, 3:16pm

Post #33 of 46 (1211 views)
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perhaps... [In reply to] Can't Post

...that you don't properly understand his motivation to protect his father's legacy and his right to do so.

I am ready to be shown a particular incident/quote where you can accuse Christopher Tolkien of exhibiting bad manners, trash talking, bashing or bad mouthing.

I suspect his standing firm on not selling the rights to his father's works and his expressing dislike of the movies has been interpreted by you to be those things but I don't think the act of doing either is necessarily trash talking or bad manners.

But it you want to point me to a statement CT has made that you think is the essence of 'trash talking' then I will be open to convincing.

I have to say when I read those accusations, I shook my head in disappointment. Agree with him or not, he deserves better treatment and respect than many fans of the movies give him. He deserves it because of his position and he deserves it because all people deserve better.

It's good manners on our part to learn how to disagree with him without denigrating him.

And for what it's worth, the relationship the Martin and Rowling have with those making movie/tv versions of their works is *completely* different than any relationship that CT has with Jackson and/or any potential future filmmakers. I contend the difference in attitude between those three authors isn't due at in any way to either a surfeit or a lack of manners.


LOTR soundtrack website ~ magpie avatar gallery
TORn History Mathom-house ~ Torn Image Posting Guide

(This post was edited by Magpie on Dec 20 2014, 3:18pm)


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 7:17pm

Post #34 of 46 (1192 views)
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I am aware that my thoughts are controversial... [In reply to] Can't Post

And it is not my intention to somehow offend anyone with it - I wanted to speak my mind.

What I consider "bad manners" is not at all his stance on selling/not selling his father's works - it's his comments that to me reeks of a high-horse mentality (the Le Monde interview) and plain inaccurate when he suggests that these movies are for 15-25 year-olds only. I find it offensive and ignorant, and a slap in the face towards elderly fans of the LOTR movies.


I have the utmost respect for the idea to protect his father's work and I get that he thinks that all of them are unfilmable, but I don't think that gives him the rights to talk like that. Just my thoughts. Smile

The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


DigificWriter
Lorien

Dec 20 2014, 7:24pm

Post #35 of 46 (1189 views)
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Christopher Tolkien's opinions are his alone.... [In reply to] Can't Post

.... and he's welcome to them. However, he doesn't do himself any favors by expressing those opinions in the fashion that he has, and it's not out of the question for people who don't like the tone he used in conveying said opinions to express their distaste with said tone.


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 7:29pm

Post #36 of 46 (1171 views)
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Thank you [In reply to] Can't Post

You captured the essence of what my gripe with his comments in Le Monde are all about.

The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 7:41pm

Post #37 of 46 (1176 views)
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Another thought [In reply to] Can't Post

You are right about my choice of words - "trashtalking" is a poor choice of words and I take that back. What I wanted to do is to put his comments into contrast with other authors, like George RR Martin. Yes, circumstances are not the same, but I do think they are comparable at some level. For instance, If I was to make an educated guess, GRRM is probably horrified with some of the choices the HBO production has made, but he doesn't speak out about it. I think this shows restraint and a classy attitude, which in my very humble opinion, Christopher Tolkien lacks.

The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


Gianna
Rohan


Dec 20 2014, 7:48pm

Post #38 of 46 (1177 views)
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I agree completely. [In reply to] Can't Post

The Silmarillion is simply not a filmable book. I realize Tolkien thought that about LOTR and yet PJ made a fine film of it - but TS is much different! It would be utterly impossible to do a good Ainulindalë; it would be near impossible to replicate a song of such beauty that it could put Morgoth himself to sleep (although I would enjoy seeing a Beren and Luthien film). The Silmarils - exceedingly difficult as well (the filmmakers did a good job on the Arkenstone though).

And Huan, a talking hound, would be difficult to do in a way that was not ridiculous. The Narnia films portrayed Aslan pretty well, but a lot of the other talking animals didn't work quite as nicely.

I would be more open to a bridge movie than a Silmarillion one.

~There's some good left in this world. And it's worth fighting for.~


DigificWriter
Lorien

Dec 20 2014, 7:52pm

Post #39 of 46 (1168 views)
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I'd say you're wrong [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
If I was to make an educated guess, GRRM is probably horrified with some of the choices the HBO production has made, but he doesn't speak out about it. I think this shows restraint and a classy attitude, which in my very humble opinion, Christopher Tolkien lacks.


Given that Martin is not only expressly credited as a consultant and producer for the GoT series, but has also written for it, I would unequivocally say that you're wrong about him having objections to the ways in which his novels have been adapted filmicly.


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 8:00pm

Post #40 of 46 (1173 views)
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Of course, this is just guessing, but [In reply to] Can't Post

I see it as very likely that has major issues with the way some storylines are handled - the book fans certainly do.

Yes, he has written one episode per season (but not from now on he won't) and as this series is 10x less faithful to the source material than The Hobbit movies by now, I'm willing to bet he has issues with it like any author would.

The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


malickfan
Gondor


Dec 20 2014, 8:02pm

Post #41 of 46 (1171 views)
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My main objection to A Silmarillion film personally... [In reply to] Can't Post

(excluding the tonal, scale, religious, budgetary, popularity, creative control a director would expect, copyright and lack of dialogue problems Wink)...is which version of the tales would you adapt?

By his own admission Christopher Tolkien regrets aspects of the published 'Sil', any potential film of the legends of the first age would face the issue of which story to base it on (by the time it is likely to happen I feel sure the relevant HOME volumes would be sold), would you use the scanty details of the Beren and Luthien chapter in the book, or the extensive 'Lay of Leithian'?.

Some elements of the fanbase have a hard enough time arguing which aspects of the book are canon, just think of the drastic changes and inventions a film would have to make....








(This post was edited by malickfan on Dec 20 2014, 8:03pm)


Magpie
Immortal


Dec 20 2014, 8:10pm

Post #42 of 46 (1170 views)
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Rowling and Martin are in a business arrangement with the filmmakers [In reply to] Can't Post

(using filmmaker to encompass tv)

They made a recent and current decision to sell their rights and they are actively working with the people (Martin, perhaps more than Rowling but Rowling is still cranking them out) they sold their rights to.

One: the fact that their decision was made recently and by them means that good rapport is more likely to still exist.

Two: they hope to continue relations which means they are highly motivated to work with these people and not piss them off.

These two things are not relevant to CT at all.

He didn't sell the rights (his father did) and they were sold years ago. He may be second guessing that decision now to the utmost. What you decide is a good deal in year one may not feel like a good deal in year 25 and I wager you'd feel some right to express a different opinion on the matter 25 years late.

And, he's not actively hoping to have a continued relationship with any filmmaker so there is no need to mince his words or express discontent behind closed doors.

In fact, if Martin and/or Rowling wanted to express discontentment with a direction, they would use their current relationship to the filmmakers to do so. And the filmmakers, who are making a ton of money would have motivation to listen. It would clearly be to the benefit of both to keep such talks behind closed doors.

There is no relationship between CT and the LOTR/TH movie/merchandising franchise. If he has discontent, they don't care one bit and aren't going to listen. He has no choice but to express his discontent publicly.

And I would wager that the filmmakers (et al) working with Rowling and Martin haven't tried to cook the books to cheat them of money. They have tried to cheat the Tolkien estate. Why would anyone want to 'talk nice' to the people they had to take to court to get them to play fair.

In my mind, there's a difference between being a snarky $%* and someone who speaks their mind and speaks it frankly. CT has an opinion and he speaks it frankly. I don't find that offensive or rude or nasty or anything.

I'm often a bit surprised at the emotionally charged backlash toward him to some extent because that sort of thing is often applied most often to women in positions of power who speak their mind and risk being called classless or rude.

However, I totally get that the people who choose to move beyond disagreement with CT to denigration towards CT think they're entitled to do so. And that they aren't going to be convinced otherwise. So I (and people like me) are faced with the choice of either just letting all this stuff get put out there with no counteropinion... or get into a non-productive discussion.

We're at that point right now. I just am disappointed that Tolkien fans would use what often sounds like the language of orcs to talk about the son of Tolkien. We need to choose class ourselves and show some respect.

But I'm old. This may be the opinion of a generation dying out.

We agree and get along on a lot of things, macfalk, but this matter of how we speak about CT isn't one of them.

peace out. walking away now.


LOTR soundtrack website ~ magpie avatar gallery
TORn History Mathom-house ~ Torn Image Posting Guide


DigificWriter
Lorien

Dec 20 2014, 8:15pm

Post #43 of 46 (1157 views)
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Re: Of course, this is just guessing, but [In reply to] Can't Post

I still think you're wrong about Martin and how he feels about the way that HBO has adapted his novels, but we can agree to disagree on this.

BTW, the reason I believe he may not be actively writing for the GoT series going forward is because he needs to dedicate his time to finishing the novel series upon which it is based, which is something HBO execs and producers have been politely asking him to do.


cats16
Half-elven


Dec 20 2014, 8:22pm

Post #44 of 46 (1161 views)
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I'm of the Kubrickian mind... [In reply to] Can't Post

And hold onto the idea that, "If it can be thought, it can be filmed." And I don't mean that lightly, at all.

As an artist and filmmaker, that's the mindset I carry when conceptualizing anything. I have to! Sure, people might not like it, think it's good, or even something to be compared to Tolkien at all (think of people with the Hobbit/LotR films over the years). But that doesn't mean that any chance of adaptation should be thrown into the Void with Morgoth, does it?

If anything, someone telling me that 'xxxxx' cannot be done on screen provides *more* incentive for doing it

I understand the sensitivity fans have for cherished works, and the worry that comes along with something not being doing the way we hoped for. I've worried plenty of times the past several years about what might happen.

Yet, I am infinitely more worried by the idea of refusing to open a door, before a stranger comes knocking.


(I'm aware this is all opinion, so I hope I did not come across as snide or high-horsed in my response. Smile)



Join us every weekend in the Hobbit movie forum for this week's CHOW (Chapter of the Week) discussion!




(This post was edited by cats16 on Dec 20 2014, 8:23pm)


macfalk
Valinor


Dec 20 2014, 8:26pm

Post #45 of 46 (1165 views)
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A final reply [In reply to] Can't Post

He didn't sell the rights (his father did) and they were sold years ago. He may be second guessing that decision now to the utmost. What you decide is a good deal in year one may not feel like a good deal in year 25 and I wager you'd feel some right to express a different opinion on the matter 25 years late.

From my point of view, the decision is not his to second guess because his father made the decision, not him.


"We're at that point right now. I just am disappointed that Tolkien fans would use what often sounds like the language of orcs to talk about the son of Tolkien. We need to choose class ourselves and show some respect."

You are right and as I said I regret using such poor choice of words. My opinion still stands, but I wish I had expressed it in a less brutish fashion. I'm sorry for upsetting you.


The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.

(This post was edited by macfalk on Dec 20 2014, 8:29pm)


demnation
Rohan

Dec 21 2014, 11:04am

Post #46 of 46 (1168 views)
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Well, I can't give you concrete sources but my understanding [In reply to] Can't Post

is that Del Toro intended to incorporate some appendix ideas like the adventures of Aragorn during his youth and the Dol Guldur/White Council stuff that eventually made it into The Hobbit films. But basically any of the major events between The Hobbit and Lotr, as stated in the appendices of LOTR. But I also understand that the idea of the bridge film was abandoned fairly early, even when Del Toro was still the director. But I could be wrong. And I'm sure that wasn't very helpful but I tried lol.

"It is not our part to master all the tides of the world, but to do what is in us for the succour of those years wherein we are set, uprooting the evil in the fields that we know, so that those who live after may have clean earth to till. What weather they shall have is not ours to rule." Gandalf, "The Last Debate."

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